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Exeter to Waterloo Electrification?

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superalbs

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I remember reading about this line getting electrified a while ago.
Has there been any progress or information on it?

This is the article I read: http://www.andoveradvertiser.co.uk/...rk_Rail_announce__electrification_assesment_/

Network Rail has confirmed to this paper that it is looking into electrifying the train line between Exeter and London and will publish a draft report in the spring.

If the assessment is a success Network Rail could convert the line from its current diesel usage into a more modern electric track, meaning faster journeys to and from the capital for Andover passengers.

A spokesman for Network Rail said: “Network Rail, on behalf of the wider rail industry, is currently undertaking an assessment of the national electrification strategy, which we intend to publish in draft form in the spring.

“As part of this an assessment of the business case for electrifying further lines on the Western route will be undertaken. This includes the line from Exeter to London..."
 
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swt_passenger

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There was a review due this year of future electrification plans for the whole country. It is probably on the back burner while they do a massive review of existing plans.

Considered on a national level, Basingstoke all the way to Exeter is way down the priority list, the local paper is getting somewhat carried away.

What is more likely is that Basingstoke to Southampton via Salisbury would be done initially, for freight services, with Waterloo to Salisbury becoming EMU operated as a sort of side effect.
 

Philip Phlopp

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It's in the Network Rail Electrification RUS, and its a route we're aware of as providing an electrified diversionary/alternative route from London to the West Country, but it will really need to be accompanied with Newbury to Exeter electrification so there's ideally two ways to get stock to and from Exeter.

Newbury to Exeter is easier, as the rolling stock will be capable of using every extra mile of new electrification, Waterloo to Exeter is more complicated as it relies on a new fleet being ordered - so it would make sense for that route to be planned to convert when the Class 158 and Class 159 fleet (or any fleet cascaded to replace it) is finally life expired.

I'd put it in the 2029-2039 timeframe - somewhere around Control Period 8 or 9. There are, sadly for this route, more important routes to wire first, the Bristol to Birmingham and Birmingham to Derby corridor and perhaps convert Waterloo to Salisbury to 25kV for some or all of its length.
 

Diplodicus

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As a man that doesn't know his ohms from his pints, would they really mix 3rd rail and 25kv ohle between BSK & WAT?
 

swt_passenger

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As a man that doesn't know his ohms from his pints, would they really mix 3rd rail and 25kv ohle between BSK & WAT?

Definitely not. There'd have to be a changeover section (probably through Basingstoke platforms) and dual voltage stock used, unless/until the entire route to Waterloo was changed to AC.

A few hundred yards of dual electrification is practical, but mile after mile would never be built.
 

paul1609

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It's in the Network Rail Electrification RUS, and its a route we're aware of as providing an electrified diversionary/alternative route from London to the West Country, but it will really need to be accompanied with Newbury to Exeter electrification so there's ideally two ways to get stock to and from Exeter.

Newbury to Exeter is easier, as the rolling stock will be capable of using every extra mile of new electrification, Waterloo to Exeter is more complicated as it relies on a new fleet being ordered - so it would make sense for that route to be planned to convert when the Class 158 and Class 159 fleet (or any fleet cascaded to replace it) is finally life expired.

I'd put it in the 2029-2039 timeframe - somewhere around Control Period 8 or 9. There are, sadly for this route, more important routes to wire first, the Bristol to Birmingham and Birmingham to Derby corridor and perhaps convert Waterloo to Salisbury to 25kV for some or all of its length.

Wouldn't you be better off electrifying Bristol to Exeter and reducing Taunton to Newbury to a local service? An Electric service calling at Reading, Bristol Parkway, Bristol temple Meads, Taunton and Exeter would be competitive in journey times from what I can see.
 

AM9

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Wouldn't you be better off electrifying Bristol to Exeter and reducing Taunton to Newbury to a local service? An Electric service calling at Reading, Bristol Parkway, Bristol temple Meads, Taunton and Exeter would be competitive in journey times from what I can see.

Probably only when the Bristol TM to Parkway four tracking is completed and the main lines to London are fully operational with 140mph running.
 

Philip Phlopp

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Wouldn't you be better off electrifying Bristol to Exeter and reducing Taunton to Newbury to a local service? An Electric service calling at Reading, Bristol Parkway, Bristol temple Meads, Taunton and Exeter would be competitive in journey times from what I can see.

