Edinburgh Derailment

[Bittern]

Yes it is, for the Fort William portion the seated sleeper starts/terminates there. Berth passenger it's not but seated it is.

Cannot see any reason why the sleeper would start at haymarket 2 lines open. E-G basically only thing going direct to Waverley and at 30 min frequency I'm sure the sleeper could get through, both of them.

I assumed things were still haywire. Have no idea how many lines were effected.

 

[scotsman]

I assumed things were still haywire. Have no idea how many lines were effected.

Single Line Working through Princes Street Gardens though

 

[sonic2009]

Okay by the looks of it, Edinburgh portion of lowland sleeper didn't run, with regards to highlands sleeper aberdeen portion terminated haymarket, with fort.William and inverness portion running into.Edinburgh and back out via princes st gardens. These sleepers I've mentioned running towards London

 

[Failed Unit]

Why does it matter if it's a through ticket or not?

e!

I keep forgetting that a split ticket is a journey, I had a big fight with CT years ago about buying Cardiff - Nottingham AP and Nottingham - Market rasen single to save money as Cardiff - Market rasen via Nottingham did exist. But anyway point taken irrelevant.

Bad news for me the emergency timetable is 1thp from Bathgate and beyond.

 

[michael769]

Bad news for me the emergency timetable is 1thp from Bathgate and beyond.

According to the websites no trains between Bathgate and Edinburgh.

Again Scotrail's communication is an absolute mess. Check the Shotts line on their site and they have a notice up saying they are terminating at Livingston, but their live running info says the trains are running normally and their Journeycheck is sending texts saying they will delayed by 30mins into Edinburgh. So which is it?

Check the Bathgate line and the live running information shows trains terminating at Bathgate but they have no explanation as to why.

As far as I can see anyone who does not know about the derailment is going to be left totally confused about what is going on!

EDIT: Correction they website is now updated to show some services between Bathgate and Edinburgh!

 

[Failed Unit]

Sounds like scotrail have not learnt from the snow and communication is key! Something scotrail didnt do well then and are not doing well now.

When I looked at the website this morning westbound had 2 trains one fast one slow from Edinburgh - west coast via Bathgate but only one eastbound! All others terminate Bathgate.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
If you look at NRES it conflicts with scotrail even now Ie NRES says no services between Bathgate / Livingston and Edinburgh! Even on Scotrails site they have the same train down twice sometimes with conflicting info!

 

[michael769]

For what it is worth NRES seems to be more on the ball than Scotrail info wise from what I have seen.

I'm glad to say the situation on the ground is somewhat better than online. My train arrived on time got me to Livingston South were we were transferred to coaches.

They had plenty of coaches at the station both for us and subsequent trains. The normally unstaffed station was staffed so folks should get moving OK. My journey only took 30mins longer than normal.

some colleagues are reporting that their journeys on the Edinburgh to Glasgow via Queen St are taking about 30 mins to get through Princes St gardens. So the message is to leave early and allow lots of extra time for your journeys.

The coach driver says they have been booked for the next 3 days - so I'm expecting my commute to be a write off for the rest of the week!

 

[Failed Unit]

3 days - wow

The trouble with the revised timetable as per the snow one is for use people at the stations down the line, we know that a train will leave Edinburgh at x.45 but have no idea how long it will take to get to Linlithgow, although to be fair to Scotrail neither will they! But 30 minutes from Waverley to Haymarket, it would take me about the same time to walk it so thanks for the tip off - I will bail at Haymarket tomorrow if the problem still exists.

 

[RyanB]

People who decide not to get off their train at Haymarket as it makes it's way to Waverly must be out of their minds. It's no more than a half an hour walk down Shanwick Place and then along Princes Street, between the two stations and no more than 10 minutes on one of the many buses that pass outside Haymarket station.

Question is though, how long is recovery estimated to take?

 

[Failed Unit]

People who decide not to get off their train at Haymarket as it makes it's way to Waverly must be out of their minds. It's no more than a half an hour walk down Shanwick Place and then along Princes Street, between the two stations and no more than 10 minutes on one of the many buses that pass outside Haymarket station.

Question is though, how long is recovery estimated to take?

Not as clear cut, if I was changing onto an East Coast train I would stay on rather than drag the baggage, likewise many people will not know how close the stations are and how to walk between the 2. I know it is easy enough, but not for someone from Dundee who has never visited Edinburgh before!

