Edinburgh/Newcastle

[LondonJohn]

I am flying into Edinburgh Airport with hold luggage on a flight from London City and heading into Newcastle.

This will be on a Saturday morning. I can see a few advance fares but its always the iffy question how long do you allow for flight delays, the time to reclaim luggage and haad to the city before booking a train. Not enough and you are worrying until you either miss the train or only just make it or arriving hours before your train after getting to Waverly Station 25 mins after touchdown.

Are there any good tips on splitting to give a ticket with more flexibility or is it a case of looking at the calling points of the train and seeing whats about.

I don't have a railcard and it will be on a Saturday in March

 

[jopsuk]

can I enquire why on earth you're travelling that way? Surely it would have been more sensible to fly from Heathrow or Gatwick to newcastle, or indeed to have caught a train direct? This seems like an extraordinaryarily obtuse way to travel from London to Newcastle!

 

[34D]

I am flying into Edinburgh Airport with hold luggage on a flight from London City and heading into Newcastle.

This will be on a Saturday morning. I can see a few advance fares but its always the iffy question how long do you allow for flight delays, the time to reclaim luggage and haad to the city before booking a train. Not enough and you are worrying until you either miss the train or only just make it or arriving hours before your train after getting to Waverly Station 25 mins after touchdown.

Are there any good tips on splitting to give a ticket with more flexibility or is it a case of looking at the calling points of the train and seeing whats about.

I don't have a railcard and it will be on a Saturday in March

A couple of points re flights:

-would your travel insurance cover a missed rail journey
-if your flight is delayed (or you delayed travelling to the rail station) are you happy with your advance being 'lost' and having to purchase a fresh ticket?
-unless there is a huge saving such that the gamble is worth it, I would be inclined to consider just buying on the day

Finally, I would be failing in my duty as a railway employee if I didn't suggest a london kings cross - newcastle train, instead of flying to Edinburgh.

can I enquire why on earth you're travelling that way? Surely it would have been more sensible to fly from Heathrow or Gatwick to newcastle, or indeed to have caught a train direct? This seems like an extraordinaryarily obtuse way to travel from London to Newcastle!

Thought that but didn't say it. I did wonder whether it was a connection from a flight elsewhere. Or simply personal choice.

I would compare london-newcastle fares with whatever you'll have to pay for ed-newcastle though - just in case.

 

[Jock]

As a thought, why not try the operator specific tickets, those which are routed 'XC ONLY' (Cross Country) or 'EC ONLY' though I'm not sure the latter exsists for Newcastle as a destination anymore.

That way you are not tied down to a particular train, however you are tied down to a particular operator which means the most you will have to wait in EDB is approx 1hr, should you miss the Cross Country Connection

 

[Eagle]

Get a ticket from Haymarket, not Edinburgh Waverley (it'll be the same price). There's a shuttle bus between Haymarket and the airport.

 

[90019]

Get a ticket from Haymarket, not Edinburgh Waverley (it'll be the same price). There's a shuttle bus between Haymarket and the airport.

The 100 goes all the way to Waverley Bridge, stopping at Haymarket along the way.

 

[cuccir]

I've done this journey (Edinburgh airport to Newcastle that is) before (once). When I did it I booked an advance but left about 4 hours gap: my flight was delayed by 2 so I'm glad that I did!

Edinburgh airport is relatively small but not the tiniest. I don't recall any significant difficulties in getting through it. The bus route is fine but on single carriageway roads: I can imagine that it could get snarled up at peak times. If you're travelling early on a Saturday though I don't see that being a problem. Nonetheless, I'd not expect to be in the city centre any sooner than 45 minutes after my scheduled arrival; I'd have though that around 60-75 minutes would be more normal.

Advance fares tend to be pretty cheap between Edinburgh and Newcastle: they're at £13.65 for this forthcoming Saturday, and available under a tenner for further in advance. On trains that stop in Berwick it is worth checking there for splits - savings can be surprisingly high on an already cheap ticket.

