EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

[nidave]

For a start our own independent Galileo (Navigation Satellite System) - a multi-billion pound investment for one country rather than a 1/27th share of the costs. Great value for money

Which we have to get international agreements to build on things like radio frequency etc but as we didn't send a negotiater to the meeting we got no say. We are going to struggle to launch a radio station never mind a GPS system.

 

[northwichcat]

Mercedes launch new car prematurely, the doors are designed to only open for passengers from EU countries: https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ar-as-she-arrives-to-meet-angela-merkel-video

 

[northwichcat]

It won't be 1/27ths of the costs - eg Luxembourg could hardly find 1/27th of the whole, it would bankrupt them! It's probably on a pro-rata basis. Someone will confirm I'm sure.
Sorry, I'm defending Brexit there...what's come all over me....nurse...NURSE....

Not sure what Luxembourg's finances are like but surely companies like eBay and Amazon trying to pay most of their tax for European operations to the Luxembourg government, helps their finances even if their tax rates are low.

 

[Howardh]

Mercedes launch new car prematurely, the doors are only designed to only open for passengers from EU countries: https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ar-as-she-arrives-to-meet-angela-merkel-video

I watched that live and couldn't stop laughing!
I presume the doors are such to stop people getting in and the button wouldn't work...but I also thought that maybe the EU had taken May into custody for her own protection.
Meanwhile, if those "presidential" ( or "muppet" when it involves anyone to do with HM's government) cars are designed to keep people/bullets/fireballs etc out, how would we get in if the door mechanisms failed?!!
May.."Help, I'm trapped"
Merkel..."I know, but what about you in the car...."

 

[LLivery]

Mercedes launch new car prematurely, the doors are only designed to only open for passengers from EU countries: https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ar-as-she-arrives-to-meet-angela-merkel-video

Vorsprung durch technik . (Different brand I know).

 

[Howardh]

Delayed ejaculation?

 

[birchesgreen]

Mercedes launch new car prematurely, the doors are designed to only open for passengers from EU countries: https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ar-as-she-arrives-to-meet-angela-merkel-video

Funniest thing since Brown got locked in a toilet

 

[Ken H]

Brexit won’t be happening anyway; the wheels came off that bus last week.

The UK will leave unless MP's vote to amend or repeal the european union (withdrawal) act 2018. A minister of the crown has to state the basis on how we leave by 26th Jan. can they get a law to stop brexit past MP's who will blatantly have to ignore the referendum result, their manifestos, and the fact they passed the EU(withdrawal) act only months ago.

And now the rumour is the chairman of the 1922 committee has the 48 letters meaning the Tories will vote on a no confidence motion on their leader.

108 days to 29th march and counting....

 

[HH]

May should call a general election; Corbyn will get in and then it's his problem...

 

[nidave]

Times are reporting via Twitter
Nervous Tory MPs hearing rumors that the ERG - in order to force the pace of a leadership contest - may release the names of 48 MPs who have told *them* they've put in letters to Graham Brady. To smoke out liars.
>> Has trust amongst Tory MPs ever been so low? <<

The comment I loved was "Probably illegal under gdpr."

 

[EM2]

May should call a general election; Corbyn will get in and then it's his problem...

I'm surprised that she hasn't just said 'Eff the lot of you. If you think you can do better, you can have the job'.

 

[nlogax]

I'm surprised that she hasn't just said 'Eff the lot of you. If you think you can do better, you can have the job'.

It surprises me too, then I have to remind myself that she wanted, applied for and then got the job of attempting to guide the country out of the EU based on what feels like 17.4 million different interpretations of what the end state should look like and how it should be conducted. So I can't feel too much sympathy for her.

 

[Jonny]

Times are reporting via Twitter
Nervous Tory MPs hearing rumors that the ERG - in order to force the pace of a leadership contest - may release the names of 48 MPs who have told *them* they've put in letters to Graham Brady. To smoke out liars.
>> Has trust amongst Tory MPs ever been so low? <<

The comment I loved was "Probably illegal under gdpr."

Laura Kuenssberg, BBC Journalist is reporting something similar on her twitter feed.

https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1072591327676768256
Hearing that SirGraham Brady has asked to see the PM after #pmqs tmrw, and multiple sources, including senior tories and a cabinet minister, telling us tonight they believe the threshold of 48 letters has been reached - v unlikely to be any confirmation until tomorrow

backup http://archive.fo/JK3CF

 

[nidave]

As the no deal is looking more and more likely as I don't think with a leadership contest and possibly a general election over Christmas we will be able to have anything other than a no deal will be by default , I shall leave this here

Government plans for customs checks at Dover in a no-deal scenario are so impractical it would take eight hours to clear an average lorry carrying food and goods from Calais, the Road Haulage Association has warned.

