ENCTS bus pass anomaly

[WolvertonWorks]

Last Saturday morning I took the X5 from Milton Keynes to Bedford and then the 905 from Bedford to Cambridge.

I then took the Busway route A from Cambridge to St Ives, then after making a visit, a Busway route B to Huntingdon where I took the train one stop to St Neots.

In St Neots I boarded the 905 back to Bedford and then the X5 from Bedford back to MK.

My ENCTS bus pass didn't work on the machine on the X5 in the morning but it worked fine on the 905 both ways and both busway journeys and it again failed on the machine on the X5 at Bedford for the return to MK.

The X5 and the 905 are both run by Stagecoach so any thoughts on why the X5 machines didn't read my bus pass and the 905s did?

 

[richw]

Any chance it was the same vehicle on both X5 journeys? Could be a fault with that machine

 

[Buzby]

I’ve had similar experiences (on different routes). It eventually transpired my card had a hairline crack that affected the aerial, some machines could cope with this better than others - one of the drivers ran a diagnostic routine which identified the card not taking the required voltage and rejecting it (but with no error message). Even if the card isn’t broken if stressed it can cause issues. I had my card replaced and it now scans everywhere. Further, my original card was 8 years old so it needed retirement!

 

[WolvertonWorks]

Thanks, I did think that it might have been the same machine but it wasn't but the faulty card is something I hadn't thought of - will monitor and if it begins to happen frequently will see if I can get the card replaced. Thanks again.

 

[richard13]

Stagecoach X5 can be regarded as an express service on which ENCTS passes would not be valid. Central Bedfordshire Council however online uses the X5 as an example of an express service treated as a local service and thus it is (or was when written) valid. Stagecoach East and Milton Keynes don't seem to give that information. You might want to ask Stagecoach explicitly. What were the X5 drivers comments?

 

[gray1404]

ENCTS passes are valid on the X5.

I have never had my pass work the machine on the X5 however and always been issued with a manuel ticket.

I had one driver give me grief for this so I emailed Stagecoach and an Assistant Manager from the Bedford depot emailed me back to confirm my out of area pass is valid.

 

[L401CJF]

When I was a driver at Stagecoach Merseyside near 10 years ago, the ERG/VIX machines had no issues reading Merseyside ENCTS passes, or Cheshire Elderly ENCTS passes (blue) however had issues where it would reject any Cheshire Disabled (Orange) pass and most out of area passes. We were all aware of this (as were management) and were told to accept them (after 0930 for out of area cards) and to record their use manually by issuing a free concession ticket. It was apparently a glitch with the machines that was known about and a fix was "in progress" but never fixed during the time I was there.

When I moved to Arriva Merseyside we had Wayfarer 200 machines, similarly most conc cards worked even out of area ones, but there were some certain region passes which the machine didn't recognise. Again we were told to do a manual inspection and issue a free conc ticket. In Cheshire West there are (or were, I am not on the buses now so dont know if it has changed) 2 types of disability pass - standard, or visually impaired. The standard disability cards were only valid after 0930 Mon-Fri, however there was no time restriction on the visually impaired card but the machines would still reject them before 0930. The only way we could distinguish between the 2 was the visually impaired card came in a specific wallet - the card itself was visually the same. In this case we were told to check the card and the wallet then issue a manual conc ticket. This proved problematic if the card holder had binned the original wallet and put it in their own - particularly if the holder didn't carry a cane or have a guide dog etc (or other telltale signs of a visual impairment). Of course the general practice was to take their word for it to avoid any trouble.

It was definitely common for Machines not to be programmed with out of area cards which were less likely to be seen - perhaps a cost cutting method? When we switched over to Ticketer machines it seemed to recognise all cards.

 

[175mph]

When I was a driver at Stagecoach Merseyside near 10 years ago, the ERG/VIX machines had no issues reading Merseyside ENCTS passes, or Cheshire Elderly ENCTS passes (blue) however had issues where it would reject any Cheshire Disabled (Orange) pass and most out of area passes. We were all aware of this (as were management) and were told to accept them (after 0930 for out of area cards) and to record their use manually by issuing a free concession ticket. It was apparently a glitch with the machines that was known about and a fix was "in progress" but never fixed during the time I was there.

When I moved to Arriva Merseyside we had Wayfarer 200 machines, similarly most conc cards worked even out of area ones, but there were some certain region passes which the machine didn't recognise. Again we were told to do a manual inspection and issue a free conc ticket. In Cheshire West there are (or were, I am not on the buses now so dont know if it has changed) 2 types of disability pass - standard, or visually impaired. The standard disability cards were only valid after 0930 Mon-Fri, however there was no time restriction on the visually impaired card but the machines would still reject them before 0930. The only way we could distinguish between the 2 was the visually impaired card came in a specific wallet - the card itself was visually the same. In this case we were told to check the card and the wallet then issue a manual conc ticket. This proved problematic if the card holder had binned the original wallet and put it in their own - particularly if the holder didn't carry a cane or have a guide dog etc (or other telltale signs of a visual impairment). Of course the general practice was to take their word for it to avoid any trouble.

It was definitely common for Machines not to be programmed with out of area cards which were less likely to be seen - perhaps a cost cutting method? When we switched over to Ticketer machines it seemed to recognise all cards.

When I attempted to use my ENCTS card on Reading Buses back in August, their Ticketers refused to recognize my card at all, despite it being well after 9:30. The drivers always immediately told me to go sit down and never issued a manual zero fare ticket.

 

[gray1404]

When I was a driver at Stagecoach Merseyside near 10 years ago, the ERG/VIX machines had no issues reading Merseyside ENCTS passes, or Cheshire Elderly ENCTS passes (blue) however had issues where it would reject any Cheshire Disabled (Orange) pass and most out of area passes. We were all aware of this (as were management) and were told to accept them (after 0930 for out of area cards) and to record their use manually by issuing a free concession ticket. It was apparently a glitch with the machines that was known about and a fix was "in progress" but never fixed during the time I was there.

This was my issue with the MK X5. Merseyside disabled pass not working on the machine yet a senior one would.

When I attempted to use my ENCTS card on Reading Buses back in August, their Ticketers refused to recognize my card at all, despite it being well after 9:30. The drivers always immediately told me to go sit down and never issued a manual zero fare ticket.

This really does surprise me. I used Reading Buses every other week about 10 times with my out of area ENCTS on Reading Buses between 2020 and 2022 without a single issue. It sounds like there has been something of a software update perhaps causing the issue.

 

[ChrisC]

I’m quite a newcomer to the world of ENTCS having only this last year reached the age of 66 to receive one. Most of my use of it has been within the issuing area of Nottinghamshire and neighbouring Derbyshire. A few times when I have been on holiday, I have used it well out of area, and have sometimes noticed, especially on Ticketer machines, that it did sometimes appear to take a little longer to register than when I use it locally. Is that normal for out of area use?

 

[GusB]

The thread was set up to discuss a specific issue and we're now beginning to drift off-topic.

@WolvertonWorks, if you discover that it was a faulty card, please alert us by reporting this post and we can reopen the thread. Thanks to all for your contributions.