FastJP Journey Planner Now Available

[SickyNicky]

I can announce the public beta release of the new FastJP journey planner at http://www.fastjp.com

This is a new (and fast) timetable lookup service that is free of charge. It comes with all sorts of tweaking options like multiple vias and avoids (of different types), restricting by TOCs and by transport type, and you can even set more than one origin and/or destination, for example if you live near two or more stations.

Note that the planner is completely disconnected from the routeing guide. So any journeys suggested may not be on permitted routes. But that's for a discussion elsewhere!

Have a play. There's an email address on the site for feedback or any bugs you find. The tool's brought to you from the makers of brfares.com and TrainSplit.com

 

[mbreckers]

Just tried it, doesnt seem faster than anything else I've used

 

[SickyNicky]

Just tried it, doesnt seem faster than anything else I've used

On the face of it, maybe, but the difference between FastJP and other online journey planners is that it will find a number of different routes for journeys, isn't constrained by the routeing guide and allows a huge range of customisation for the journey that you simply can't do on other sites (except Railplanner).

In fact, it was devised as a replacement for Railplanner, following their withdrawal from the market.

 

[d1672]

Hi,

I've just tried a day return journey from Cumbernauld to Cardiff Central. I found the planner quite fast and the printout was crystal clear. Good job done here.

Thomas

 

[FQ]

It looks good. I like how you can choose TOCs to avoid as well!

 

[Bungle965]

Just had a whirl have to say i am very impressed.
Well Done!
Sam

 

[Llanigraham]

Seems OK

 

[gswindale]

Interesting site - although the ignoring of the routing guide and lack of fares is a little off-putting from my point of view.

I note also that if I click on the printed itinerary option; the timetable data is that of 1st Jan 1601 rather than the current timetable

 

[ainsworth74]

Interesting site - although the ignoring of the routing guide and lack of fares is a little off-putting from my point of view.

I find it very very useful, from my point of view, to be able to plan a journey without having to think about permitted routes as often I'll be travelling on rovers or I'll want to see journey options and then think about how to do that with permitted tickets.

 

[SickyNicky]

I note also that if I click on the printed itinerary option; the timetable data is that of 1st Jan 1601 rather than the current timetable

 

[James Wake]

It is useful but I got a glitch when putting in Three Bridges to Sevenoaks avoiding London Bridge. It gave me a route from Three Bridges to Coulsdon South, then Tonbridge, then Sevenoaks, it is easier and valid to change at Redhill.

 

[greatkingrat]

Just tried a search for London Terminals to Birmingham Stations and it only comes up with direct Virgin services (no Chiltern or LM).

If I search for London Marylebone to Birmingham Stations it comes up with both Chiltern and Virgin options (even if they are overtaken by other trains).

 

[SickyNicky]

It is useful but I got a glitch when putting in Three Bridges to Sevenoaks avoiding London Bridge. It gave me a route from Three Bridges to Coulsdon South, then Tonbridge, then Sevenoaks, it is easier and valid to change at Redhill.

Hmm. I cannot reproduce this. Searching just now, I get plenty of itineraries using the Redhill-Tonbridge line.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Just tried a search for London Terminals to Birmingham Stations and it only comes up with direct Virgin services (no Chiltern or LM).

If I search for London Marylebone to Birmingham Stations it comes up with both Chiltern and Virgin options (even if they are overtaken by other trains).

Hmmm. Yes, they're missing from the display, although they're present in the raw data. We're looking at it now.

 

[crehld]

I like it

I particularly like the options to set several via points and restrict by certain operators.

 

[greatkingrat]

An idea for possible future development is an option to show connections under the minimum connection time, sometimes it is useful to know there is a possible 2 or 3 minute connection that might be made 90% of the time even if it is not official.

 

[Paul Kelly]

An idea for possible future development is an option to show connections under the minimum connection time, sometimes it is useful to know there is a possible 2 or 3 minute connection that might be made 90% of the time even if it is not official.

Yes, a global option for "extra connection time" which can be made negative is definitely being considered. At the minute, if you know which station the tight connection is likely to be at, you can add it as a via point, select "must change here" and add a negative layover time.

 

[MikeWh]

Looks good.

Put in CRY-NWD leaving at 1900 and the first two options are identical, except that the second option says it is overtaken by a faster journey. The trains involved are the same. Possibly indicative of a buglet somewhere?

Scrap that - there are two different trains leaving Crayford at 1907, but they both get the same train from London Bridge. Still a little confusing?

 

[SickyNicky]

Looks good.

Put in CRY-NWD leaving at 1900 and the first two options are identical, except that the second option says it is overtaken by a faster journey. The trains involved are the same. Possibly indicative of a buglet somewhere?

There are two different trains from Crayford to Cannon St at 19.07, surprisingly. FastJP is offering itineraries using both of them.

 

[MikeWh]

There are two different trains from Crayford to Cannon St at 19.07, surprisingly. FastJP is offering itineraries using both of them.

I edited as you were replying. They both connect to the same train at LBG, so there is no overall overtaking?

 

[Trainfan344]

Put in from Stoke-on-Trent to St.Pancras using EMT only, and it suggests nearly an hours wait at Derby, is this correct?

 

[Paul Kelly]

Just tried a search for London Terminals to Birmingham Stations and it only comes up with direct Virgin services (no Chiltern or LM).