It said plans for no-deal Brexit were “dire” and the sector faced a catastrophe on 30 March.

“The government is in denial about the scale of this,” said Rod McKenzie, director of policy at the RHA, which represents major hauliers including Eddie Stobart and DHL.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-take-eight-hours-per-lorry-in-no-deal-brexit

 

[bramling]

May should call a general election; Corbyn will get in and then it's his problem...

Only I’m not so sure Corbyn would get in.

Whilst most people, rightly, perceive the Conservatives as useless at the moment, I get the strong feeling people perceive Labour as being equally or even more useless. Add in people worrying about what a Corbyn government would mean for their tax bill, and perhaps a scandal or two over Palestine during the campaign, and no other parties to really go for, and I can’t see the result being much different to last time.

I tend to agree with the general feeling that no deal is now increasingly probable unless something major changes.

 

[HH]

Only I’m not so sure Corbyn would get in.

Whilst most people, rightly, perceive the Conservatives as useless at the moment, I get the strong feeling people perceive Labour as being equally or even more useless. Add in people worrying about what a Corbyn government would mean for their tax bill, and perhaps a scandal or two over Palestine during the campaign, and no other parties to really go for, and I can’t see the result being much different to last time.

I tend to agree with the general feeling that no deal is now increasingly probable unless something major changes.

It's hard to conceive of a result where things would be worse than now - with the noxious DUP holding the balance of power and able to stall things solely on the Irish Border question.

 

[dosxuk]

Just been confirmed that May is to face a vote of no confidence from her own party.

 

[EM2]

Just been confirmed that May is to face a vote of no confidence from her own party.

You mean they had a vote, don't like the way that it has turned out, and now want a second vote? Seems fair.

 

[nidave]

You mean they had a vote, don't like the way that it has turned out, and now want a second vote? Seems fair.

Ahh but only the goverment are allowed to change thier mind - not the people becaause Sovereignty or something

Its deeply ironic that the 1922 Committee of Conservative backbenchers basically had a vote to remove May a few weeks ago, Didnt like the restult so they had another vote

To quote twitter:

28 months ago, the Conservative Party elected Theresa May leader with 60% of the vote.

29 months ago, 51.9% of voters supported leaving the EU.
On one of these, it’s fine to ask if people have changed their minds. To do so on the other is apparently an affront to democracy.

 

[birchesgreen]

The pantomime continues, i'm sure at the exporting businesses, hauliers, foodbanks and homeless shelters across the land they will be thrilled at the latest act of self-indulgence.

 

[Howardh]

Is it easy to relocate and retire to Bermuda??

I just want out of this crazy place.

 

[bnm]

Its deeply ironic that the 1922 Committee of Conservative backbenchers basically had a vote to remove May a few weeks ago, Didnt like the restult so they had another vote

There wasn't a vote a few weeks ago. This is the first time since Theresa May became party leader that her leadership has been formally challenged.

Challenged under the rules of the 1922 Committee. Whose current rules were put in place in 2010, following a consultation and vote by all sitting Conservative MPs at that time.

The rules being that if 15% of Conservative MPs notify the Chairman of the 1922 Committee that they have no confidence in the party leader then a no confidence motion is put to all Conservative MPs. All Conservative MPs then vote on that motion and the party leader requires a simple majority, 50% +1 MP, to avoid a leadership contest. If the party leader fails to get that simple majority (the number of Conservative MPs required to back Mrs May is 158) then a leadership contest is triggered.

 

[nidave]

There wasn't a vote a few weeks ago. This is the first time since Theresa May became party leader that her leadership has been challenged.

If you want to be tecincally correct - no there was not a vote - the 1922 Committee of Conservative backbenchers tried to get the letters for a vote and could not get the result they wanted so are having antoher crack at it as the MP's have changed thier mind on the decision they made a few weeks ago about weather May should stay or not.
All based on new information.
The point I am trying to make is that they had a chance to submit the letters a few weeks ago - new information and curcamstances have changed so they are able to change thier minds yet the people "have decided and nothing is going to change on that front"

 

[Kite159]

There wasn't a vote a few weeks ago. This is the first time since Theresa May became party leader that her leadership has been formally challenged.

Challenged under the rules of the 1922 Committee. Whose current rules were put in place in 2010, following a consultation and vote by all sitting Conservative MPs at that time.

