Electrostar GTR cascade

[Class377/5]

377 training has started at one of the SE depots....

Tonbridge depot has been driving 377s for many years with Thameslink ones included from 2009 (hence having some FCC branded 377/5 at Tonbridge once due to snowy conditions).

 

[ComUtoR]

Tonbridge depot has been driving 377s for many years with Thameslink ones included from 2009 (hence having some FCC branded 377/5 at Tonbridge once due to snowy conditions).

I apologise. I didn't see any real need to be that pedantic as I thought it was obvious. Training has started at one of our depots that do not operate 377's This depot also sign different routes.

We now have additional Drivers being trained on 377's and 319's and soon to be 700's (allegedly)

 

[Class377/5]

I apologise. I didn't see any real need to be that pedantic as I thought it was obvious. Training has started at one of our depots that do not operate 377's This depot also sign different routes.

We now have additional Drivers being trained on 377's and 319's and soon to be 700's (allegedly)

Well our first 700 will start carrying passengers in Kent proper soon enough!

 

[ScotGG]

How long after training begins do services generally commence?

I guess it depends on 700 introduction to ensure 377s can change over and that seems to be speeding up now after a slow start.

 

[Class377/5]

How long after training begins do services generally commence?

I guess it depends on 700 introduction to ensure 377s can change over and that seems to be speeding up now after a slow start.

SE already has 6x 377 borrowed from Thameslink. The difference come a few weeks is they don't link to Thameslink anymore. Its more a diagram change initially with rolling changes coming over the next few months.

 

[Alteran Ancient]

SE already has 6x 377 borrowed from Thameslink. The difference come a few weeks is they don't link to Thameslink anymore. Its more a diagram change initially with rolling changes coming over the next few months.

Hence why they normally have a TL 377 pair tucked away in Victoria Eastern Sidings during most of the day. Been that way for several years, if I am not mistaken.

 

[Class377/5]

Hence why they normally have a TL 377 pair tucked away in Victoria Eastern Sidings during most of the day. Been that way for several years, if I am not mistaken.

Actually its two pairs. Other cycles via Bellingham being swaped over.

Will be intreseting to see how SE comes to use the fleet. Guessing it won't soon be long until they run off peak.

 

[Class 466]

Maintenance moves to and from Selhurst are now in the system from the December TT change, with the first units expected to be handed over very soon. 8 in time for this timetable change with them initially sticking to their current workings with more on the Maidstone East line as more units arrive.

An example of the moves is: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W88616/2017/01/03/advanced

There are also moves to and from Stewarts Lane.

 

[Class377/5]

Maintenance moves to and from Selhurst are now in the system from the December TT change, with the first units expected to be handed over very soon. 8 in time for this timetable change with them initially sticking to their current workings with more on the Maidstone East line as more units arrive.

An example of the moves is: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W88616/2017/01/03/advanced

There are also moves to and from Stewarts Lane.

Initially units are already been formed up and some are being used on the SE 377 services.

 

[387star]

Are these 377/1smthough or ex tl units

 

[Class455]

Initially units are already been formed up and some are being used on the SE 377 services.

Any idea which units these are?

 

[Kite159]

Are these 377/1smthough or ex tl units

All 377/1s are southern, Thameslink only had the dual voltage 2s & 5s

(Excluding hired in units for London Bridge - Brighton services)

 

[SF-02]

Any estimated timeframe for when Metro services can benefit?

 

[ScotGG]

I wonder what the % increase in capacity will be for individual lines with this cascade?

I looked into station usage numbers on Wikipedia (I know...) and many stations in Kent, such as on the Maidstone East line mentioned above, have seen pretty much no growth for 5 years, if not 10. Is that because they are so busy thus suppressed demand?

On the other hand, most Metro lines have growth which is far faster. About 5% a year on most lines, and a fair few stations in double figures for a few years in a row.

 

[urpert]

I wonder what the % increase in capacity will be for individual lines with this cascade?

I looked into station usage numbers on Wikipedia (I know...) and many stations in Kent, such as on the Maidstone East line mentioned above, have seen pretty much no growth for 5 years, if not 10. Is that because they are so busy thus suppressed demand?

On the other hand, most Metro lines have growth which is far faster. About 5% a year on most lines, and a fair few stations in double figures for a few years in a row.

Poor Maidstone has a pretty terrible service compared to similarly sized towns in Kent, and the M20 is pretty convenient.

 

[Class 466]

These are ex TL 377/5 units. As posted above some are already formed up and working the current 377 workings.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Any estimated timeframe for when Metro services can benefit?

As more units become available to SE. The first ones won't make any difference as they're working solely the same Diagrams as they do on SE at the moment.

 

[physics34]

Purple 377/5s should be on southern soon, strengthening the MK services and peak metro servics........ but then again the MK service are suspended until the drivers overtime ban ends.!!