If I search for London Marylebone to Birmingham Stations it comes up with both Chiltern and Virgin options (even if they are overtaken by other trains).

This is sort of by design, although there is some tweaking that can be (and now has been!) done so that the fastest peak Chiltern services (which are only 20-30% slower than Virgin services) will show up by default.

But ultimately the goal is to provide a journey planner divorced from fares and routeing that is useful to an average passenger looking for "reasonable" itineraries. Now reasonable is obviously very difficult to define, but it obviously includes the fastest itineraries and can reasonably include slower itineraries that have fewer changes. We have also included itineraries that follow a substantially different route but are only a little bit slower. For London to Birmingham this includes the fastest Chiltern services, but not any London Midland ones, since they follow substantially the same route as the fastest Virgin services. It is a compromise and a line has to be drawn somewhere.

As the Virgin services are so fast, they tend to overwhelm everything else on this route, but if you don't want to see them, simply select the option to avoid Virgin and then you will get a wide variety of itineraries back, including routes via Reading, Nuneaton, Derby etc.

 

[Paul Kelly]

I edited as you were replying. They both connect to the same train at LBG, so there is no overall overtaking?

I can't reproduce this - checking for tomorrow night, one train arrives Cannon Street 3 minutes after the other - see attached. Can you provide a link that demonstrates what you were seeing?

 

[Paul Kelly]

Put in from Stoke-on-Trent to St.Pancras using EMT only, and it suggests nearly an hours wait at Derby, is this correct?

I checked daytime tomorrow and all the waits are about half an hour - can you provide a link that demonstrates this? Or try it out on another journey planner that allows selection of a single TOC, e.g. http://tickets.northernrail.org/ (tick "Additional Options" at the bottom to get the TOC selection list)?

 

[MikeWh]

I can't reproduce this - checking for tomorrow night, one train arrives Cannon Street 3 minutes after the other - see attached. Can you provide a link that demonstrates what you were seeing?

Yes, if you extend the journey from London out to Norwood Junction then both trains connect with the same Southern train. Whilst I agree that the platform 2 1907 is slower than the platform 1 1907 in getting to London Bridge, there is no difference to the outcome if you carry on further south.

I guess it comes down to the definition of overtaking. Obviously if one train leaves later and arrives earlier then the first train is overtaken by the second. But if the two trains leave at the same time, should the system just order the faster train first (which it seems to do) and not describe the second one as overtaken?

 

[Paul Kelly]

I guess it comes down to the definition of overtaking. Obviously if one train leaves later and arrives earlier then the first train is overtaken by the second. But if the two trains leave at the same time, should the system just order the faster train first (which it seems to do) and not describe the second one as overtaken?

Yes I agree with you there, trains that FastJP shows as "overtaken" may in (fairly rare) cases like this, not actually be overtaken. The first itinerary (via Hither Green) is preferred because it has a longer connection time in London Bridge than the second. But the second itinerary (via Woolwich) is also kept in because it follows a substantially different route (without a journey time penalty), which we feel is useful to know about in many circumstances.

I'm not really sure how to handle this situation though. It would be more correct to mark all itineraries that are not currently marked as "Overtaken" as "Fastest" instead, and to remove the the "Overtaken" messages. But for most normal queries then the display would be more cluttered. And even "Fastest" wouldn't really be a correct description for this case, where the only difference is a longer connection time at London Bridge. I'm not sure what's best!

 

[boultonmark]

A fantastic achievement. Bravo. Just playing around with the new journey planner whets the appetite for more information. Like:

* Why did you develop it? Presumably you see failings in Hafas, Jeppesen, etc. How is this different to them?

* What is the technical approach? Is it a time-dependent graph? What routing algorithm does it use e.g Dijkstra, A*, Connection Scan, Raptor, Transfer Patterns. Is it entirely custom or does it use something open source like Opentriplanner?

e.g did you see:
https://blog.captaintrain.com/9159-our-routing-algorithm

 

[SickyNicky]

I'm glad you like it. Do you mind if I don't answer these just at the minute? We have some upcoming developments that will make some of this clear soon, but I don't want to give anything away until it's ready.

I think I can tell you that it's a completely custom algorithm though, for reasons that will become clear later.

Sorry to be so mysterious!

A fantastic achievement. Bravo. Just playing around with the new journey planner whets the appetite for more information. Like:

* Why did you develop it? Presumably you see failings in Hafas, Jeppesen, etc. How is this different to them?

* What is the technical approach? Is it a time-dependent graph? What routing algorithm does it use e.g Dijkstra, A*, Connection Scan, Raptor, Transfer Patterns. Is it entirely custom or does it use something open source like Opentriplanner?

e.g did you see:
https://blog.captaintrain.com/9159-our-routing-algorithm

 

[Doctor Fegg]

This looks excellent. If you were to offer an API at any point I'd be very interested.

 

[SickyNicky]

This looks excellent. If you were to offer an API at any point I'd be very interested.

Yes, it will be available as an API in due course. We still have some work to do before this, though.

 

[Envy123]

I like the support for doubling back from Shepreth to Kings Cross. Sometimes, it's faster to take the GN train to Cambridge and a Cruiser back. Too bad it doesn't give fare info on such a route, but despite that it's a great tool.