True but they've got to rely on mostly Northern to get to Manchester or Leeds (if by rail).
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EMR Overcrowding
- Thread starter Foxcover
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True but they've got to rely on mostly Northern to get to Manchester or Leeds (if by rail).
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westcoaster
Established Member
No amount of forward planning is going to stop overcrowding in this instance.
The club's have to take some of the Flack, nothing stopping them sourcing and running extra services (paths dependant).
EMR have lengthened everything possible, they do not have an infinite amount of units and staff.
The club's have to take some of the Flack, nothing stopping them sourcing and running extra services (paths dependant).
EMR have lengthened everything possible, they do not have an infinite amount of units and staff.
I believe the idea was mooted unofficially, where knowledge permitted, but it would have been too short notice to organise such a thing
STINT47
Member
I can't help but wonder how things would have gone if Stagecoach were still running the service. They wouldn't have more trainzbut when it came to anticipating and dealing with large events they always seemed like a better operator than EMR
Back then they had the HSTs (which were good at soaking up the crowds) and more human resources so I’d imagine they’d put as many HSTs on as possible with maybe one or two extras, but I have a feeling it would have been a similar situation
QSK19
Member
Football spoiler alert
Given that Forest have just been promoted to the Premier League, could we see Meridians return to the Ivanhoe line to ferry fans between Leicester and Nottingham when those teams play against each other? If so, best think about preventing the brakes overheating! If not, though, would be a case of putting on 3-car 170s or 4/5-car 158s in order to handle the crowds?
Given that Forest have just been promoted to the Premier League, could we see Meridians return to the Ivanhoe line to ferry fans between Leicester and Nottingham when those teams play against each other? If so, best think about preventing the brakes overheating! If not, though, would be a case of putting on 3-car 170s or 4/5-car 158s in order to handle the crowds?
WillPS
Established Member
Pretty sure this isn't the thread for this sort of thing.
QSK19
Member
I’d argue it is given that transportation of fans between Leicester and Nottingham will invariably result in overcrowding; so I was asking about possible measures to mitigate this… suffice to say a lot of fans will be using the MML to get to/from matches between the two. But, we’ll see what the mods say - I stand corrected if necessary.
Just FYI, I put “Football spoiler alert” so that I didn’t ruin any surprise for football fans frequenting RF who wanted to wait to watch match highlights rather than have me blow it for them
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nottsnurse
Member
- Joined
- 1 May 2014
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- 278
- Nottingham and Leicester are two large cities on the MML.
- EMR run the services that serve those cities.
- EMR are struggling with current passenger numbers.
- As it stands, increased passenger numbers on match days between Nottingham and Leicester will be an issue.
Pretty sure this is the perfect place for it, rather than start another thread.
We welcome posts of a speculative nature provided they are posted exclusively in the Speculative Discussion forum section.
if anyone would like to create such a thread, you are welcome to do so, and feel free to link to it from here.
if anyone would like to create such a thread, you are welcome to do so, and feel free to link to it from here.
Kite159
Veteran Member
You would hope EMR will make note of any days where there is sporting events happening which could result in severe overcrowding (football/rugby/horse racing etc) and have plans to booster services on those routes to try and avoid severe overcrowding where people are left behind. At least on the rural routes when they get more 170s those have SDO to allow longer trains to call at shorter platforms without the hassle of doing local door only.
I guess the worst case for EMR for overcrowding will be if both Nottingham & Leicester are playing teams in London/South on the same day, when the ECML isn't available from Grantham.
I guess the worst case for EMR for overcrowding will be if both Nottingham & Leicester are playing teams in London/South on the same day, when the ECML isn't available from Grantham.
They do try - though it is a fact that weekends are already very busy anyway so there's a limit as to what you can do. There are trains that are at the point of leaving people behind every week regardless.
DannyMich2018
Member
- Joined
- 19 Dec 2018
- Messages
- 932
I think it would REALLY help if some of the 1st class would be declassified on the 222s. As most people know they have a really poor ratio of 1st to standard class. For example the remaining 7 car 222s have THREE first class coaches. 5 car ones have too much first as well which are quiet at the weekend while standard is full to bursting often.
Killingworth
Established Member
Simple, bigger discounts on some first class fares. Hotels can manage it to maximise occupancy and room rates.
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EMR's website has the 20:02, 20:32, 20:35 and 21:35 from St Pancras as full and standing from the start (no surprise of course)
I see the 20:02 and 20:35 are 5 cars but the others have been strengthened. Also a VSTP service at 21:05 for Nottingham which RTT puts as having left 10 early and currently running 21 early? https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:43188/2022-05-29
RTT also puts the 22:02 as having left London around 5 early https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:P54694/2022-05-29/detailed#allox_id=0 - have these early departures just been dispatched as soon as full as there is pathing space?
I see the 20:02 and 20:35 are 5 cars but the others have been strengthened. Also a VSTP service at 21:05 for Nottingham which RTT puts as having left 10 early and currently running 21 early? https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:43188/2022-05-29
RTT also puts the 22:02 as having left London around 5 early https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:P54694/2022-05-29/detailed#allox_id=0 - have these early departures just been dispatched as soon as full as there is pathing space?
The last train of the evening to Nottingham departed with hundreds still left behind at St Pancras, most of them were sent away on a Corby train with road transport (5 coaches) waiting at Kettering. An extra train has also appeared at St Pancras running as 1Z98, departing at 23:20 for Nottingham
Correction: 1Z98 was retimed to depart at 21:05
Correction: 1Z98 was retimed to depart at 21:05
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STINT47
Member
I think I'm starting to understand why EMR are banished to a far corner at St Pancras. They're a disgrace compared to the other operators at the station.
I feel sorry for the poor staff who have to represent this mess and no doubt get it in the neck from disgruntled passengers.
bramling
Veteran Member
I walked through St Pancras earlier and can attest that the EMR concourse was utter chaos. Plenty of boisterous Notts fans evident both in the station and walking along Euston Road, I couldn't help wondering how many of them were likely to find themselves unable to board a train.
Quite a few. It's bad enough there in "normal" operations. Two little amount of "in" barriers. When i was there last week, two of the avaiable "in" barriers kept showing "seek assistance" and had to be manually operated for a number of customers. This led to a number of people not making it onto trains on time.
BeccaOnATrain
Member
As much as I've been burnt by EMR overcrowding in the past.. I'm of this opinion too - what steps did Nottingham Forest FC take to help alleviate this situation - were they in communications with EMR at all?
As others have suggested EMR could have handled it better on the ground or made the services reservations only?
But what else could they have done in a situation like this.. organised dozens of coaches ahead of time, maybe? Guess that's a bit of a grey area on whether they are responsible or not for doing that..
Andy Pacer
Established Member
And then presumably there would also be a load of disgruntled passengers who were put on a coach when expecting a train - and presumably this would take longer.
Making services reservations only would massively limit the capacity of the railway at a time when thousands of people are wanting to use it. It would have meant thousands of fans would have been turned away and would inconvenience far more people than simply removing reservations and declassifying first class.
I detect a slight attitude on here that football fans are not “proper” passengers.
If anyone has any ideas feel free to post a new thread in the appropriate area.
In the meantime, I think we are done here, so I am going to close the thread.
If there are any developments and anyone has anything to add, please report this post and include a draft of what you would like to post.
Thanks.
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