There are lots of options, but building business cases is the key thing, and making a service London to Exeter via Bristol stack up is difficult.

The next stop from Bristol will be to Weston-Super-Mare anyway, which we could probably afford if the silly town hadn't spent our entire budget on hyphens.

Joining up Portsmouth Harbour to Salisbury and onto Bath would be useful too.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Probably only when the Bristol TM to Parkway four tracking is completed and the main lines to London are fully operational with 140mph running.

140mph running gets you to Newbury more quickly, so journey times remain uncompetitive going via Bristol. There's a thread already about this - IEP related perhaps.
 

NSEFAN

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swt_passenger said:
Definitely not. There'd have to be a changeover section (probably through Basingstoke platforms) and dual voltage stock used, unless/until the entire route to Waterloo was changed to AC.

A few hundred yards of dual electrification is practical, but mile after mile would never be built.
Why not do the changeover just west of Worting Junction? That'd mean simpler circuitry to do the change of ground arrangements for AC to DC. There aught to be no reason why the train should stop during the changeover, so it can happen seamlessly.

From what I gather, only the Reading bay at Basingstoke would need AC electrification, so it would infact be quite easy to keep AC and DC isolated at Basingstoke station this way. AC electrification towards Salisbury with a changeover just west of Worting Junction shouldn't be blocking on the electric spine to Southampton as it's not really a serious proposal with any sort of plan.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Train frequency Salisbury-Exeter is only 1tph plus some peak extras.
Purely in train-miles terms that is too low to justify electrification.
Some more doubling of parts of this 80-odd mile section would be necessary as well, to increase frequency and resilience.
But wiring Basingstoke to Salisbury seems well up the agenda, and you might follow that with Southampton-Salisbury-Westbury-Bath (and Newbury-Westbury).
 

swt_passenger

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Why not do the changeover just west of Worting Junction? That'd mean simpler circuitry to do the change of ground arrangements for AC to DC. There aught to be no reason why the train should stop during the changeover, so it can happen seamlessly.

Not really necessary, because it is extremely unlikely that the route to Salisbury would be done before the mainline west of Basingstoke was already AC. Whatever priority electric spine actually has it must be far higher than Basingstoke/Salisbury/Exeter...
 
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AM9

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Why not do the changeover just west of Worting Junction? That'd mean simpler circuitry to do the change of ground arrangements for AC to DC. There aught to be no reason why the train should stop during the changeover, so it can happen seamlessly.

From what I gather, only the Reading bay at Basingstoke would need AC electrification, so it would infact be quite easy to keep AC and DC isolated at Basingstoke station this way. AC electrification towards Salisbury with a changeover just west of Worting Junction shouldn't be blocking on the electric spine to Southampton as it's not really a serious proposal with any sort of plan.

Given that the SWML electrification originally announced for the Electric Spine now looks delayed until at least CP6, the SWT arguments about stranding their old DC-only stock (think 455s) when en-route to Eastleigh for maintenance becomes less of an issue. Even with the 455s being re-tractioned, for their remaining service life they could be routed via the Portsmouth Direct to the Botley line sidings and then dragged around the site as required. Having said that, I think that the electric spine will be built sometime in the not too distant future as one of the first packages to rid 3rd rail from heavily used mainlines.
In fact the next TOC for that franchise may have different mainjtenance ideas that avoid the issue completely.

As far as the electric spine itself is concerned, whether via Salisbury or Winchester, putting the changeover point west of Basingstoke station (e.g. Worting Junction) would require dual-voltage stock on through services to Southampton, just for 5 miles of travel over DC metals. The services may have come from as far north as Yorkshire, (200 miles +) under ac power but would need DC kit fitted.
 
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swt_passenger

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Given that the SWML electrification originally announced for the Electric Spine now looks delayed until at least CP6, the SWT arguments about stranding their old DC-only stock (think 455s) when en-route to Eastleigh for maintenance becomes less of an issue.

455s don't routinely go anywhere near Eastleigh, all their normal maintenance happens at Wimbledon. There is however a repaint of the 455s going on at Bournemouth, and then there's the retractioning to be done (possibly at Eastleigh), but those two projects will be long gone by the time any AC electrification is done.

I've never seen anything in the public domain resembling an 'argument' from SWT about future 455 access.
 

