Expired railcard.

[wam12334711]

Hi, on April I was stopped by Govia on the train I showed them my ticket and then they asked for my railcard. My railcard was offloaded from my phone (I know IPhone storage sucks). I had to re-download the app to show them. Then I realised that it was expired since September. I apologised when this happened and I started panicking. Then they asked me the regular questions. He asked if I had travelled intending not to pay and I said no. This was not my intention at all! I had booked the ticket on the train as I was rushing to get on it, I had a night shirt and still had to go in for the afternoon and then I answered a call and my attention got diverted. I then booked the ticket. I didn’t even know that they were ticket inspectors. As when they approached me they weren’t wearing the traditional blue colour as I’m familiar with. I have never been in any fare related trouble.

I have severe anxiety and I have repeat prescription to manage it. So I didn’t know what to respond to them as I assumed I would get in more trouble for something that wasn’t my attention. I ended up having a panic attack regardless when I got off the station.

I received a letter of intention to prosecute and I’m unsure how to direct it. The ticker inspector told me that my ticket was invalid cause of the railcard.

 

[notmyrealname]

Hi, welcome to the forum.

Could you show us the letter from GTR please? Be sure to obscure your personal details and any reference number so this stays confidential.

The pros should be here later.

 

[jfollows]

Just https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/please-read-before-posting-in-disputes-prosecutions.77759/

 

[wam12334711]

Sorry I realised I need to show the station. One second.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Aug 2025 ==

I think I had too many characters so the rest didn’t get uploaded.

It just says that an invalid ticket is the reason for their intention to prosecute.



I’ve written on the paper already about the incident, that I’ve purchased a new railcard, I have put things in place to prevent this from happening. But I realised I haven’t put anything about the train ticket. I don’t know if I can cross out what I wrote and write on the back. I should have drafted it, I was panicking as I was writing it. I’ll be calling them to find out what I can do Any suggestions on what to do will be very appreciated. Thanks

 

[jfollows]

If your railcard was invalid - expired - then any tickets bought against it are also invalid.

You should search this forum for lots of cases like yours.

In summary, you write to acknowledge your error, you understand how serious it is, that you have taken steps to prevent it happening again such as buying a new railcard, that you would like to settle out of court by paying all unpaid fares plus their investigation costs.

If your tickets were bought online they will examine your purchase history. If your railcard expired 11 months ago you may want to think about this.

Each unpaid fare will cost a full fare anytime single fare in each direction. If you tell us where, we can tell you fares.

Costs will probably be £150.

 

[wam12334711]

Thank you. My ticket was bought online and the railcard had expired 7 months before the incident. Also I was feeling anxious cause I responded no when asked if I intended not to pay. I was worried that since I bought the ticket on the train then they see that then I should clarify that in my letter. Even though it wasn’t my intention it seems like it’s easier to just admit fault and panic for the reasoning than to defend it.

I researched more online and see that buying a ticket at any point of the journey makes it invalid. Even if it’s a minute after you depart.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Aug 2025 ==

Hi, I remembered to purchase as I was getting close to my destination to get off as I was just exhausted on there. Do I need to include this in my written statement too. Cause I told them I didn’t intend on not paying and now I feel worried that they won’t believe and that they can see my purchase history online. I’ve attached my written letter. I was wondering to include me purchasing my ticket during the journey as I was approaching my final station and remembered. Should I also include how I accept responsibility for this and going forward will ensure that I have the right ticket before boarding and won’t purchase one on the train. Any help will be much appreciated.

 

[jfollows]

Don’t add any more.

They’re really not interested in background and reasons, these matter more to you to justify what you did to yourself I suggest. So don’t go overboard, stick to the basics. The purpose of the letter is to get them to agree to settle, don’t obscure the message.

What you’ve written seems fine to me.

It’s a criminal offence to board a train without a valid ticket, yes.

If you don’t have to rush, wait a day or two to see any other opinions here.

 

[wam12334711]

Thanks. I was wondering to apologise for buying a ticket on the train, as they can see purchase history. Also, I’ll reinforce that going forward I’ll make sure to plan accordingly. What do you think?

 

[Titfield]

Thanks. I was wondering to apologise for buying a ticket on the train, as they can see purchase history. Also, I’ll reinforce that going forward I’ll make sure to plan accordingly. What do you think?

I am not sure that you need to apologise for purchasing on the train as that is incidental to the main issue ie that you did not have a valid railcard at the time of travel. It should not make any difference to the outcome.

 

[wam12334711]

Hi, but it was when I was getting close to my destination and when they asked me questions I said I didn’t travel intending not to pay (this is true). So I’m just a bit worried. Sorry for the multiple messages.

 

[Titfield]

Hi, but it was when I was getting close to my destination and when they asked me questions I said I didn’t travel intending not to pay (this is true). So I’m just a bit worried. Sorry for the multiple messages.

The problem is that to some extent it opens up a can of worms. Not checking your railcard's expiry date can be put down to a genuine mistake / poor personal admin but not buying a ticket on a train until near the destination is far more suggestive of deliberate fare evasion and that is why they asked you the question. If you feel more comfortable explaining this (ie you were fatigued and not paying attention) then do so. Does your purchase history suggest you have purchased on the train before?

 

[wam12334711]

No, my purchase history has never shown that I have purchased on the train before.

I always have a ticket purchased before, sometimes even the day before and I make sure to board on time. This is the first time this has happened. I think I had purchased it 3 or 4 stops before I got off, I can’t remember.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Aug 2025 ==

Also to add, I didn’t reduce the length of the journey when booking. I had still booked it from where I originally got on.

 

[Titfield]

Also to add, I didn’t reduce the length of the journey when booking. I had still booked it from where I originally got on.

That is very important - as it means you were not short faring - so if you decide to mention the issue, and I think you want to, then I would state that you had no intention of avoiding paying the fare for your journey.

 

[wam12334711]

Ok. Unfortunately I’ve already written on the paper and I want to add more. Am I able to write at the bottom or at the back?

Should it read somewhat like this?
I also sincerely apologise for purchasing a ticket so close in my journey. I didn’t intend to short fare as I booked it from my original station. I had been exhausted this day and was so anxious of being late that I didn’t take time to plan before the journey. When I remembered I booked it from my original station. I have not booked a ticket on the train before. Going forward I have made sure not to do this and plan my journey accordingly.

 

[Titfield]

You can add an extra sheet. Just make sure you clearly label it with your name the case number and that is a continuation sheet. On the original sheet write please see additional sheet attached. I’m not sure I like the last line. Something like “going forward I will make sure I book a ticket in advance” would be better

 

[wam12334711]

Thanks, in light of all that’s been mentioned. How likely am I to receive an out of court settlement? I know it’s not advised to write personal things. But could medicated anxiety be included too?

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Thanks, in light of all that’s been mentioned. How likely am I to receive an out of court settlement? I know it’s not advised to write personal things. But could medicated anxiety be included too?

You are very likely to get an out of court settlement. From what we've seen, GTR want to know that you have learnt your lesson and won't do it again, and get back the money that you should have paid. What you have written meets those points.

So take a copy of what you have said (always useful if something gets mislaid in the post or at GTR's office) and get it posted. Then concentrate on getting the money that you will have to pay GTR. Otherwise, try not to worry too much about it.

 

[wam12334711]

Hi everyone, I got a response today. I was granted an out of court settlement!!! Thank God and thank you all . I only have to pay £86.60.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Hi everyone, I got a response today. I was granted an out of court settlement!!! Thank God and thank you all . I only have to pay £86.60.

That's good news. Thanks for letting us know.