Electrostar to Aventra

[sjoh]

Bombardier's replacements for the Electrostar family are soon to be a fairly common sight around London and the South East. I've had a quick look but couldn't really find much in the way of comparison/similarity information about the two.

I was wondering if anyone was aware of the design and engineering similarities and differences between the two (aside from the obvious differences in appearance).

Additionally, whilst it's rather a moot point, I was wondering if Bombardier have a diesel equivalent product (a la the Turbostar to the Electrostar).

Thanks!

 

[Roast Veg]

Bombardier currently have no diesel products on the market, and doesn't seem to be bidding on diesel contracts (so it's pretty safe to assume there won't be one any time soon). One obvious similarity with some Turbostars and Voyager family units is the use of the FLEXX Eco bogies.

 

[dubscottie]

I can't see any difference either other than windows instead of the ribbon glazing used on very early units.

In effect the Aventra is a Mk 6 version of the first Electrostar.

On a side note the original version of the FLEXX bogie will be 26 years old this year.

 

[LLivery]

To me the Aventras look like a new generation of Networker. Even the artist impression of the 341 (BRs proposal for Crossrail) barring the cab, doesn't look that different.

 

[D365]

To me the Aventras look like a new generation of Networker. Even the artist impression of the 341 (BRs proposal for Crossrail) barring the cab, doesn't look that different.

Tell you what, that description isn't all that inaccurate!

 

[47802]

I can't see any difference either other than windows instead of the ribbon glazing used on very early units.

In effect the Aventra is a Mk 6 version of the first Electrostar.

On a side note the original version of the FLEXX bogie will be 26 years old this year.

That's a bit like saying a Mk1 BMW Mini is the same as Mk3 BMW Mini they might look a bit similar but engineering wise they are totally different, I expect its the case with Aventra. For starters the Aventra appears to be a much more flexible platform in terms of door placement eg 3 doors per side on a Crossrail unit. The Flexx bogie may be a few years old but so what if it meets the requirements and it hasn't been used on UK Bombardier EMU's before.

If you look at article in Railway Technology type publications you will find articles which state that Bombardier started off with virtually a blank piece of paper and spent significant time and effort developing this new train to meet the requirements of train operators going forward. What's the current Aventra order about 2259 carriages so they must be doing something right.

 

[D365]

What's the current Aventra order about 2259 carriages so they must be doing something right.

By my estimates that's got to be at least as many as the number of Electrostar carriages that have been produced in total, and this with orders that have been placed in the last three years. Not to mention that it seems the Aventra has stolen the spotlight from the Desiro City. Impressive stuff indeed.

 

[physics34]

By my estimates that's got to be at least as many as the number of Electrostar carriages that have been produced in total, and this with orders that have been placed in the last three years. Not to mention that it seems the Aventra has stolen the spotlight from the Desiro City. Impressive stuff indeed.

But then i can see it falling of a cliff for a while.... then of course in 7-10 years mk3-based DMUs and EMUs will need to be replaced, followed by 158/159

 

[D365]

But then i can see it falling of a cliff for a while.... then of course in 7-10 years mk3-based DMUs and EMUs will need to be replaced, followed by 158/159

The DMU replacement programme will need to be ramped up sooner rather than later, but how many Mk3-based EMUs will be left once the Aventras are in service?

 

[47802]

The DMU replacement programme will need to be ramped up sooner rather than later, but how many Mk3-based EMUs will be left once the Aventras are in service?

Well yes and some newer EMU's are going to be available for cascade. The key issue will be whether they get the new tube train contract with Hitachi or not.

I think they are going to have to look very strongly at producing a Bi-mode/Diesel train.

 

[AlexNL]

If there's enough demand for a diesel or bi-mode Aventra, then Bombardier will develop one.

People once said the same thing about the Stadler FLIRT: "it will never run on diesel". Stadler are building them for a couple of operators as we speak.