HowardGWR

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There are lots of options, but building business cases is the key thing, and making a service London to Exeter via Bristol stack up is difficult.

The next stop from Bristol will be to Weston-Super-Mare anyway, which we could probably afford if the silly town hadn't spent our entire budget on hyphens.

Joining up Portsmouth Harbour to Salisbury and onto Bath would be useful too.

:) :) :) loved that one.

Interested in the 'tag on' comments about Bath to Southampton via Salisbury. The way I view that line, it is a series of rural branches trying to run an inter-city service. The notion of such services being 'waved down to stop' at Dilton Marsh is hopefully self-evidently not really very deserving of the concept of an inter-city service. As an inter-city line connecting Cardiff, Bristol, Bath, Trowbridge, Salisbury, Southampton, Portsmouth and / or Brighton, it seems to me that tilt may be the key to a needed speed-up. rather than electrification, per se.

It will all be needed eventually, and a government needs to make a step-change in its commitment to electrification, but I agree that replacing the 159s to Exeter might be better achieved by the 'BR Weymouth' solution (loco hauled from Salisbury to Exeter perhaps?).
 
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NSEFAN

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AM9 said:
Given that the SWML electrification originally announced for the Electric Spine now looks delayed until at least CP6, the SWT arguments about stranding their old DC-only stock (think 455s) when en-route to Eastleigh for maintenance becomes less of an issue. Even with the 455s being re-tractioned, for their remaining service life they could be routed via the Portsmouth Direct to the Botley line sidings and then dragged around the site as required. Having said that, I think that the electric spine will be built sometime in the not too distant future as one of the first packages to rid 3rd rail from heavily used mainlines.
In fact the next TOC for that franchise may have different mainjtenance ideas that avoid the issue completely.

As far as the electric spine itself is concerned, whether via Salisbury or Winchester, putting the changeover point west of Basingstoke station (e.g. Worting Junction) would require dual-voltage stock on through services to Southampton, just for 5 miles of travel over DC metals. The services may have come from as far north as Yorkshire, (200 miles +) under ac power but would need DC kit fitted.
My concern was more about the DC/AC changeover costs. Currently AC will only be making it to Basingstoke from Reading, and I believe even then this is only for platform 5 (I'm happy to be corrected on this!), which helps keep the two systems separate and keeps costs down. All the SWML services are DC and so there's no point changing these to AC without good reason. Since it would only be the West of England that needs AC, the changeover might as well be just beyond Worting to reduce the work required in the area around Basingstoke.

My understanding is that the electric spine has been advocated with freight rather than cross country services in mind, but it wouldn't be of much use to either without new rolling stock: We have plenty of intercity diesel trains that will be suitable for XC once the IEP is delivered, and electric locos for freight need to have last-mile diesel engines to avoid faffing around with loco changes and such. Through trains to/from Reading and Winchester would therefore most likely be diesel anyway, making full AC electrification in the vicinity of Basingstoke useless for now.

Meanwhile, releasing the entire SWT class 158 and 159 fleet would be extremely useful for regional services currently worked by class 150s, which in turn can be shifted to more urban duties. Electrification from Exeter - Basingstoke (with dual-voltage stock) is in my eyes more valuable than the electric spine. In that regard, it would be silly to put AC up around all the lines in Basingstoke as it'd only be 2 tph each way which would really need it.
 
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The Ham

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Following Crossrail 2 (2030) there could be an increase in services to Salisbury which would in turn lead to a demand for more services past there, which could lift the case for electrification.

One option which I've considered in the past, to minimise the amount of electrification required in one go, is to electrify to Yeovil and run the following:
- 1tph (EMU) London to Yeovil/Bristol (10 coaches to Salisbury where it splits)
- 1tph (EMU) London to Yeovil/Southampton (10 coaches to Salisbury where it splits)
- 1tph (DMU) London to Exeter
- 1tph (DMU) Westbury to Exeter via Yeovil (timetabled to meet one of the EMU services at Yeovil)

That way the number of DMU's is reduced, without places west of Yeovil losing their direct service. It also has the advantage that those stations west of yeovil see the possibility of 2tph to London (one requiring a cross platform change at Yeovil, which given the advantages of EMU's could still have the same total journey time to London as the current through trains). There could be a slight rejig so that it is 0.5tph London to Exeter with the associated 0.5tph increase in Westbury to Exeter via Yeovil and Yeovil to Waterloo which would reduce the number of DMU's further.