 

[michael769]

Question is though, how long is recovery estimated to take?

The folks in my work who got the train through are saying the train is still lying derailed in Princes St Gardens, so I'm not optimistic for the rest of this week to be honest!

Hopefully an official estimate will appear later today once the Transport Minister gets involved.

 

[DarloRich]

People who decide not to get off their train at Haymarket as it makes it's way to Waverly must be out of their minds. It's no more than a half an hour walk down Shanwick Place and then along Princes Street, between the two stations and no more than 10 minutes on one of the many buses that pass outside Haymarket station.

Question is though, how long is recovery estimated to take?

Could you not just get the tram? Oh hang on...................

Is it just the rear wheelset off the road or both sets on the rear carriage? Do we know if it is a heavy lift job or whether they can jack it or air bag it back on the road? Do we know how bad the damage is to the S&C unit? or the cabling or even to the train itself?

The OHLE will casue some trouble if they need a big crane to do the work. I would think it would have to come down in that case.

best fire up the BRUFF again!

 

[Failed Unit]

There is a photo on the BBC Website - Scotland part

 

[michael769]

Latest update from the BBC

Network Rail confirmed that movement of the carriages would not take place until overnight, meaning the emergency timetable would remain throughout Thursday.

Spokesman Ben Hall told BBC Radio Scotland's Good Morning Scotland programme the circumstances of the derailment were being investigated.

He said: "Until we can actually get in tonight, during the night shift, to remove the train, it's going to be very difficult to look at what's happened."


Engineers are assessing the situation to determine damage to the train and rails
The Rail Accident Investigation Branch is currently examining the site of the derailment.

Mr Hall added: "As soon as we get the site handed back to us we can look at what we can do to remove the train and then look at what damage has been done underneath."

BBC Scotland transport correspondent David Miller said the empty train was being moved on Wednesday night when it derailed on the stretch of line through Princes Street Gardens.

He said: "There are four or five men working on the line, measuring it at points - I suspect they're examining the line for damage.

"But no attempt so far to try to move the train, there's no heavy lifting equipment in place so the train is taking up one of the very busy lines into Waverley station."

He added it was likely that lifting equipment would be brought in by rail in the evening, after the majority of the services on the emergency timetable had run.

The train was travelling from Cowdenbeath to Edinburgh Waverley station when it came off the tracks. Neither the driver nor conductor were injured.

 

[DarloRich]

There is a photo on the BBC Website - Scotland part

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-14318187

That one?

 

[Failed Unit]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-14318187

That one?

That is the one, someone already posted the STV link earlier in the thread.

 

[DarloRich]

yes - i cant look at ITV/STV sites at work

it doesnt look to bad, but we cant see what damage there could be to the S&C/track and I assume nothing nasty like a ruptured fuel tank occured. However i note they are ging to wait until tonight to try and re rail the unit

 

[PaulLothian]

ScotRail website now says
"Services between Edinburgh and Queen St have been reduced to half hourly service in both directions. Edinburgh to Queen St services will depart at 15 mins and 45 mins past the hour, calling at Haymarket, Edinburgh Park, Linlithgow, Polmont, Falkirk High & Croy. Services from Queen St to Edinburgh will depart Queen St on the hour and on the half hour calling at Croy, Falkirk High, Polmont, Linlithgow, Edinburgh Park at Haymarket. Please note that due to these services calling at additional stations, journey times will be extended by approximately 15 minutes."

This was the same emergency TT used during the winter snow. All Dunblane to Edinburgh services are turning at Linlithgow. At least ScotRail may be able to get 6-car trains running this time!

 

[Failed Unit]

ScotRail website now says
"Services between Edinburgh and Queen St have been reduced to half hourly service in both directions. Edinburgh to Queen St services will depart at 15 mins and 45 mins past the hour, calling at Haymarket, Edinburgh Park, Linlithgow, Polmont, Falkirk High & Croy. Services from Queen St to Edinburgh will depart Queen St on the hour and on the half hour calling at Croy, Falkirk High, Polmont, Linlithgow, Edinburgh Park at Haymarket. Please note that due to these services calling at additional stations, journey times will be extended by approximately 15 minutes."

This was the same emergency TT used during the winter snow. All Dunblane to Edinburgh services are turning at Linlithgow. At least ScotRail may be able to get 6-car trains running this time!

