dk1
Veteran Member
Many Brits do seem to revel in negativity for some reason.
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Eleanor LNER Doll
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IlkleyRunner
Member
It's the weather....
Conversely, 'comical' wording on a sticker for reporting damage to the carriage basically costs pennies on a sign which was going to be added with or without the 'comedy'. Whereas reinforcing embankments to prevent breaches is logistically difficult and costs a lot of money and in many cases disruption.
While I'd love the railway to fix all its problems all the time, I appreciate it's not really feasible to do all of this at once, and in the meantime I don't see what harm there is in getting a doll made up for kids (or adults I suppose!)
Haywain
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Yes, it's always too cold and too wet. Except when it's too hot and too dry.
Tetragon213
Member
When you have suffered the indignity of travelling by ClownCountry for 90% of your journeys, you do tend to develop a very negative view of the railway...
It takes all sorts
But I do think the railways are at a low point right now.
Granted we have new rolling stock and more routes opening up, but the prevailing sense I have is that the passenger is not being served well.
I'm old enough to remember BR and certainly don't have rose-tinted spectacles or nostalgia for diesel (well, maybe a bit...) but the ticketing mess (designed I am fairly sure to extract cash), the ToCs that don't give a monkeys about each other (no holding of trains for a few mins delayed connection), the poor reliability, Cross Country's toilets on wheels...
You may well be right that these are problems not exclusive to the UK, but it's pretty bad.
Deepgreen
Established Member
I find the ad very annoying, BUT, I wonder if there is any empirical evidence of its success. In almost all advertising, it is impossible to know these things, and it is only an assumption that if customer numbers increase in parallel with a particular marketing campaign, that the campaign is responsible. I find it very hard to know who it is aimed at - the characterless doll would strongly imply children, but they are not the decision-makers in the choice of transport. I file it in the 'see it, say it, sorted' drawer...
As in, something which has become almost universally known and therefore quite effective?
YorksLad12
Established Member
Thing to remember is that that advert is not aimed at members of this forum. We're not part of the brief to the agency. As such, I think it works well as a pitch to people who don't know that trains can also get caught up in a jam (of sorts).
Mind you, I try and avoid TV ads, so I'd never have seen it if it hadn't been posted here!
Mind you, I try and avoid TV ads, so I'd never have seen it if it hadn't been posted here!
dk1
Veteran Member
No sign of a rainless day in the next fortnight either.
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The refurbed Voyager released today should help
LNER are probably doing marketing mix modelling which will give them a good idea as to what is working and what is not.
Most advertising spend in the Western world is now digital which is incredibly easy to track, so the idea that "in almost all advertising it is impossible to know these things" is very far off the mark.
Tetragon213
Member
Dear gods, they're staying?!The refurbed Voyager released today should help
insert Psycho-shower-scream picture here
The railway gods have truly forsaken us
My biggest pet peeve with ClownCountry has always been the cataclysmic overcrowding. I'm not entirely convinced a makeover will fix the core issue of their total and utter inability to manage the crowds.
I feel as though there's a general shift towards having a mascot of some sort. SWR has the pigeon and seagull characters, EMR has Miles, LNER has Eleanor, AWC has the tortoise, and GA has the hare. It must be at least somewhat effective, otherwise they wouldn't all be copying each other!
Deepgreen
Established Member
No, as in something so annoying that I try to block it out! No-one can know how effective the 'see it' campaign has been, but most people seem to find it annoying. Whether more issues are being reported because of it is impossible to know.
Here’s the rub: LNER have a doll mascot; LDS - SOU has this many ticket price variations, including an off-peak single that’s the same price as the return. There were too many to count. How does this help passengers at all?
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bcarmicle
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I fail to see the connection between an LNER marketing campagin and a CrossCountry priced route. However, it is not unusual for returns to be slightly more than the cost of a single, as has been discussed on the forum elsewhere before.
The number of fares available isn't the issue, it is how they are retailed and which choices are shown to the customer. People don't moan about the complexity of air fares because they never get to see it.Here’s the rub: LNER have a doll mascot; LDS - SOU has this many ticket price variations, including an off-peak single that’s the same price as the return. There were too many to count. How does this help passengers at all?
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I’m thinking more broadly about the superficial silliness of a marketing campaign juxtaposed with a ridiculously complex ticketing system. I could have picked an LNER route if that would help you. As a passenger I feel more than a little bit like someone is having a laugh at my (literal) expense.
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Why do there need to be dozens of different prices? Really? Single, return, peak, off peak. Advance tickets are nerve-wracking on any multistage routes. Most of the tickets are a few quid difference in price. It doesn’t make sense, if you are a consumer. In my world there‘d just be one ticket for a journey, valid at any time or any train. Then we could all relax. I’ll let someone else work out how much this would cost.
And which does not require a mobile phone or a bank account either to buy or to use. You just hand over ordinary money and get an ordinary piece of cardboard. No third parties involved.
I would consider that a vast improvement over the current complex exclusionary mess.
You can already pay in cash for a paper ticket though. And you won't be charged a penny for the privilege either. We're not Sweden.
tfw756rider
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Sounds familiar.
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Joe Paxton
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Though a not inconsiderable number of people do (or indeed avoid doing) various things so as to not play along with said tracking.
It’s not remotely ‘impossible’. As said previously there are very sophisticated methods of judging reach, including to which age groups and via which channels and then commercial activity thereafter in terms of increased visits to website/ booking engines and other research feedback etc. This information is routinely provided to whichever company it is that has commissioned the advert. This can be as specific as down to what time the advert was shown or what type of programme was on tv at the time and the age groups who it’s resonated most or least with and the associated increased purchases (or not) by those groups.
There are few assumptions in reality. The fact there’s a second advert after a reasonable gap from the first strongly suggests that the metrics show that it’s working. There’s a reason that the advertising during daytime tv, eg ITV3 is different from that on ITV1 in the evening. Alongside this the ads that people see on places like Facebook/ Insta/ streaming services with ads are driven by demographics, browsing patterns, purchase histories etc.
My own organisation knows exactly when and where and how to advertise to reach the demographic we’re looking at and this is backed up by enquiry, engagement and purchasing data etc.
To repeat, it’s not aimed at people who use trains regularly now or who are rail enthusiasts.
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Exactly.
All s/he needs is an LNER sash. The dolls would sell quicker than the tickets.
WAO
Tetragon213
Member
Iirc EMR put out a limited edition run of their own plushie Miles, and they sold out pretty fast!
LNER could make an absolute killing selling a plush of their own, I reckon.
Mikey C
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Perfect for punishing young children, by giving them nightmares
This relates to another thread about Americanisms! When did we start saying ‘plush toy’? I’ve always known them as ‘soft’ toys!
I’d be first in line for an Eleanor soft toy!
Tetragon213
Member
It's no less terrifying than either the Elmo I had as a child, or the Furby my parents had!Perfect for punishing young children, by giving them nightmares
I'd argue that's not completely true. There are numerous tickets which can only be bought online.
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This is the approach that Scotland has moved towards, and there have been no reports on here of it causing chaos that I'm aware of.
No it hasn't. Over 100 fares between Glasgow and Edinburgh alone:
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