EMA scrapped

[yorksrob]

I suppose that's one valid criticism of the EMA. If you're in sixth form, you're there by choice, so you shouldn't need a learning agreement. Either learn or get kicked out.

 

[Pumbaa]

Now don't think I have a downer on students, but information published today seems to point the finger at further education being an easy way to avoid working. In 2010 697,351 people applied to go to Uni in Autumn 2010. Of those, 210,022 were unsuccessful due to limited places. So for 487,329 places, applications were over-subscribed by 43%.

It seems that the unique quality of a degree may become diluted due to the popularity of people studying for them.

If we look at the figures closer, you can see that

- Applicants aged 18, 17 and under were down by 14.7% on last year
- Applications aged 19, 20 and 21 typically had a 10% rise
- Mature students above the age of 24 had rises of up to 14%

So inferred from that, you have gap year students entering education as planned, less straight from HE having been put off by fees hike, and a lot of mature students eager to get in before their access to subsidised childcare, skillstart and extra support to keep families going etc is cut off.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/04/university-applications-rise-2011?INTCMP=SRCH

 

[Oswyntail]

Now don't think I have a downer on students, but information published today seems to point the finger at further education being an easy way to avoid working. In 2010 697,351 people applied to go to Uni in Autumn 2010. Of those, 210,022 were unsuccessful due to limited places. So for 487,329 places, applications were over-subscribed by 43%.

It seems that the unique quality of a degree may become diluted due to the popularity of people studying for them.

IMHO, one of the prime drivers of the expansion in degree provision, and the target of 50% going on to further study, was an attempt to take those numbers out of the employment figures. Same applies to raising the school leaving age.

 

[Z12XE]

Good riddance.

Agreed

I went to college before all this EMA stuff, although the College did a special train ticket - £80 for the term, but I didn't expect the tax payer to pay for this.

Its about time this freeloader/everyones a victim society came to an end

 

[NSEFAN]

When I did my A levels, a lot of my friends got EMA, but they really didn't need it, nor did they use it towards school. One of them would use it exclusively for games and cinema tickets!

I agree with the people who've already said that the money should go to the college to pay for transport and school supplies. At least the money wouldn't be wasted, assuming the school is well run, of course!

 

[Eng274]

I suppose that's one valid criticism of the EMA. If you're in sixth form, you're there by choice, so you shouldn't need a learning agreement. Either learn or get kicked out.

That was the attitude when I was in 5th and 6th year at high school.

The headteacher made it quite clear that pupils in these years were there by choice, and that they wouldn't tolerate a lack of effort and/or truancy; persistant cases of either were given the ultimatum; pull your socks up or get lost.

Financial bribery wouldn't have been needed to keep the keen pupils in school; if anything the lack of EMA will get rid of the driftwood who don't want to be there, and means more teacher time will be better spent on pupils who do. As for p[aying for transport etc, my school had loaned textbooks etc, and I was outside my school's catchment area so couldn't use the subsidised school bus, but I like the many other pupils outsdie the catchment, made do on the public buses.

I finished school before this EMA scheme was implemented, but I can imagine this created a huge conflict between pupils who wanted the easy money, and the staff who wanted to preserve their justifiably excellent reputation (and league table standing).

The headteacher when I was there was OBE'd and knighted for his services to education, and is now part of the schools inspectorate. I'd be interested to know his opinion of EMA.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

And what about people who do want to learn yet cannot afford it?

 

[anthony263]

And what about people who do want to learn yet cannot afford it?

Maybe the government should have something to help them but only for students from lower income backgrounds rather than practicalary everyone like the EMA system was

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Maybe the government should have something to help them but only for students from lower income backgrounds rather than practicalary everyone like the EMA system was

The EMA was for lower income students. But, some people fiddled the figures to get it.

 

[Zoe]

The headteacher made it quite clear that pupils in these years were there by choice, and that they wouldn't tolerate a lack of effort and/or truancy; persistant cases of either were given the ultimatum; pull your socks up or get lost.

Financial bribery wouldn't have been needed to keep the keen pupils in school; if anything the lack of EMA will get rid of the driftwood who don't want to be there, and means more teacher time will be better spent on pupils who do.