The even have 4 car trains running between Linlithgow and Dunblane.

One thing that I don't know how they could do better is the Bathgate route, which is described as a line problem between Edinburgh and Glasgow Queen Street - I guess they could have low level or via Bathgate for one and high level or via Falkirk for the other route.

 

[yorkie]

I keep forgetting that a split ticket is a journey, I had a big fight with CT years ago about buying Cardiff - Nottingham AP and Nottingham - Market rasen single to save money as Cardiff - Market rasen via Nottingham did exist. But anyway point taken irrelevant. .

No problem And, sorry to hear that. Anyone in a similar position can be assured of the support of myself and others (in terms of writing letters, and contacting appropriate people/organisations in a constructive way). I am keen to dispell the myth that a combination of tickets erodes our rights in respect of connections etc. Obviously the mininum connection times must be adhered to. For the record, anyone with connections at Edinburgh Waverley at this time is advised that the minimum connection time according to NRES at [stn]EDB[/stn] is 10 minutes. Providing that time is allowed, it's a valid connection (so me123 is fine).

I would recomnmnend allowing more time if possible/practicable especially when disruption is expected but that is merely for convenience and not an obligation.

 

[michael769]

One thing that I don't know how they could do better is the Bathgate route, which is described as a line problem between Edinburgh and Glasgow Queen Street - I guess they could have low level or via Bathgate for one and high level or via Falkirk for the other route.

I think that Scotrail could do with a more detailed 1 pager on their website about the situation something like: NRES version.

While the info on their site is all there, my feeling is that it is being presented in a disjointed way that does confuse some routes and will be hard for non-regular travellers to follow.

 

[PaulLothian]

They still haven't got it together! At Linlithgow, my wife was sold a ticket at 13:10 with no mention that a harrassed ScotRail worker was at that time on the platform telling travellers that the train they were going for had been cancelled! The platform was already busy with passengers off the terminating Dunblane to Edinburgh service, and the next Glasgow to Edinburgh would presumably arrive half an hour later with two trainloads on it.

 

[michael769]

To be fair they do seem to have staff on the platforms and are trying to get things sorted out for passengers - as I mentioned early my journey in went reasonably well given the situation. I have to admit I don't envy the folks having to work the platforms in situations like this.

The big test will come tonight in Waverley Station when they will have large numbers of folks needing advice and guidance, especially those who will need to be bussed out.

 

[WatcherZero]

Any early indication of cause? Wheels, track, points, etc?

 

[DarloRich]

Any early indication of cause? Wheels, track, points, etc?

to early i would think. RAIB will want to have a look as will NR & TOC

 

[matchmaker]

They aren't exactly covering themselves with glory, are they? One of the busiest stretches of line in the country blocked for nearly 24 hours by, what is on the face of it, a simple derailment! :roll:

It wouldn't have happened in the good old days (wanders off, stroking beard...)

 

[90019]

I'm heading up that way this afternoon, so will take my camera and go see what's going on.

 

[Failed Unit]

They aren't exactly covering themselves with glory, are they? One of the busiest stretches of line in the country blocked for nearly 24 hours by, what is on the face of it, a simple derailment! :roll:

It wouldn't have happened in the good old days (wanders off, stroking beard...)

How many lines are actaully open? You would hope that 2 are open, if 2 are open I am surprised that they can't get some more trains through. Normally you would have at least 13 tph on those 2 lines.

6 via Linlithgow
4 via Bathgate
3 via Slateford

So you could at least manage

3 via Linlithgow
2 via Bathgate
2 via Slateford
3 via Fife?

 

[MCR247]

6 via Linlithgow
4 via Bathgate
3 via Slateford

So you could at least manage

3 via Linlithgow
2 via Bathgate
2 via Slateford
3 via Fife?

I haven't been to Edinburgh in years, but if the only lines open are the ones which run into Haymarket 1 & 2, then you can't get to the Slateford lines from there IIRC? You'd have to use one of the Princes St crossovers

 

[michael769]

I haven't been to Edinburgh in years, but if the only lines open are the ones which run into Haymarket 1 & 2, then you can't get to the Slateford lines from there IIRC? You'd have to use one of the Princes St crossovers

Isn't there is another crossover nearer the Haymarket tunnels?

The Virgin and TPE trains are now running and they use the Slateford line so it must be possible.