Fatalities Discussion

[Antman]

And another at Rochester station last night although it isn't clear if that was a suicide attempt or an accident, the person survived albeit with serious injuries.

 

[trainophile]

More men commit suicide than women - the statistics collected by the Samaritans for 2012 can be found here: http://www.samaritans.org/sites/def...Samaritans Suicide Statistics Report 2014.pdf

Males: 4590
Females: 1391

Possibly because more women are responsible (as in day-to-day care) for children? Doesn't explain the Slough tragedy, but in general...

Also (this is a sweeping generalisation I know), many women have a close support network of friends, whereas a lot of men are pretty much loners.

 

[user15681]

And another at Rochester station last night although it isn't clear if that was a suicide attempt or an accident, the person survived albeit with serious injuries.

I'm told an accident.

 

[GatwickDepress]

Possibly because more women are responsible (as in day-to-day care) for children? Doesn't explain the Slough tragedy, but in general...

Also (this is a sweeping generalisation I know), many women have a close support network of friends, whereas a lot of men are pretty much loners.

More women have depression and women attempt suicide at a substantially higher rate than do men, but more men succeed in ending their lives.

The Samaritans found that middle-aged men of low socioeconomic status to be the most likely to commit suicide and theorised that it could be down to the masculine ideal that men are supposed to be breadwinners of the household, in a relationship, and be in a stable job-for-life. To those people who are now entering or in middle age, it can be difficult to adjust to not have lived up to that ideal or to cope with societal changes.

A higher percentage of women see mental health professionals too. It'd be interesting to have a male-focused campaign challenging the stigma that can surround mental health issues.

 

[quarella]

More women have depression and women attempt suicide at a substantially higher rate than do men, but more men succeed in ending their lives.

The Samaritans found that middle-aged men of low socioeconomic status to be the most likely to commit suicide and theorised that it could be down to the masculine ideal that men are supposed to be breadwinners of the household, in a relationship, and be in a stable job-for-life. To those people who are now entering or in middle age, it can be difficult to adjust to not have lived up to that ideal or to cope with societal changes.

A higher percentage of women see mental health professionals too. It'd be interesting to have a male-focused campaign challenging the stigma that can surround mental health issues.

Someone I know involved in mental health said men are more likely to just go and do it while women will make sure someone knows that is what they intend to do suggesting they want to be stopped.

 

[Robertj21a]

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Can I just say that it's a pleasure to read sensible, informed, comment on such a difficult subject. Long may it continue.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Being male gives you a point on the SADPERSONS score, as does being single, widowed or divorced.

 

[455driver]

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Can I just say that it's a pleasure to read sensible, informed, comment on such a difficult subject. Long may it continue.

Ah you are an optimist!

I do agree with you though.

 

[Antman]

Sadly reports on twitter of yet another person hit by a train between Alnmouth and Morpeth

 

[thenorthern]

I have noticed the amount of Samaritans numbers at stations is increasing rapidly and there are some at Level Crossings. The sad thing is most people who are intending to commit suicide probably aren't able to notice them because of their distress.

 

[Rich McLean]

Sadly reports on twitter of yet another person hit by a train between Alnmouth and Morpeth

1S55 1425 Plymouth Edinburgh seems to be the train involved. No idea on which unit number.

Thoughts are with all those involved

 

[Hyphen]

I have noticed the amount of Samaritans numbers at stations is increasing rapidly and there are some at Level Crossings. The sad thing is most people who are intending to commit suicide probably aren't able to notice them because of their distress.

But if it saves even one life, isn't that worth something? I think from comments previous we've concluded that the industry isn't able to stop every single one of these incidents - but if even one person is encouraged to give Samaritans a ring, aren't they worth the time and effort taken to put up?

If you wanted to look only financially at this and ignore all other factors, I'm sure the signs saving even a single life would save more in delay minutes paid to TOCs than the cost of erecting them across the network (even if that was difficult to quantify).

I certainly wouldn't be so quick to write off the concept.

 

[thenorthern]

But if it saves even one life, isn't that worth something? I think from comments previous we've concluded that the industry isn't able to stop every single one of these incidents - but if even one person is encouraged to give Samaritans a ring, aren't they worth the time and effort taken to put up?