This won't be the case once the school leaving age is raised though.

 

[devon_metro]

less straight from HE having been put off by fees hike,

Those fees of course not applying to anybody applying/currently at University until the new limit is brought in. I will always pay £3290 + inflation regardless of whether the fees went up to 9k next year!

 

[Tom B]

I was outside my school's catchment area so couldn't use the subsidised school bus, but I like the many other pupils outsdie the catchment, made do on the public buses.

OK if you can afford it - you're in Edinburgh and so have the benefit of a properly run bus. When I was down south many people had to pay £5 a day to get to/from college.

Maybe the government should have something to help them but only for students from lower income backgrounds rather than practicalary everyone like the EMA system was

The EMA system was ostensibly for those from low income households, but the method of measuring that was suspect.

Shame the Tories aren't doing anything about all their friends tax evading!

 

[Eng274]

Shame the Tories aren't doing anything about all their friends tax evading!

Vodafone's evaded tax alone could subsidise school/college travel for every student in the UK for years. Just think how many trouser presses, moat dredgings and duck mansions that money could buy on the other hand..

It is a crass state of affairs when councils across the land have to trim a few £thousand here and there by reducing library opening hours and the like, and many other small scale but essential services. Yet HMRC are content with letting all the evaded tax escape, to the tune of £6bn depending where you read it.

I was fortunate that the bus service to school was decent, and given the choice I'd rather use the public one than the antiquated wrecks First supplied for the school buses.

School pupils in the City of Edinburgh who live more than 3 miles from the school get their bus travel to/from school subsidised, anybody within 3 miles had to pay for it themselves. There was much uproar from families who lived between 2 and 3 miles away, when the council increased it from 2 miles, therefore removing their children's entitlement to free bus travel.

 

[scotsman]

EMA is to help learning (text books/pens/etc etc). A VERY small minority use it for that (~0% in my 6th form).

Students have no right to money from the Gov for going to school, it's wrong.

No it's not! EMA is there to encourage people to stay in education without the need to worry about money issues. If it was there to help learning, all young people still in education would get it

 

[theblackwatch]

How on earth did students manage before EMA existed? Imagine, no EMA, no mobile phone bill each month and phone bought every few months....

 

[jon0844]

Didn't Vodafone agree a tax amount with Revenue & Customs? People can protest, but I thought it was case closed. Maybe ask why they were given a 'discount' instead?

 

[Eng274]

Didn't Vodafone agree a tax amount with Revenue & Customs? People can protest, but I thought it was case closed. Maybe ask why they were given a 'discount' instead?

Rather than pay back what they owed, an agreement was made that Vodafone would pay £800m, then £450m over the next four years (I do hope thats per year, not spread over 4 years..). Meaning that the £7bn bill was slashed to a 'mere' £1.25bn, and I doubt if that takes into account the up-coming years' tax due.

 

[scotsman]

Rather than pay back what they owed, an agreement was made that Vodafone would pay £800m, then £450m over the next four years (I do hope thats per year, not spread over 4 years..). Meaning that the £7bn bill was slashed to a 'mere' £1.25bn, and I doubt if that takes into account the up-coming years' tax due.

I am more than willing to organise a protest outside the Princes Street branch of vodafone if anyone is willing. Seriously.

 

[Geezertronic]

I am more than willing to organise a protest outside the Princes Street branch of vodafone if anyone is willing. Seriously.

You'd be better off finding out where the head office is and arranging the protest there. No point in causing grief for the employees of said branch as it will be them that you will affect and not the senior people who are really responsible.

I blame Liberata, it was them that messed up the IT system before Capita re-took over

 

[jon0844]

Yes, there were many protests (some bordering on violent) outside Vodafone stores in recent months, and during the student protests (as if any more money paid to HMRC would have naturally gone to pay for the tuition fees!).

 

[Tom B]

Another example in today's evening news - the Council are busy stamping out people who're calling the speaking clock because it costs too much, yet they're content to waste millions on a toy tram. Where do they get them from?!