The rules being that if 15% of Conservative MPs notify the Chairman of the 1922 Committee that they have no confidence in the party leader then a no confidence motion is put to all Conservative MPs. All Conservative MPs then vote on that motion and the party leader requires a simple majority, 50% +1 MP, to avoid a leadership contest. If the party leader fails to get that simple majority (the number of Conservative MPs required to back Mrs May is 158) then a leadership contest is triggered.

And the country ends up with Boris Johnson/Jacob Rees-Mogg as PM...

I predict riots in the new year

 

[furnessvale]

You mean they had a vote, don't like the way that it has turned out, and now want a second vote? Seems fair.

The detail difference is that they enacted the result of the first vote unlike the dreams of remainers.

 

[bnm]

If you want to be tecincally correct - no there was not a vote - the 1922 Committee of Conservative backbenchers tried to get the letters for a vote and could not get the result they wanted so are having antoher crack at it as the MP's have changed thier mind on the decision they made a few weeks ago about weather May should stay or not.
All based on new information.
The point I am trying to make is that they had a chance to subit the letters a few weeks ago - new information and curcamstances ahve changes so they are able to change thier minds yet the people appently have decided and nothing is going to change on that front.

MPs have not necessarily changed their mind. It's just that more have now formally expressed no confidence in their leader. Some would have been holding counsel after the last flurry of discontent led by the loathsome Mogglodyte, some would have been dismayed at the delaying of the meaningful vote on the EU Withdrawal Bill, and some would have realised that Theresa May had weakened her position further by going back to Europe yesterday with a begging bowl.

I think she'll win the simple majority she requires tonight. However, her position as party leader really rests on how big the win is. If she wins comfortably then she'll have the mandate to continue as party leader. If her win is only marginal then she may have to seriously consider her position.

Remember that Margaret Thatcher won the initial vote in the challenge to her leadership in 1990 (by nearly 15%, admittedly under different rules then), but it wasn't enough for to remain party leader. Enough discontent was expressed and she had no choice but to resign. Theresa May could face a similar dilemma. Winning the simple majority but not by enough of a margin to give her a mandate to continue.

Well know later tonight...

 

[bnm]

And the country ends up with Boris Johnson/Jacob Rees-Mogg as PM...

I predict riots in the new year

If she fails to get the mandate to continue as leader then there will of course be a leadership contest. I doubt though that a hard line brexiter will become leader. The parliamentary Conservative party is naturally err... conservative. They'll likely go for a more moderate candidate. The party, like the country is pretty evenly split on the issue of Europe. And remember, any leadership contest includes the wider Conservative Party membership.

In 1990 the supposed leading alternative was Michael Heseltine. After Mrs Thatcher wirlthdrew from the leadership contest many thought he was shoe-in. However, many in the parliamentary party, and the vast majority of Conservative constituency associations (who didn't have a vote in leadership contests back then, but could heavily influence their MP) didn't like Michael Heseltine. He failed to get the requisite votes to become leader and he too withdrew from the contest. This paved the way for the more moderate John Major to become leader.

 

[birchesgreen]

He who wields the knife seldom wins the crown the saying goes.

Though its been more like a spoon they have been trying to stab Caesar with.

 

[nidave]

MPs have not necessarily changed their mind. It's just that more have now formally expressed no confidence in their leader. Some would have been holding counsel after the last flurry of discontent led by the loathsome Mogglodyte, some would have been dismayed at the delaying of the meaningful vote on the EU Withdrawal Bill, and some would have realised that Theresa May had weakened her position further by going back to Europe yesterday with a begging bowl.

I think she'll win the simple majority she requires tonight. However, her position as party leader really rests on how big the win is. If she wins comfortably then she'll have the mandate to continue as party leader. If her win is only marginal then she may have to seriously consider her position.

Remember that Margaret Thatcher won the initial vote in the challenge to her leadership in 1990 (by nearly 15%, admittedly under different rules then), but it wasn't enough for to remain party leader. Enough discontent was expressed and she had no choice but to resign. Theresa May could face a similar dilemma. Winning the simple majority but not by enough of a margin to give her a mandate to continue.

Well know later tonight...

if they are not changing thier stance (or minds) why didnt they submit the letters a few weeks ago - could it be that curcamstances have changed?

 

[Senex]

You mean they had a vote, don't like the way that it has turned out, and now want a second vote? Seems fair.

Ah but this is about politicians voting for other politicians. Quite a different matter to think about giving the general public a vote if you can possibly avoid it.