Apart from the SOuthern logo on the bodyside instead of the Thameslink one, i cant see any livery change taking place.

 

[Class455]

Purple 377/5s should be on southern soon, strengthening the MK services and peak metro servics........ but then again the MK service are suspended until the drivers overtime ban ends.!!

Apart from the Southern logo on the bodyside instead of the Thameslink one, i cant see any livery change taking place.

I would have thought they would get a repaint in the near future. The 171's did when Southern took them on, but in the 377/5's case, they already had a Southern Interior. I'm pretty surprised though as they do not contain doors for First Class, unlike the older 377/4's, but then they would only need one area for first class if they're being used on Metro services, like the 377/6's.

 

[387star]

377/5 have doors for first class

I thought the southern liveried 377/2 were to return first

 

[physics34]

I would have thought they would get a repaint in the near future. The 171's did when Southern took them on, but in the 377/5's case, they already had a Southern Interior. I'm pretty surprised though as they do not contain doors for First Class, unlike the older 377/4's, but then they would only need one area for first class if they're being used on Metro services, like the 377/6's.

its a money thing these days. The 377/5s are having a "paint job overhaul" at the moment.. with the FCC vinyls being removed and the purple livery underneath getting a scrub up. This keeps them going for a few more years.

Its obvious that GTR are not gonna spend money on full repaints, the Scotrail 171s were probably due a full repaint....maybe due to corrosion.

Maybe the 377/5s will get part southern vinyls, who knows, but pretty much doubt they will get complete vinyls as its expensive.

Interesting to see what the 377/1s get.... and whether Southeasterns budget is there to repaint them in blue and get internal SE refurb.

 

[387star]

How did fcc afford to re vinyl their entire fleet within months of takeover in 2006 ??????

 

[43074]

How did fcc afford to re vinyl their entire fleet within months of takeover in 2006 ��

It wasn't really within months though was it? Certainly I remember NSE liveried 365s still running (with FCC branding) in 2007, and the 12 317s on GN were still carrying wagn livery for quite a while after as well.

 

[387star]

Regarding 377s when the guard makes announcements I often struggle to hear from the coach they are being made is this normally the case ?

 

[Alteran Ancient]

Regarding 377s when the guard makes announcements I often struggle to hear from the coach they are being made is this normally the case ?

I've noticed this as well. I would imagine that this is to prevent feedback from occurring when the guard is using the PA.

 

[physics34]

How did fcc afford to re vinyl their entire fleet within months of takeover in 2006 ��

different kind of franchise. BAsicaly GTR are cost cutting everywhere they can to save money. FCC wanted their brand everywhere and had the budget to do that.

 

[ScotGG]

Interesting to see what the 377/1s get.... and whether Southeasterns budget is there to repaint them in blue and get internal SE refurb.

I really doubt any refurb will occur. The 25 year old Networkers (excluding 465/9) have never really had any refurb and are often very grotty. The 10 year old 376s are also pretty tatty now. If they wont fund those then no chance elsewhere.

 

[Roast Veg]

Switching from internal to external for a minute - the livery work in SE has always been mad. Since the 375s and 376s came in connex white/grey with yellow doors, and the Networkers had all been done up in the same way, the first action SE took was to start replacing yellows with blue/lilac, but it wasn't done in any kind of coherent way, so we were left with multiple different blue doors on the 375s, some units had the grey taken off altogether instead of painting dark blue over it, leaving them just yellow and white, some were untouched apart from logos, and some had the full white/blue with lilac door treatment.

The networkers were more consistent externally, and SE did get around to giving all the 465s and 466s the white/blue lilac door livery at about the same time as the Hitachi retractioning. Eventually they settled on using the high speed colours on the 375s, and as we have seen they are now finally approaching homogenous. As for the 376s, they were always the lowest on the list for having an external paintjob because they were the newest and cleanest. Now with TfL looking hungry for them, they won't be touched until they change hands.

The 377s could even be sent for the refresh the 375s are having, which would make them virtually identical, but I think that will be up to the next franchisee.

 

[Class 466]

Purple 377/5s should be on southern soon, strengthening the MK services and peak metro servics........ but then again the MK service are suspended until the drivers overtime ban ends.!!

Apart from the SOuthern logo on the bodyside instead of the Thameslink one, i cant see any livery change taking place.

Plans changed. 377/5s to Sountheastern now. 377/2s on MK services.

 

[physics34]

Plans changed. 377/5s to Sountheastern now. 377/2s on MK services.

So 377/1s and 5s to southeastern? That leaves southern short.

 

[Fincra5]

So 377/1s and 5s to southeastern? That leaves southern short.

I'd imagine its just 377/5's to SE not the 1 series. As yes that would leave SN short.