 

[scotsman]

You'd be better off finding out where the head office is and arranging the protest there. No point in causing grief for the employees of said branch as it will be them that you will affect and not the senior people who are really responsible.

I blame Liberata, it was them that messed up the IT system before Capita re-took over

But you raise awareness to the public....

 

[Eng274]

Another example in today's evening news - the Council are busy stamping out people who're calling the speaking clock because it costs too much, yet they're content to waste millions on a toy tram. Where do they get them from?!

It says something about the attitude of the employees and the overall staff culture/work ethic that people would call up the speaking clock, partly also to feign that they're making an important call (which actually blocks their line from real calls) when there's a clock on most electronic devices. Sheer time and money wasting.

Nice job if you can get it!

 

[jon0844]

Another example in today's evening news - the Council are busy stamping out people who're calling the speaking clock because it costs too much, yet they're content to waste millions on a toy tram. Where do they get them from?!

I am not sure the two things are linked. I've worked for a council and things aren't that well coordinated (sadly). Stopping people calling the speaking clock is a good thing, irrespective of whether they're wasting money somewhere else.

 

[Tom B]

I am not sure the two things are linked. I've worked for a council and things aren't that well coordinated (sadly). Stopping people calling the speaking clock is a good thing, irrespective of whether they're wasting money somewhere else.

Quite - my point is, why is the council worrying about wasting £2,000 per year on pointless phone calls, when it is spending many times that per year on a pointless construction site that is allegedly a tramline?

 

[jon0844]

Because the council is made up of lots of departments, so it's good to do a) while doing a) doesn't mean they haven't got time to stop doing b). The money wasted on the tramline wouldn't have been saved if they'd not wasted time cutting down 'pointless phone calls'.

It's nice to think that one single person oversees everything, but it clearly doesn't work like that. Just be happy that the council has at least saved £2k to put towards the money it wastes elsewhere!

And then make sure you get more involved in the future at council meetings. My MP tells me that at most meetings there are often NO members of the public, yet a local forum for residents is full of people moaning. They seem to think that you can now get things done on a forum or a Facebook group, when local Government is still done the old fashioned way with set rules and procedures.

Anyway, I'm ranting - but people need to get more involved in the right way to stop this. We've become lazy (I include myself - I don't go to meetings either) and expect someone else to sort things. They won't. (End of rant)

 

[220010]

Im in reciept of EMA.
My parents combine income is below the poverty line.
EMA actually fuels my travel costs to/ from college.
Its £4 a time to/from Cheltenham and Gloucester :/ Which is quite worry. I get discounted bus faires so its a pound each way and then i get the bus to and from town.

As i have too much stationary I dont actually have the need to buy it at the moment.

It then also fuels what I eat at college. Normally this equals Maccy's. But sometimes its Burger King,

As I also smoke at least £6 a week does go on my fags. But I don't drink.

Admittedly most of the kids in my class waste it on booze and fags as they don't actually need it.
I do think the system is a farse.
I know of someone who works and get's EMA. I think that is slightly wrong .

 

[90019]

Quite - my point is, why is the council worrying about wasting £2,000 per year on pointless phone calls, when it is spending many times that per year on a pointless construction site that is allegedly a tramline?

Of course, you know it'll be done on the cheap and will need to be repaired not long after it's been finished (as has already been demonstrated on Princes Street. TWICE!).

If only they'd spend a little more on road repairs in general when they repair them the first time round, rather than the half arsed jobs they do now, with most potholes just appearing again within a couple of weeks, so they end up being repaired repeatedly, which will cost more in the long run.


It'd be nice if they could repair Boswall Parkway properly this time too, rather than just essentially pouring the stuff in and leaving it, like they've been doing every few weeks for the past year or so. The ironic thing being that the section that is worst was completely resurfaced a couple of years back, and the potholes now require some rather elaborate manoeuvring to avoid them.
I think my car has taken a fair bit of damage to the n/s front wheel and suspension in the past couple of weeks after hitting a few very deep potholes that I didn't see in time to avoid.
Obviously, the weather recently has taken it's toll, but it's made a fairly bad problem worse than it should be.