The cheapest walk-up is £26 for a Cross Country only single: these trains are hourly. These are pretty good value and you can use Haymarket or Waverley and just decide on the day - if your bus is passing Haymarket ten minutes before a train is coming in then hop off there and use it; if you've got a fifty minute wait, travel on to Waverley!

So what you chose depends on why you're travelling and what you fancy:

* A tenner advance ticket matched with £7.50 for left luggage at Waverley is still cheaper than £26. I'd personally do that but book in a few hours for delays time and the worst you'll be faced with is having to hang around Edinburgh, one of the more attractive and visitor friendly cities in the UK, or having lost around an tenner on your advance fare if you are really delayed.

* If on the other hand you just want to get home, then the £26 walk up would do the job pretty nicely to be honest with you. I'm not aware of any splits on this fare.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I agree that this is one of the oddest ways of travelling from London to Newcastle, any of the direct trains are a lot simpler, quicker and being direct, less stressful. But I guess you have your reasons!

There's not much benefit in looking for split tickets between Edin and Newcastle, the saving can be tiny, and as the train would have to stop at the point where your ticket splits, there's not much choice: some don't stop at all between Edin and Newcastle, and many only stop at Berwick. Two Advances (one to Berwick and another to Newcastle) will not be cheaper on most services, and there's little point in making a long journey even longer by waiting for a specific train.
Its true that Cross Country trains can be cheaper, but as they are as noisy and cramped as an airplane, its not going to be much relief(!). East Coast Advances are still available, and booked through their website with additional discount, are currently priced at £13.65, £18.20 or £20.95 in Standard and £23.20 in First, so its hardly worth trying to reduce those by a few pence (these fares are excellent value for a 120 mile journey).

If you don't want to commit to a time, though, then CrossCountry's Anytime fare is £26.00 in Standard or £49.50 in First, and you'll have the choice of any of their trains (one every hour just after the hour until 18:04 then just one more at 20:05). You can contrast that with East Coast's Anytime fare at £44.50 in Standard, with a train every half hour until 18:30.
Its a journey I make quite reqularly and only bothered to 'split' a couple of times.

PS Edit. I've just noticed that you're not travelling until next March! (That's a long time away!). Advance tickets are only released for a period of 12 weeks ahead, and so are only available up until the 24th of February at present. The prices we've been discussing will only be apparent right now if you look at dates in Feb). But by booking that far into the future, you should be able to book a direct London-Newcastle Advance for just £15 as soon as they become available, and skip the Edinburgh link altogether!

 

[cuccir]

Its true that Cross Country trains can be cheaper, but as they are as noisy and cramped as an airplane, its not going to be much relief(!).

You may have different experiences but I've rarely found them too busy on the relatively rural Newcastle-Edinburgh stretch, though I have elsewhere on the network.

PS Edit. I've just noticed that you're not travelling until next March! (That's a long time away!). Advance tickets are only released for a period of 12 weeks ahead, and so are only available up until the 24th of February at present. The prices we've been discussing will only be apparent right now if you look at dates in Feb). But by booking that far into the future, you should be able to book a direct London-Newcastle Advance for just £15 as soon as they become available, and skip the Edinburgh link altogether!

This is all true; if the journey is London-Newcastle and the flight is not yet booked this would make much more sense. You can go first class for £45 if you book via the East Coast website when tickets first go on sale as well! I'm wondering if the flight is a connection itself booked from somewhere else to Edinburgh, changing at City though...

 

[island]

Doubtful but wouldn't entirely rule it out. London City Airport is almost exclusively originating/departing traffic.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

You may have different experiences but I've rarely found them too busy on the relatively rural Newcastle-Edinburgh stretch, though I have elsewhere on the network.

Sorry, by "cramped" I was referring to my impression of the comfort (or lack of) in Standard class Voyager seating by contrast with East Coast's, and not to the number of passengers; I must agree that there are generally plenty of seats available on Cross Country (as there are on East Coast) between Edinburgh & Newcastle.