If you wanted to look only financially at this and ignore all other factors, I'm sure the signs saving even a single life would save more in delay minutes paid to TOCs than the cost of erecting them across the network (even if that was difficult to quantify).

I certainly wouldn't be so quick to write off the concept.

I still think they are a good idea, I have noticed them on the train a couple of times, they are valuable and even if they only save 1 life then they are working.

 

[ReverendFozz]

Very good points. It's always worth bearing in mind that if someone is willing to take their life, overriding every survival mechanism we have, then they aren't thinking rationally. People who commit suicide are often described as "selfish", which I feel is very unfair as it's attempting to apply a normal mental framework to someone who isn't thinking rationally]/b].

Suicide is a very selfish act, I speak from the experience of several suicide attempts myself, I admit myself to being quite selfish in the past, I would have a handful of pills in my hand and be thinking 'I dont need this ****, f**k everyone' most of my attempts were genuinely a cry for help while accepting at the same time if I die, then so be it, that to me is very selfish. The man I witnessed dying at Kings Cross was selfish, while he may not have been thinking straight, it was selfish of him to make people witness it, it had a bad effect on me too, it just added to the problems I was going through at the time and I only started talking about it a few years ago when I came close to a full blown mental breakdown.

I am in a better place today, I was diagnosed bi-polar and a personality disorder and one of my school teachers and a psychiatrist thought I was borderline psychotic as a teenager.

I personally think raising awareness around suicide, especially in men needs to be done, as has been pointed out in recent years we have high profile men take there lives (Robert Enke and Gary Speed) and more recently Robin Williams...

If what I have posted is ****e, then I apologise, just saying whats on my mind

 

[Antman]

Suicide is a very selfish act, I speak from the experience of several suicide attempts myself, I admit myself to being quite selfish in the past, I would have a handful of pills in my hand and be thinking 'I dont need this ****, f**k everyone' most of my attempts were genuinely a cry for help while accepting at the same time if I die, then so be it, that to me is very selfish. The man I witnessed dying at Kings Cross was selfish, while he may not have been thinking straight, it was selfish of him to make people witness it, it had a bad effect on me too, it just added to the problems I was going through at the time and I only started talking about it a few years ago when I came close to a full blown mental breakdown.

I am in a better place today, I was diagnosed bi-polar and a personality disorder and one of my school teachers and a psychiatrist thought I was borderline psychotic as a teenager.

I personally think raising awareness around suicide, especially in men needs to be done, as has been pointed out in recent years we have high profile men take there lives (Robert Enke and Gary Speed) and more recently Robin Williams...

If what I have posted is ****e, then I apologise, just saying whats on my mind

I don't think there is any need to apologise, the more people speak openly about it the better

 

[PHILIPE]

It might appear to be a selfish act but the frame of mind is the main factor.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Another between Swansea and Llanelli today.

Female age unknown on outskirts of Swansea. Foul play not suspected.

 

[Robertj21a]

Suicide is a very selfish act, I speak from the experience of several suicide attempts myself, I admit myself to being quite selfish in the past, I would have a handful of pills in my hand and be thinking 'I dont need this ****, f**k everyone' most of my attempts were genuinely a cry for help while accepting at the same time if I die, then so be it, that to me is very selfish. The man I witnessed dying at Kings Cross was selfish, while he may not have been thinking straight, it was selfish of him to make people witness it, it had a bad effect on me too, it just added to the problems I was going through at the time and I only started talking about it a few years ago when I came close to a full blown mental breakdown.

I am in a better place today, I was diagnosed bi-polar and a personality disorder and one of my school teachers and a psychiatrist thought I was borderline psychotic as a teenager.

I personally think raising awareness around suicide, especially in men needs to be done, as has been pointed out in recent years we have high profile men take there lives (Robert Enke and Gary Speed) and more recently Robin Williams...

If what I have posted is ****e, then I apologise, just saying whats on my mind

Good to read your honest thoughts. I quite agree that better awareness is necessary, particularly how it affects men. As I said earlier, it's good to see such sensible comment on this forum.

 

[ReverendFozz]

I don't think there is any need to apologise, the more people speak openly about it the better

I am really up for talking about it and more awareness into serious depression, especially in males, I never talked about it for years, people knew I was depressed and knew I was suicidal, but would never bring it up

When I started to open up, I described my depression as being my emotional Berlin Wall, my barrier was not necessarily there to stop people trying tp get in, but fought hard to stop things getting out.