In doing so it would remove a lot of under wire running of services whilst increasing frequencies. By my maths running those services could require as few as 23 DMU's (vs the current 41) as well as 30 new 5 coach EMU's.

It would mean that if DMU's were still be maintained at Salisbury there would be a bit of under the wires running (either by dropping down from Westbury, which is a bit of a no brainer once most of the rest of the lines for the Portsmouth to Cardiff service are electrified) or by running straight up from Yeovil.

Having said all that depending on what bi-modal trains are around the next franchise could just opt to get a load and not have to worry about where the wires end. It could also allow for an increase in frequency to Weymouth.
 

MarkyT

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Why not do the changeover just west of Worting Junction?

I think I see where you're going there and there are some benefits:

Having an automated dual electrified changeover area at speed away from any major stations and junctions avoids complex OHLE, and dual immunity and bonding issues for track circuits through pointwork.

Any DC leakage current encouraged by the dual system area likely to be less of an problem in a more rural area between settlements with sparse undergound utilities.


From what I gather, only the Reading bay at Basingstoke would need AC electrification, so it would infact be quite easy to keep AC and DC isolated.

Except the whole point of electric spine is to allow electrified freight to run through on electric traction all the way from Southampton to the north. Even if the new freight locos were dual system AC/DC (highly recommended by the way for general flexibility and working on DC through Southampton!) there would need to be a short section of DC as well as the AC on the Reading branch or some additional AC through the mainline platforms at Basingstoke for these trains to changeover back to AC on the move after having changed over to DC near Worting Jn for the short glide through the western approaches to Basingstoke. Switching systems twice like that in such a short distance for the freights and other AC/DC trains on this axis (e.g. new electric Cross Country passenger trains) would be undesirable, although leaving the Basingstoke station area DC for a while could be acceptable as a useful project phasing tactic, allowing easier rural knitting to go up in advance of the more complicated station areas and be made use of straight away by dual fitted trains. This is a bit like Hitachi bi-modes in the west country. As long as the changeover process is quick and reliable any new bit of incremental GW AC electrification further towards the west is useful to improve performance and emit less noise, diesel soot and CO2. Even early isolated sections of AC such as over the steep South Devon banks west of Newton Abbot could be useful on that route.

Although generally undesirable, dual-electrified track must be accommodated at key places like Basingstoke (proposed) or Ashford (existing) for changeover purposes either at speed or whilst stationary. It is unavoidable. The length of the dual-electrified sections should be kept to a minimum, however, to limit the zone around which greater stray DC current leakage will occur due to the systems' conflicting return current and safety earthing philosophies. On the other hand a changeover zone should not be so short that a train failing to changeover successfully on the move will become stranded on the new system.

It is possible today to use axle counters for train detection throughout complex junction and station areas, allowing all insulated rail joints and impedance bonds to be removed and permitting a simple yet massively parallel cabling scheme joining all rails to each other frequently and providing an exceptionally low return resistance path to discourage all but the most hardy of return current electron charges from taking the stray path. Additional heavy parallel strengthening conductors can be added to help keep resistance reliably low. Even with these measures some issues with stray current and resultant corrosion should be expected and monitored for. Metal structures in the area should be assessed and designed with the issue in mind.

At Basingstoke, the final dual system should probably incorporate the entire station area (except the Reading branch bay which can be AC only), extending on approach along the main line in each direction sufficiently far back to allow an emergency stop at the station for a fast train that attempts to change systems on the move but fails. At the station, further attempts to changeover at rest may be made, but if still unsuccessful the train can be cancelled and safely reversed back into the electrification territory it came from or placed in a local siding for later action.
 

Tio Terry

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I think I see where you're going there and there are some benefits:

Having an automated dual electrified changeover area at speed away from any major stations and junctions avoids complex OHLE, and dual immunity and bonding issues for track circuits through pointwork.

Any DC leakage current encouraged by the dual system area likely to be less of an problem in a more rural area between settlements with sparse undergound utilities.




