EMR Class 170 updates

[Trainbike46]

Certainly a mixture of both, I wonder if they had implemented the full timetable which was supposed to be hourly on most routes if things would be better, or if the increased frequency would have lead to more passengers and still the same overcrowding. Routes link Grimsby - Lincoln on an hourly frequency would probably be counter productive as more people would use them.

More passengers is desirable though - we shouldn't be keeping frequencies low because we'd have more passengers if frequencies increased!

 

[43055]

170273 going to Bristol today... any ideas why?

Maybe it just forgot to turn right at North Staffs Junction

We took the grandkids to Matlock and the two car 170 was wedged when it arrived from Nottingham. in my opinion EMR is either seriously underfunded, badly managed or a heady mixture of both.

Matlock services have always been busy at the weekends. Still a 2 car 170 is better than the single 153 that use to be put on on Saturdays. I have noticed that some of the Matlock services have been 4 cars on the last couple of weekends.

 

[Failed Unit]

More passengers is desirable though - we shouldn't be keeping frequencies low because we'd have more passengers if frequencies increased!

I agree, but DFT will never agree to this. I don’t think a 2 car DMU covers it costs even if it is full.

 

[Ryry]

Maybe it just forgot to turn right at North Staffs Junction


Matlock services have always been busy at the weekends. Still a 2 car 170 is better than the single 153 that use to be put on on Saturdays. I have noticed that some of the Matlock services have been 4 cars on the last couple of weekends.

That maybe because of Matlock illuminations have been on over the weekends

 

[Failed Unit]

Not sure about on the Matlock route but 2x 170s is a bad thing. A lot of the platforms in EMR land can only take 2 coaches. (SDO used if a 3 car is allocated). So 2x 2car 170s is better capacity but is a pain in the rear as dwell times increase rapidly.

 

[Robertj21a]

Interesting comments about the condition of the 170s. As a fairly infrequent 'ordinary' train user I can't say that the condition of any 170 has ever hit me as being notably poor - the occasional oddly coloured seat, or a bit of light damage/tear perhaps.
It's not something that the bulk of ordinary passengers are going to get very concerned about.

 

[Pippy1505]

170273 going to Bristol today... any ideas why?

C8 Exam

 

[ZCreaser]

Just seen a West Midlands Class 172 in Doncaster’s West Yard, I presume it’s off to EMR?

 

[Liam L]

Just seen a West Midlands Class 172 in Doncaster’s West Yard, I presume it’s off to EMR?

No it's not. It will be there for exam (C4 I think?). The 172s are staying with WMR.

 

[43055]

That maybe because of Matlock illuminations have been on over the weekends

Probably is the case. One of the Matlock diagrams is a 4 car today as is all the Crewe - Newarks. Looking on other routes they all seem to be running and Liverpools are all 4 car so seems to be a few spare units now if they are able strengthen 5 diagrams. The engineering between Norwich and Peterborough might of helped with one or two units though.

 

[Failed Unit]

Probably is the case. One of the Matlock diagrams is a 4 car today as is all the Crewe - Newarks. Looking on other routes they all seem to be running and Liverpools are all 4 car so seems to be a few spare units now if they are able strengthen 5 diagrams. The engineering between Norwich and Peterborough might of helped with one or two units though.

Time to look at the football / racing fixtures. - Maybe strengthened for Leicester - Stoke?

 

[dk1]

Probably is the case. One of the Matlock diagrams is a 4 car today as is all the Crewe - Newarks. Looking on other routes they all seem to be running and Liverpools are all 4 car so seems to be a few spare units now if they are able strengthen 5 diagrams. The engineering between Norwich and Peterborough might of helped with one or two units though.

I’m presuming 4 units are in the Jubilee sidings at Norwich for the weekend.

 

[TheBigD]

Probably is the case. One of the Matlock diagrams is a 4 car today as is all the Crewe - Newarks. Looking on other routes they all seem to be running and Liverpools are all 4 car so seems to be a few spare units now if they are able strengthen 5 diagrams. The engineering between Norwich and Peterborough might of helped with one or two units though.

It doesn't. It actually reduces the number of units available if there are 4* at Norwich as turning around at Peterborough only saves 3 units.

* I've not checked if Friday's 1751 Liverpool-Norwich was actually the booked 4 car.

 

[liamf656]

* I've not checked if Friday's 1751 Liverpool-Norwich was actually the booked 4 car.

It was a single 2 car unit

 

[STINT47]

Reading Today's Railways it says that the Cross Country 170s are due for a refurbishment as they are in a poor condition.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought EMRs 170s have been equaly as long or even longer without a refurb. It makes no sense why our units can't be included in the work.

We could soon see 170s at places like Derby where Cross Country have lovely refurbished trains whilst EMR passengers travel on tatty worn out crap.

It just needs Jim Bowen to stand on the platform telling EMR passengers to go over to XC and "come and have a look at what you could have won" to complete the ultimate insult.

PS It's Miles birthday and they've been busy putting up adverts showing him going on dates with his girlfriend. If EMR had the same passion for service standards as they do for Miles we might get somewhere.

 

[ChrisC]

Reading Today's Railways it says that the Cross Country 170s are due for a refurbishment as they are in a poor condition.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought EMRs 170s have been equaly as long or even longer without a refurb. It makes no sense why our units can't be included in the work.

We could soon see 170s at places like Derby where Cross Country have lovely refurbished trains whilst EMR passengers travel on tatty worn out crap.

It just needs Jim Bowen to stand on the platform telling EMR passengers to go over to XC and "come and have a look at what you could have won" to complete the ultimate insult.

PS It's Miles birthday and they've been busy putting up adverts showing him going on dates with his girlfriend. If EMR had the same passion for service standards as they do for Miles we might get somewhere.