As a teenager, I never thought about jumping in front of a train as I was of the belief that knowing me as I do I would somehow end up surviving, the nearest I came to a railway like when feeling suicidal was sitting on the edge of Durham Viaduct hoping a train would come through at high speed and blow me over, luckily local Plod and BTP talked me down, I have never thought of using the railway to die since my 18th Birthday, it hit home big time when I lost an acquaintance who used the ECML just West of Durham and when it was described what a mess it and how many bits of him where miles away I was physically sick.

As for is it selfish or not, I stand by my opinion and will add it is spiteful as well, I have been known to say things like 'I'll show you, you *******' or 'just wait and see what happens'...Luckily I managed to get over the suicidal thoughts, still feel suicidal at times, I find hard to know when I am really down because I was able to put am Oscar winning performance to convince people I was ok, but I good people around me who can tell when things are not right

As for prevention, I don't know what can be done, it is hard to help someone who cant help themselves, would something like having some of the Samaritans or an organisation lime Mind based in/or near the biggest stations on the network, or put Platform Staff through Counselling Qualifications and have a designated member of staff who has the right qualifications, like the designated first aider.

It will never be eradicated completely, when 1 method is stopped people will find another way...

 

[Antman]

Sadly two separate incidents in Kent last night, one at Chartham and one at Gravesend, I've never known anything like it.

 

[ExRes]

A sad but interesting article on the BBC news today

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-29512910

It seems to me that many people wish to hold the entire question of the NHS and its funding to task and accuse it of being responsible for suicides involving mental health issues, this just shows that the private sector is either no better or, at the very least, makes the same mistakes

 

[Stonesourscotty]

I was on a Sydney Trains service from Homebush after the rugby on Sunday and they announced a suicide over the tannoy and the potential delays for a bunch of ecstatic fans it really "killed" the celebratory feel aboard the train was a very amateur display from the company but suicides appear more common here on the railways so I don't know

 

[thelongestroad]

I was on a Sydney Trains service from Homebush after the rugby on Sunday and they announced a suicide over the tannoy and the potential delays for a bunch of ecstatic fans it really "killed" the celebratory feel aboard the train was a very amateur display from the company but suicides appear more common here on the railways so I don't know

Amatuer? In these situations we want people to shut up and sit down so we can deal with the problem. Not pacing up and down the train asking us what the delay is because we've been vague about it.

 

[ExRes]

I was on a Sydney Trains service from Homebush after the rugby on Sunday and they announced a suicide over the tannoy and the potential delays for a bunch of ecstatic fans it really "killed" the celebratory feel aboard the train was a very amateur display from the company but suicides appear more common here on the railways so I don't know

I've never seen those sort of announcements as an amateur display, why shouldn't people be told the truth ?, if everything is at a stand due to a fatality then call it a fatality, who knows, maybe there's someone on the train that's been toying with the idea themselves and may then have a serious rethink, as for the 'celebratory feel', is a rugby match more important than someones life ? if it is then we're all in deep trouble

 

[Johnnie2Sheds]

Dunno about nowadays but I got bollocked for announcing a fatality many many years ago (I should have said "incident"). I do seem to remember quite a number though. Very sad.

 

[Minilad]

You hear the phrase "person hit by a train" more and more now.
Personally I think it's a good thing. It does tend to stop some of the constant questions being asked of train crew.

 

[Stonesourscotty]

The train was on a line that had direct trains from the stadium so in theory no one on said train should have been affected by it... Was a relatively pointless yet honest announcement of what happened

 

[Saint66]

Person Under A Train is the announcement I usually hear, and in my opinion, the honesty is welcome, as it makes life easier for those railway staff who would normally be being bombarded/abused by many people if it was announced as something like 'an operating incident'

People want to know what's going on and what is delaying them.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Another one at Hayes & Harlington.

 

[Greaseball3220]

Another one at Hayes & Harlington.

The stretch between Ealing and Slough's has become a blackspot for these tragic events, Hayes is a s**thole btw for those who've never been there.

 

[Antman]

Reports on twitter of a person hit by a train at Langley Green, Birmingham. Very sad.