Except the whole point of electric spine is to allow electrified freight to run through on electric traction all the way from Southampton to the north. Even if the new freight locos were dual system AC/DC (highly recommended by the way for general flexibility and working on DC through Southampton!) there would need to be a short section of DC as well as the AC on the Reading branch or some additional AC through the mainline platforms at Basingstoke for these trains to changeover back to AC on the move after having changed over to DC near Worting Jn for the short glide through the western approaches to Basingstoke. Switching systems twice like that in such a short distance for the freights and other AC/DC trains on this axis (e.g. new electric Cross Country passenger trains) would be undesirable, although leaving the Basingstoke station area DC for a while could be acceptable as a useful project phasing tactic, allowing easier rural knitting to go up in advance of the more complicated station areas and be made use of straight away by dual fitted trains. This is a bit like Hitachi bi-modes in the west country. As long as the changeover process is quick and reliable any new bit of incremental GW AC electrification further towards the west is useful to improve performance and emit less noise, diesel soot and CO2. Even early isolated sections of AC such as over the steep South Devon banks west of Newton Abbot could be useful on that route.

Although generally undesirable, dual-electrified track must be accommodated at key places like Basingstoke (proposed) or Ashford (existing) for changeover purposes either at speed or whilst stationary. It is unavoidable. The length of the dual-electrified sections should be kept to a minimum, however, to limit the zone around which greater stray DC current leakage will occur due to the systems' conflicting return current and safety earthing philosophies. On the other hand a changeover zone should not be so short that a train failing to changeover successfully on the move will become stranded on the new system.

It is possible today to use axle counters for train detection throughout complex junction and station areas, allowing all insulated rail joints and impedance bonds to be removed and permitting a simple yet massively parallel cabling scheme joining all rails to each other frequently and providing an exceptionally low return resistance path to discourage all but the most hardy of return current electron charges from taking the stray path. Additional heavy parallel strengthening conductors can be added to help keep resistance reliably low. Even with these measures some issues with stray current and resultant corrosion should be expected and monitored for. Metal structures in the area should be assessed and designed with the issue in mind.

At Basingstoke, the final dual system should probably incorporate the entire station area (except the Reading branch bay which can be AC only), extending on approach along the main line in each direction sufficiently far back to allow an emergency stop at the station for a fast train that attempts to change systems on the move but fails. At the station, further attempts to changeover at rest may be made, but if still unsuccessful the train can be cancelled and safely reversed back into the electrification territory it came from or placed in a local siding for later action.

There is already a working design for an on the move change over between 3rd rail DC and 25KV OHEL, it was used at Fawkham Junction for Eurostar services in to Waterloo before HS1 was extended to St Pancras.
 
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Following Crossrail 2 (2030) there could be an increase in services to Salisbury which would in turn lead to a demand for more services past there, which could lift the case for electrification.

One option which I've considered in the past, to minimise the amount of electrification required in one go, is to electrify to Yeovil and run the following:
- 1tph (EMU) London to Yeovil/Bristol (10 coaches to Salisbury where it splits)
- 1tph (EMU) London to Yeovil/Southampton (10 coaches to Salisbury where it splits)
- 1tph (DMU) London to Exeter
- 1tph (DMU) Westbury to Exeter via Yeovil (timetabled to meet one of the EMU services at Yeovil)

That way the number of DMU's is reduced, without places west of Yeovil losing their direct service. It also has the advantage that those stations west of yeovil see the possibility of 2tph to London (one requiring a cross platform change at Yeovil, which given the advantages of EMU's could still have the same total journey time to London as the current through trains). There could be a slight rejig so that it is 0.5tph London to Exeter with the associated 0.5tph increase in Westbury to Exeter via Yeovil and Yeovil to Waterloo which would reduce the number of DMU's further.

In doing so it would remove a lot of under wire running of services whilst increasing frequencies. By my maths running those services could require as few as 23 DMU's (vs the current 41) as well as 30 new 5 coach EMU's.

It would mean that if DMU's were still be maintained at Salisbury there would be a bit of under the wires running (either by dropping down from Westbury, which is a bit of a no brainer once most of the rest of the lines for the Portsmouth to Cardiff service are electrified) or by running straight up from Yeovil.

Having said all that depending on what bi-modal trains are around the next franchise could just opt to get a load and not have to worry about where the wires end. It could also allow for an increase in frequency to Weymouth.

