Elusive Super Off-Peak tickets.

[AM9]

I am trying to get the best price for a journey St Albans [SAC] to Weston-super-Mare [WSM] next Thursday (10th) to arrive at WSM before 13:30 and departing some time after 17:00. I will be using a 2 Together pass.

NRE gives an itinerary of 09:48 from SAC to London St Pancras [STP], them LU to London Paddington [PAD] to catch 11:00 to BRI then 12:53 to WSM, which is what I would expect. The cheapest ticket offered is an SVR at £61.05. It's the same on the Thameslink Mixing Deck. Using the deck's 'rollover' matrix, I can see that the super off-peak (SSR) tickets are available later in the morning but arrive at WSM too late for me.

BRFares shows that the SSR is available for £48.85 and the restrictions YU and (CI & CJ for STP transit) do not prevent travel at my intended times.

Can anybody explain why this ticket is not on offer online please?

 

[island]

The ticket restriction is coded to bar any journey arriving at St. Pancras International between 0430-1128, presumably based on code CI. In line with the so-called "Network Area Rule", "Super Off-Peak tickets issued for journeys commencing within the Network Area to destinations outside the Network Area with travel via London are valid by any train to London to connect with trains from London"; therefore, the ticket is valid but you'll need to choose later trains or buy it at the station in order for it to issue.

 

[AM9]

The ticket restriction is coded to bar any journey arriving at St. Pancras International between 0430-1128, presumably based on code CI. In line with the so-called "Network Area Rule", "Super Off-Peak tickets issued for journeys commencing within the Network Area to destinations outside the Network Area with travel via London are valid by any train to London to connect with trains from London"; therefore, the ticket is valid but you'll need to choose later trains or buy it at the station in order for it to issue.

OK that's fine, thanks. Where is that 'Network Area Rule' published in the public domain please?
Changing at Farringdon [ZFD] is my preferred route, is this a suitable alternative as some through tickets show this and others say change at STP?

I can also do a split SAC-PAD £11.10 and PAD-WSM £45.20 which is cheaper at £55.30. This will of course have the usual evening 16:30-19:01 restriction from STP north.

 

[Clip]

You know you'd get a much better reaction without using codes all the time - not everyone who knows every single one you know. Also makes a post painful to read.

 

[Hadders]

It is not unusual for booking engines to mis-interpret the Network Area Rule despite it being one of the longest standing rules in ticketing, dating back to BR days.

It forms part of the restriction code text in Avantix Traveller.

 

[LAX54]

You know you'd get a much better reaction without using codes all the time - not everyone who knows every single one you know. Also makes a post painful to read.

Thought it was just me, did not have a scooby do what he was on about... LOL or where he was going / coming from !

 

[455driver]

Deleted.

 

[martinsh]

Yep, I lost interest at SAC, and as for ZFD?

He is going to Weston Super Mare via St Pancras and Paddington, I ain't got a clue where SAC is

BRI = Bristol Temple Meads
SAC = St Albans City (I'm guessing ?)
ZFD = ???? Maybe some London Underground station ?

Totally agree about the OP BTW - I mean about the "original poster by the way"

 

[island]

ZFD will be Farringdon. It's probably easier to change there.

 

[Romilly]

The desired tickets with the desired routeing for the desired times can be bought online at Raileasy or at Virgin Trains East Coast (I haven't checked any others) by putting in Farringdon as a "via" point.

 

[yorkie]

I agree it's best to change at Farrringdon, especially on the journey back as it will be cross-platform and you will be much more likely to get a seat on the final leg.

The ticket is unrestricted between St Albans & London.

 

[Romilly]

The main relevant restriction is that the ticket cannot be used to leave Paddington before 10:10. But using the text-only version of the VT East Coast journey planner, and asking for via Farringdon and extended interchange time, the non-discounted version of the ticket (using the Two Together railcard brings its own time restrictions) is offered for various departures from St Albans between 8am and 9.30am (as well as later ones) - so some journey planners, at least, appear to be correctly interpreting the rules in this case.

 

[AM9]

OK, apologies for the abbreviations but I was working from notes made where I obviously did know the ones that I had been looking at. For what it is worth, I was in a hurry to meet a dentist's appointment. (It still hurts!)
Thanks to those who did answer with helpful posts.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I agree it's best to change at Farrringdon, especially on the journey back as it will be cross-platform and you will be much more likely to get a seat on the final leg.

The ticket is unrestricted between St Albans & London.

Actually the change is better going south on Thameslink to West on LU, - it's a cross-platform change, (albeit up about 6 steps to a higher platform).
Eastbound LU to northbound Thameslink means going over both pairs of tracks, but still much better than a walk the length of St Pancras trainshed (the Barlow bit).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

It is not unusual for booking engines to mis-interpret the Network Area Rule despite it being one of the longest standing rules in ticketing, dating back to BR days.

It forms part of the restriction code text in Avantix Traveller.

In the event of an uninformed RPO or gateline member of staff, where can I as a civvy verify this rule, - would a booking office give me a itinerary?

 

[Romilly]

In the event of an uninformed RPO or gateline member of staff, where can I as a civvy verify this rule, - would a booking office give me a itinerary?

As suggested earlier, if you book online through e.g. Virgin Trains East Coast with a via point of Farringdon you can get & print an itinerary for the 0932 or 0948 from St Albans City. If you want an itinerary for an earlier departure (and you presumably don't if you are using a Two Together railcard) then you would have to use the text-only version of their journey planner and select extended interchange times.

 

[yorkie]

Actually the change is better going south on Thameslink to West on LU...

Opps! Sorry, yes I got it the wrong way round! Of course the Thameslink platforms are south of the LU platforms as they dive under just west of Farringdon.

In the event of an uninformed RPO or gateline member of staff, where can I as a civvy verify this rule, - would a booking office give me a itinerary?

I would ask them to check if they're sure, as I believe it's valid. It's clearly mentioned in the restriction code and is a rule all well-trained RPOs in the Network Area will be familiar with.

Another tactic to avoid a dispute is to book the itinerary of your choice online. The itinerary detailed in the booking confirmation is evidence of a contract.

If they insist on incorrectly charging, I would either state I have no means to pay any additional fare and co-operate with whatever procedure they wish to undertake or alternatively pay it and seek a refund later, along with a complaint, but cross that bridge when we come to it!

Sometimes it's not a bad thing to let them charge you, as you can lodge a proper complaint. If they let you off they are never re-trained appropriately and they just end up incorrectly charging someone else. I suspect a significant amount of money is incorrectly gained in this way, as some people just pay up and don't know how to get their money back.