I thought very much the same when I read yesterday that TPE are to have the 185’s refurbished again. Most of my rail travel is with EMR and so I am now quite used to their tatty trains. A few weeks ago I travelled between Sheffield and Manchester on a TPE 185 and in comparison to EMR it felt like a new train.

 

[QSK19]

We’ll probably get the now very tiresome “well you’re getting new Intercity trains” line said against us in the sense that we should be grateful for DfT investment; but, as I’ve said before, this is a non-IC issue - not every EMR passenger uses the MML.

As others have said, EMR trains do get you from A to B; but there can no longer be any excuses for delaying refurbishment. Clearly there is money floating about for refurbishment (the 185 one to demonstrate that - and I seem to have read that the 376s are getting one too?); so the “there is no money” argument is null and void.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Oct 2023 ==

I thought very much the same when I read yesterday that TPE are to have the 185’s refurbished again. Most of my rail travel is with EMR and so I am now quite used to their tatty trains. A few weeks ago I travelled between Sheffield and Manchester on a TPE 185 and in comparison to EMR it felt like a new train.

If I have the choice between EMR’s stock and a TPE 185 or Northern 170, I always go for Northern or TPE due to how much better the interior is.

 

[45076]

Me waiting for the 170 internal refurb

 

[QSK19]

Me waiting for the 170 internal refurb

Haha - couldn’t have put my sentiments better myself

 

[ynglwz]

I've noticed that the Class 170 trains on EMR are quite common, yet whenever I board one, I still see green seats, likely from the west midlands train era? (Don't know if that is correct or not )Are there any updates on when the interiors will be refurbished to match EMR branding?

 

[lxfe_mxtterz]

I've noticed that the Class 170 trains on EMR are quite common, yet whenever I board one, I still see green seats, likely from the west midlands train era? (Don't know if that is correct or not )Are there any updates on when the interiors will be refurbished to match EMR branding?

I was wondering the same...

Some of their ex-Scotrail 170s are in an absolutely appalling state - shabby, filthy and (quite literally) falling apart. See attached photos taken on two separate units.

I note they also have stickers on the windows promising a "refresh on the horizon" and "comfy seats and more space" but I haven't seen very much about it.

(Photos show a myriad of horrors including a wall pillar coming loose from the windows, air vents caked in dust, a "Standard Class" sticker lazily slapped onto the ceiling - wonky and crumpled, a broken armrest wrapped in black tape and general wear and tear).

 

[ynglwz]

I was wondering the same...

Some of their ex-Scotrail 170s are in an absolutely appalling state - shabby, filthy and (quite literally) falling apart. See attached photos taken on two separate units.

(Photos show a myriad of horrors including a wall pillar coming loose from the windows, air vents caked in dust, a "Standard Class" sticker lazily slapped onto the ceiling - wonky and crumpled, a broken armrest wrapped in black tape and general wear and tear).

WOW! that's unbelievable. That looks horrendous!

 

[Killingworth]

The Scotrail 170s now with Northern seemed to be refurbished into their colours inside and out very quickly - although former EMR 156s stll seem to await internal work.

 

[ynglwz]

The Scotrail 170s now with Northern seemed to be refurbished into their colours inside and out very quickly - although former EMR 156s stll seem to await internal work.

Most of the EMR class 170's i have seen externally have EMR livery but there are still some that have not.

 

[LowLevel]

The Scotrail 170s now with Northern seemed to be refurbished into their colours inside and out very quickly - although former EMR 156s stll seem to await internal work.

A very quick and easy refurbishment that one but successful in that it produced a train that felt like new.

As for the EMR sets who knows, apparently work continues on the subject but still no firm timescales or spec released.

 

[ChrisC]

A very quick and easy refurbishment that one but successful in that it produced a train that felt like new.

As for the EMR sets who knows, apparently work continues on the subject but still no firm timescales or spec released.

I travelled on one of the Northern 170’s recently a few months ago from York to Harrogate. I agree it felt like a new train.

The EMR interiors, although dirty and tatty, are at least comfortable. I hope that they eventually get the same sort or refurbishment as the Northern ones. Please let’s not have the comfortable seats replaced with ironing board seats.

In EMR’s defence, at least unlike some other TOC’s there are very few cancellations and the trains do actually turn up. The staff on the trains are usually very friendly and helpful too.

 

[Merle Haggard]

As the 170s arrived after the 360s logically the latter will be 'refreshed' first.
So, when the 360s are all done, we'll know the 170 refresh is imminent

 

[317 forever]

Reading Today's Railways it says that the Cross Country 170s are due for a refurbishment as they are in a poor condition.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought EMRs 170s have been equaly as long or even longer without a refurb. It makes no sense why our units can't be included in the work.

We could soon see 170s at places like Derby where Cross Country have lovely refurbished trains whilst EMR passengers travel on tatty worn out crap.

It just needs Jim Bowen to stand on the platform telling EMR passengers to go over to XC and "come and have a look at what you could have won" to complete the ultimate insult.

PS It's Miles birthday and they've been busy putting up adverts showing him going on dates with his girlfriend. If EMR had the same passion for service standards as they do for Miles we might get somewhere.

A difference may be that the original franchise with Abellio did not specify refurbishing their 170s. Now there might also be the view that they are only "for short local journeys" so not in need for refurb as much as those in the XC fleet.

 

[beano900]

They’ve started using these intermittently on the Liverpool to Norwich service. I haven’t noticed them being particularly scruffy (no worse than the tired 158s) - the main issue is capacity. Not as many seats as the 158s so the already busy services are crammed, especially those services where they decide to send a single set of two.

 

[ScotGG]

They're almost as bad as Networkers now. Need work asap