Surely the logical solution to that would be a regional bi-mode type unit. That would eliminate diesel running under the wires completely and free up all the 158's and 159's. Depending on what new stock is procured for the Transpennine express franchise (if rumours about bi-modes for that franchise turn out to be true) then hopefully it wouldn't be too difficult to add 750V DC capability to the design. The new units for WoE services would then be be capable of running on DC power from Waterloo to Basingstoke, AC power to Salisbury (as and when 25kV electrification happens) then Diesel power beyond to Exeter.
 
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HowardGWR

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Related to the bi-mode suggestion, are the present units for the GWML expected to carry around their diesels for the rest of their working lives? Whilst it could be seen as handy, (think Chippenham to Trowbridge and other diversionary routes) it would be a lot of weight carrying for perhaps decades. Ergo my thoughts on diesel loco hauled from Basingstoke or Salisbury to Exeter.
 

Philip Phlopp

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Related to the bi-mode suggestion, are the present units for the GWML expected to carry around their diesels for the rest of their working lives? Whilst it could be seen as handy, (think Chippenham to Trowbridge and other diversionary routes) it would be a lot of weight carrying for perhaps decades. Ergo my thoughts on diesel loco hauled from Basingstoke or Salisbury to Exeter.

Yes - the contract for the engines in the bi-mode units (and the single engine in the all electric sets) is for 27.5 years.

What actually happens remains to be seen - there's a good chance further electrification will result in some bi-mode units being cascaded/redeployed with new all electric units taking their place, alternatively, the engines can be removed to make all electric sets.
 

paul1609

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There is already a working design for an on the move change over between 3rd rail DC and 25KV OHEL, it was used at Fawkham Junction for Eurostar services in to Waterloo before HS1 was extended to St Pancras.
And before that at Continental junction for trains emerging from the Channel Tunnel. Its still used today for 92 going to or from Dollands Moor and by 378s on the West London Line.
 

MarkyT

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And before that at Continental junction for trains emerging from the Channel Tunnel. Its still used today for 92 going to or from Dollands Moor and by 378s on the West London Line.

Today there were 13 regular SE passenger trains booked to pass rather than stop at Ebbsfleet International. There are also 14 empty stock booked to pass. All of these must switch between electrification systems on the move.
 

paul1609

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Today there were 13 regular SE passenger trains booked to pass rather than stop at Ebbsfleet International. There are also 14 empty stock booked to pass. All of these must switch between electrification systems on the move.
Aren't all of these on HS1?
 

MarkyT

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Aren't all of these on HS1?

Ah could be let me check detailed routings . . .
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
There are only two! As you say all the other non-stops are routed via Ashford.

Non-stops via Strood:

5T90, St Pancras International to Maidstone West, 0616
5T75, Maidstone West to St Pancras International, 1953½

but those two definitely changeover on the move!
 
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coppercapped

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I think I see where you're going there and there are some benefits:

Having an automated dual electrified changeover area at speed away from any major stations and junctions avoids complex OHLE, and dual immunity and bonding issues for track circuits through pointwork.

Any DC leakage current encouraged by the dual system area likely to be less of an problem in a more rural area between settlements with sparse undergound utilities.




Except the whole point of electric spine is to allow electrified freight to run through on electric traction all the way from Southampton to the north. Even if the new freight locos were dual system AC/DC (highly recommended by the way for general flexibility and working on DC through Southampton!) there would need to be a short section of DC as well as the AC on the Reading branch or some additional AC through the mainline platforms at Basingstoke for these trains to changeover back to AC on the move after having changed over to DC near Worting Jn for the short glide through the western approaches to Basingstoke. Switching systems twice like that in such a short distance for the freights and other AC/DC trains on this axis (e.g. new electric Cross Country passenger trains) would be undesirable, although leaving the Basingstoke station area DC for a while could be acceptable as a useful project phasing tactic, allowing easier rural knitting to go up in advance of the more complicated station areas and be made use of straight away by dual fitted trains. This is a bit like Hitachi bi-modes in the west country. As long as the changeover process is quick and reliable any new bit of incremental GW AC electrification further towards the west is useful to improve performance and emit less noise, diesel soot and CO2. Even early isolated sections of AC such as over the steep South Devon banks west of Newton Abbot could be useful on that route.

Although generally undesirable, dual-electrified track must be accommodated at key places like Basingstoke (proposed) or Ashford (existing) for changeover purposes either at speed or whilst stationary. It is unavoidable. The length of the dual-electrified sections should be kept to a minimum, however, to limit the zone around which greater stray DC current leakage will occur due to the systems' conflicting return current and safety earthing philosophies. On the other hand a changeover zone should not be so short that a train failing to changeover successfully on the move will become stranded on the new system.