 

[jopsuk]

If the journey hasn't been booked yet, and the original poster is going to be on an incoming flight to City, TFL reckon on ~36-38 minutes from City Airport DLR to Kings Cross via Bank- and DLR to Northern Line is one of the short ones at Bank isn't it?

 

[tony_mac]

Sorry, by "cramped" I was referring to my impression of the comfort (or lack of) in Standard class Voyager seating by contrast with East Coast's, and not to the number of passengers; I must agree that there are generally plenty of seats available on Cross Country (as there are on East Coast) between Edinburgh & Newcastle.

Having two Voyagers seats to yourself gives you more room than one HST seat.
There are also usually plenty of priority seats free with extra legroom.

(I usually travel by XC when in the north-east for this reason!).
Splitting at Berwick saves some money, but it's still more than an XC-only single.

 

[LondonJohn]

Thank you for all your comments.

I live in West Ham, 5 mins walk from the station on a direct bus route to London City Airport. I can be in the air in less than 45 mins of leaving my house (can be home within 20 of landing!).

The ticket is a connecting ticket using new BA Avios the replacement scheme for BA Miles/Air Miles. You can now get free connecting flights within the UK and "stopover" in between. Whilst I appreciate this isn't an airline forum I have booked an Prague-Edinburgh ticket for 9000 miles and £17 all in in Business Class It would have cost me the same just to fly Prague-London so the Edinburgh sector is for all intents and purposes free. I am actually flying Prague to London on 30 January and "stopping off" in London for 2 months before going on to Edinburgh. I didn't fly from Heathrow to Newcastle as there was only a late flight on Friday and I didnt want to waste a hotel night.

My next journey will be Newcastle to Budapest "stopping" off in London for 6 weeks before flying onward etc etc.

Whilst I would normally go by train for longer distances for the next few months I will be piggybacking onto overseas Avios bookings making the domestic flights free.

The flight is in the morning and there are rarely delays so I will probably book a train for around 2pm as I can always have a spot of lunch somewhere if I have time to kill.

On the convenience factor, for many a year I would fly to Manchester, Edinburgh, Newcastle etc but then was converted to taking the train. In September I did a day return to Manchester, travelling up First Class by train flying back with the flight at £29 being £10 cheaper than the train. Door to Door times were much of a muchness with hand luggage. The thing that does put me off travelling by train on longer distances is you can only book advances for so long in the near future.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I was sure you'd have your reasons, and its not for me to argue with them.

But, for what its worth, let me tell you my situation, which has some similarities.
I live in Newcastle and frequently have work in London. Tomorrow morning, I'll leave the house and be at the station 15 mins later, and Kings Cross 3 hours after that. My First meeting starts a 11am. I'll board a return train between 6 or 7 pm and be home again in the evening. (Formerly, I will have eaten well on board).

Years ago, I used planes maybe once a month, now its nearer to once a decade! The time spent going through airport car parks or local transport, airline checks, delays and other procedures (including having any toothpaste confiscated for the safety of my fellow travellers) was becoming far too irritating, and (despite the recurring reports on here of disruption on the railways) I found air traffic disruption to be much more of a challenge (leading me to hire a car from Gatwick to Newcastle and twice to get a tube back into Kings Cross to get a train instead of the delayed planes).
But that's all just my limited experience (after a few decades of travel).
As for "The thing that does put me off travelling by train on longer distances is you can only book advances for so long in the near future." then I guess we're just different. Its rare that I have anything planned much more than 3 weeks in advance, I just find the fares that are available when I know I'll be travelling, and if they're becoming expensive, then I'll just have to make the best use of my time and charge clients appropriately.

[But the truth is, what makes me prefer rail over train is a) I can take my bike for free and thereby get to my destination faster than any public transport, and independently of them, and b) I don't have to stand in a long queue of grown men holding their shoes in the air, and c) I do enjoy watching planes circle repeatedly before landing and also attempting to land and then ascending again to make another attempt (but I can't be bothered with that enjoyment taking up my personal time anymore).].

 

[island]

b) I don't have to stand in a long queue of grown men holding their shoes in the air

Nor does anyone else using an airport in the UK, for the record!