(Edited) Could some class 755 FLIRTS be procured for the Thames Valley?

[Nicholas43]

I recently had the pleasure of travelling from Stowmarket (incidentally, what a lovely station!) to Bury St Edmunds. It struck me that the, also lovely, 755 was a bit wasted, because (I think) it was only electric from Ipswich to Stowmarket.
If The Railway had a Guiding Mind, would it think it a Good Idea to deploy 755s on Paddington Reading Goring (etc) Didcot Oxford services? (And to send the 769s to crawl back under their stone?)

 

[MarkyT]

I recently had the pleasure of travelling from Stowmarket (incidentally, what a lovely station!) to Bury St Edmunds. It struck me that the, also lovely, 755 was a bit wasted, because (I think) it was only electric from Ipswich to Stowmarket.
If The Railway had a Guiding Mind, would it think it a Good Idea to deploy 755s on Paddington Reading Goring (etc) Didcot Oxford services? (And to send the 769s to crawl back under their stone?)

Alternatively, now most of the track layout alterations in the Oxford area are in sight of the finish line, the resignalling has been completed and the station alterations are planned and ready to be implemented, there really is no further excuse for not completing wiring from Didcot so existing GWR emus can take over local service.

 

[JonathanH]

It struck me that the, also lovely, 755 was a bit wasted, because (I think) it was only electric from Ipswich to Stowmarket.

It is difficult to see what the grounds are for the concern. They are doing well in the Anglia operation regardless of how much electric running they do.

What are you going to backfill the Anglia operation with, noting that Norwich Crown Point is an entirely Stadler depot now? The 755s also operate on electric from Ely to Stansted and South of Ipswich.

It would be great to see the 755 fleet used more intensively, perhaps taking over Norwich to Peterborough or Nottingham, but keeping them in East Anglia is entirely appropriate.

Some time later in the decade GWR can consider its future fleet without needing to take the existing 755s on.

If The Railway had a Guiding Mind, would it think it a Good Idea to deploy 755s on Paddington Reading Goring (etc) Didcot Oxford services? (And to send the 769s to crawl back under their stone?)

There is no plan to use 769s on this service in any case.

 

[jackot]

I recently had the pleasure of travelling from Stowmarket (incidentally, what a lovely station!) to Bury St Edmunds. It struck me that the, also lovely, 755 was a bit wasted, because (I think) it was only electric from Ipswich to Stowmarket.
If The Railway had a Guiding Mind, would it think it a Good Idea to deploy 755s on Paddington Reading Goring (etc) Didcot Oxford services? (And to send the 769s to crawl back under their stone?)

However great it would be for GWR to have some lovely Bi-Mode Stadlers, I can't really see why taking them away from GA would be a good idea, especially when you would need to replace them with something else - do you suggest sending them a small fleet of GWR turbos that they have no facilities to maintain?

Some time later in the decade GWR can consider its future fleet without needing to take the existing 755s on.

Exactly, GWR really need to get their own fleet of (proper) Tri-Modes to replace the Turbos and 769s (if they ever enter service) in the long term on Cardiff to Portsmouth, Thames Valley and North Downs - rather than taking on their own micro-fleet of Bi-Modes that are already needed at Greater Anglia for a small number of services.

 

[Nicholas43]

Thanks to above posters. I take the point that keeping Anglia's fleet simple is a good idea. Any views on the chance of buying FLIRTs for Reading - Oxford (and beyond?) stoppers, given that electrification to Oxford is a long way off, and may never happen?

 

[RailWonderer]

Thanks to above posters. I take the point that keeping Anglia's fleet simple is a good idea. Any views on the chance of buying FLIRTs for Reading - Oxford (and beyond?) stoppers, given that electrification to Oxford is a long way off, and may never happen?

Head in the clouds I'm afraid. This new PM has launched austerity round 2 with likely significant cuts to rail incoming. Fewer new train orders accross the board, especially with interest rates on the rise. The turbos are being refurbished and are in a good state to run for another decade. new orders will likely go to Scotrail (Transport Scotland gets a lump sum to spend as they like) or a follow on order for Northern if that. Cascades are more likely for GWR if they can't get their act together with 769s.

 

[MarkyT]

Thanks to above posters. I take the point that keeping Anglia's fleet simple is a good idea. Any views on the chance of buying FLIRTs for Reading - Oxford (and beyond?) stoppers, given that electrification to Oxford is a long way off, and may never happen?

All the preparatory work that can make electrification lower cost and risk is now complete or is about to be carried out; resignalling, track layout remodelling, station reconstruction. With the fallback of being able to continue using turbos or 769s, a modest extension of wires to Oxford should be possible and economic in the short to medium term, then GWR can simply use Electrostars on stopping services that terminate among the dreaming spires. Beyond Oxford would still be an issue clearly, and that's where a small fleet of new bi-mode or battery trains of a lower spec than the 80x would come in handy. Perhaps some of the Electrostars might be retrofitted with some traction batteries for off-grid excursions.

 

[JonathanH]

Thanks to above posters. I take the point that keeping Anglia's fleet simple is a good idea. Any views on the chance of buying FLIRTs for Reading - Oxford (and beyond?) stoppers, given that electrification to Oxford is a long way off, and may never happen?

In the grand scheme of things the existing arrangement of London to Didcot 387s and Didcot to Oxford Turbos is not the kind of thing that is going to lead to different trains being procured just to run through services.

As other posters point out, if electrification happens the trains will run through from Paddington to Oxford again. Until then, they won't. It really isn't a big enough deal.

 

[tbtc]

Any views on the chance of buying FLIRTs for Reading - Oxford (and beyond?) stoppers, given that electrification to Oxford is a long way off, and may never happen?

The complicating factors here (in my mind) are along the lines of “Microfleets are not ideal, so can any additional GWR class replace sufficient 165/166s to make enough of a dent in those classes too”, FLIRTS would presumably be good for the Redhill/Gatwick services, not sure there’s enough power supply between Reading and Basingstoke for bi-modes to make that much of a difference - ditto Bedwyn - certainly not much need for them on the West Country routes that the Turbos were cascaded into…

…which leaves the awkward question of what to do with the Thames Valley branches, which can only really be served if there’s some annoying compromises (too tiny for a microfleet, too short/slow for a four coach 100mph 387 if ever wired, do we hand them over to 230s (might as well treat Greenford as being in the same ball park as Windsor/ Marlow etc)?

Ordering just enough FLIRTS to operate only the London-Oxford services seems insufficient but where do you draw the line? (There’s then the problem that reducing the pure diesel fleet at Reading to a handful of 165s for Newbury/Basingstoke/Bedwyn would similarly mean the problems associated with a microfleet - despite the fact that there are routes crying out for more DMU carriages - e.g. GWR’s Portsmouth services seems a fairly deserving cause to be beefed up)

I agree with the points about some harsh austerity ahead of us. Mind you, Sunak is another Oxford graduate like all PMs (Gordon Brown went to Edinburgh, the only exception to the tide of Oxford people running the country), so I suppose I wouldn’t be surprised if he made an exception and found money for that “postponed” electrification to go ahead when the cuts start coming to the “Provincial” network (or, at least, it’ll look a lot less than a network by the time this bunch have finished starting it of funds!)