It is possible today to use axle counters for train detection throughout complex junction and station areas, allowing all insulated rail joints and impedance bonds to be removed and permitting a simple yet massively parallel cabling scheme joining all rails to each other frequently and providing an exceptionally low return resistance path to discourage all but the most hardy of return current electron charges from taking the stray path. Additional heavy parallel strengthening conductors can be added to help keep resistance reliably low. Even with these measures some issues with stray current and resultant corrosion should be expected and monitored for. Metal structures in the area should be assessed and designed with the issue in mind.

At Basingstoke, the final dual system should probably incorporate the entire station area (except the Reading branch bay which can be AC only), extending on approach along the main line in each direction sufficiently far back to allow an emergency stop at the station for a fast train that attempts to change systems on the move but fails. At the station, further attempts to changeover at rest may be made, but if still unsuccessful the train can be cancelled and safely reversed back into the electrification territory it came from or placed in a local siding for later action.

If, in the first instance, the overhead will run from Basingstoke via Salisbury to Southampton a simpler electrical design might be achieved if the Reading line was extended past Basingstoke station on the path of the old GWR line to the north of the existing platforms. Then west of the station the line would divide, branch (A) would join the line to Southampton by means of a grade separated junction between Basingstoke station and Worting Junction and branch (B) would continue on the northern edge of the existing alignment, keeping to the north and west of the embankment coming down from Battledown flyover, before joining the Salisbury line before East Oakley.

Branch A would be suitable for ac/dc passenger stock for services running via Winchester, system changeover could be done on the move on the ramp up to and down from the bridge. Solution B might mean some judicious slewing and possibly some land take - but a single line should be sufficient for freight traffic coming via Salisbury.

The advantage of this scheme is that the two electrification systems don't have to be present on the same track and Basingstoke station doesn't have to be wired.
 

The Ham

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Given that the station will need doing at some point anyway why not just do it early doors and wire up as far up the line towards London as you can before needing to do bridge works or another power feed. Then just have the change over at speed to the east of the station.
 

Philip Phlopp

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Given that the station will need doing at some point anyway why not just do it early doors and wire up as far up the line towards London as you can before needing to do bridge works or another power feed. Then just have the change over at speed to the east of the station.

The problem with changing voltages is with the pantograph lowered, it has a tendency to collect bits of trees in the well, so when it's raised, things can go wrong. It's therefore a good idea to shuffle into a platform on DC and shuffle out on AC if the pan goes up without issues, rather than trying to change en route either after a station, or before a station so you don't need to run DC into the station.

It's less of an issue with Eurostar services, as the route's a bit less rural, but on some of the proposed routes, you definitely want to be able to get a dual voltage unit into a platform in case you have to terminate a service short and de-train pax, so that means both voltages at platform.
 

MarkyT

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The advantage of this scheme is that the two electrification systems don't have to be present on the same track and Basingstoke station doesn't have to be wired.

A major layout change you propose there. I think if AC conversion goes ahead NR have to bite the bullet and accept that there will be an area of dual electrification through Basingstoke station and its approaches. All the state of the art mitigations need to be applied to limit and protect against the stray current issue, and they will be expensive, but not so much as your comprehensive layout redevelopment.

The problem with changing voltages is with the pantograph lowered, it has a tendency to collect bits of trees in the well, so when it's raised, things can go wrong. It's therefore a good idea to shuffle into a platform on DC and shuffle out on AC if the pan goes up without issues, rather than trying to change en route either after a station, or before a station so you don't need to run DC into the station.

It's less of an issue with Eurostar services, as the route's a bit less rural, but on some of the proposed routes, you definitely want to be able to get a dual voltage unit into a platform in case you have to terminate a service short and de-train pax, so that means both voltages at platform.


Basingstoke is a good choice for the changeover as there's only one non-stop passenger service an hour in each direction off-peak. All other passenger services either call, start or terminate there. If necessary, the Weymouth Expresses and any additional non-stop peak services could all be booked to make an additional call at Basingstoke. The better acceleration and possibly higher top speed on AC west of there should easily be able to make up any lost time due to the extra stop within existing end-to-end timings.
 
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