Enterprising staff

[tbtc]

Hmm... how's about buying "pre-packed" goods at a shop/ cafe etc (who may assemble sandwiches, but would deal with the hygiene certificates etc), then the rest of your goods are coming from cans/ packets/ tins etc... dunno.

Out of interest, at the moment do TOCs pay RailGourmet (etc) or do RailGourmet pay the TOC? Or is there no fee on either side?

 

[jon0844]

It might make sense to allow free access to the train for a company like RailGourmet, as a value added service to passengers. But, accountants probably don't like such ideas.

The other problem is that the company can then pick and choose what services to operate on (they won't do near-empty off-peak services in the week) and passengers will never know if they will, or won't, get any service. You can hardly force a trolley service to run on ALL trains, and if you did, you'll presumably get the staff calling in sick, saying the trolley has broken, they had supply problems and (insert more excuses here).

Perhaps a vending machine on the train is another option, but I'm sure they'd be vandalised constantly.

 

[tbtc]

Perhaps a vending machine on the train is another option, but I'm sure they'd be vandalised constantly.

They work abroad IIRC.

Maybe a vending machine/ ticket machine combination, so passengers have no excuse for not paying (the "there was a queue at the station so I didn't have time for a ticket" excuse wouldn't work)?

 

[Peter Mugridge]

If food's "eaten in" though, I believe it is subject to VAT. However a small trader is unlikely to earn enough to have to be VAT registered.

It is possible for a trader below the VAT threshold to register with HMRC for VAT and then legally charge the 20% VAT to their customers while only having to pay MHRC, for example, 9.5%* - and it's perfectly legal for them to pocket the difference!


*Rate varies according to the person's trade.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

As with any business there will be costs involved in setting up a company to sell drinks and snacks on a train. These will include getting tariffs printed, buying or leasing the trolleys, public liability insurance and corporate clothing to idnetify you as an authorised person (unauthorised vendors are quite a problem in parts of Europe, or at least they used to be).

On top of this, I imagine the TOC would want some sort of payment for allowing you to access their trains and customers, whether this be some sort of rent, or a percentage of profit.

It'sa bit more complicated than just buying some kit kats from Tesco's and selling them on for double the price. Unless you want to be an illegal or enterprising trader of course!

All very true!
And I could continue to add to the list of costs for legal suppliers:
property costs (secure storeage at key stations, access to messrooms, etc), additional costs of stock (wastage - losses, spoilt and out-of-date stock, stocktaking, refuse disposal), cost of staff including reserve to cover absentees, employers & public liability insurance, station access charges, train access charges (space, power, water & licence to operate), cost of staff travel as pass. to/from start/end of duty, power (heat & light), training and HR costs, cash & banking costs and all the general administration of a business in a business sector which is not known for its attractive pricing to new enterprises!

 

[Greenback]

You are , of course, quite correct! I was approaching it from the angle of a one man band as I thought had been implied by some of posts!

The main point is that it often surprises people what is involve din starting even what seems like the most straight forward business!

 

[island]

It is possible for a trader below the VAT threshold to register with HMRC for VAT and then legally charge the 20% VAT to their customers while only having to pay MHRC, for example, 9.5%* - and it's perfectly legal for them to pocket the difference!


*Rate varies according to the person's trade.

Yes it is, but the quid pro quo is that they cannot reclaim input tax on their purchases or business expenses, except for capital goods (> £2000).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If food's "eaten in" though, I believe it is subject to VAT.

Food and drink supplied "in the course of catering" is subject to VAT at 20%. HMRC Notice 709/1 would suggest that food and drink supplied on a train is caught by this rule.

A substantial number of items normally sold from a trolley (hot drinks, alcoholic beverages, fizzy drinks, confectionery, peanuts) are already 20%-VAT items.