ECML disruption 20/09/22

[yorksrob]

At this specific bridge (not sure if you missed the discussion) there is a parapet extension over the Down Hertford Loop but not over the 4 ECML tracks. https://www.google.com/maps/@51.889...4!1sD-EiLYeofg1M1aQ-7jT6mQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Ah yes, I see. That said, even the unextended section seems pretty hefty (up to the young man's neck). You'd have to be pretty determined to dangle anything over that.

 

[zwk500]

Not so sure about that last part, this MP without in any way being in possession of the facts, was using an incident in which someone was at the very least badly hurt to score a party political point - Not that she is alone in doing that kind of thing, however.

Mockery and Critical discussion are different. Perhaps if civil society raised the tone of it's discourse, MPs would respond in kind? (I'm ever the optimist haha).

I'm not convinced that a lower parapet is really sufficient to induce someone to interfere with railway equipment by dangling an object onto the overheads.

Ah yes, I see. That said, even the unextended section seems pretty hefty (up to the young man's neck). You'd have to be pretty determined to dangle anything over that.

Maybe, Maybe not. The original parapet looks to be 1.5m/5' tall over the tracks, which would allow anybody c.6' tall to easily get their arms resting on top of it. The extended parapet looks to be somewhere between 1.8m and 2m, which would make it a lot more difficult to do.

 

[LancasterRed]

Mockery and Critical discussion are different. Perhaps if civil society raised the tone of it's discourse, MPs would respond in kind? (I'm ever the optimist haha).

Oh, you're spot on, a good MP should always respond well to critical discussion and I believe the good ones do that.

The difference between how to approach this has already been solidified in this thread alone with one individual acting considerably more childish who up until this post has been completely ignored.

----

EDIT: I thought this was the GWR thread still, whooops

 

[malc-c]

Ah yes, I see. That said, even the unextended section seems pretty hefty (up to the young man's neck). You'd have to be pretty determined to dangle anything over that.

From the time I used to video from that bridge, the height changes from left to right (as per the video posted above). I'm 5'5" and could look over the parapet at the far left with little difficulty, but would have to tip toe at the far right. Maybe this was why only the section over the new turnback track was fitted with the height extension.

 

[yorksrob]

Personally, I think that if a grown adult can just about see over the bridge parapet, it is plenty high enough.

 

[malc-c]

Anyone have any updates on the repairs? - Local radio have been saying busses are still replacing trains between Stevenage and Hertford for best part of this week, and Open Train Times shows the down slow from Woolmer Green as -LB - (presumably line block ?).

 

[zwk500]

Personally, I think that if a grown adult can just about see over the bridge parapet, it is plenty high enough.

This is a rather wide range. I have a number of adult cousins under 5'6, whereas my older brother is 6'4.

 

[yorksrob]

This is a rather wide range. I have a number of adult cousins under 5'6, whereas my older brother is 6'4.

That's fine, but then we get into individual responsibility not to electrocute yourself by dangling over railway bridges, climbing up pylons etc.

A line has to be drawn somewhere.

 

[62484GlenLyon]

Anyone have any updates on the repairs? - Local radio have been saying busses are still replacing trains between Stevenage and Hertford for best part of this week, and Open Train Times shows the down slow from Woolmer Green as -LB - (presumably line block ?).

NRE shows an end time of Saturday night. Presumably, advantage will be taken of the longer possession time available overnight to finalise repairs.

 

[zwk500]

That's fine, but then we get into individual responsibility not to electrocute yourself by dangling over railway bridges, climbing up pylons etc.

A line has to be drawn somewhere.

It does, I'm asking how many centimetres or inches above the road you were proposing it should be drawn! Personally, I'd say 1.5m is high enough that to defeat it requires a conscious effort, but maybe 1.8m prevents a few more accidents.

 

[yorksrob]

It does, I'm asking how many centimetres or inches above the road you were proposing it should be drawn! Personally, I'd say 1.5m is high enough that to defeat it requires a conscious effort, but maybe 1.8m prevents a few more accidents.

I thought I'd made my opinion clear that both heights on the bridge involved were perfectly adequate.

 

[uglymonkey]

Surely in describing heights, there would be a difference in planning in preparing for an accidental incursion onto the catenary from a bridge to a purposeful intended "lean" over to get at it ? and how do you plan for that?

 

[zwk500]

Surely in describing heights, there would be a difference in planning in preparing for an accidental incursion onto the catenary from a bridge to a purposeful intended "lean" over to get at it ? and how do you plan for that?

You plan for a purposeful lean over in 2 ways: 1. You build the bridge to prevent even intentional breaches of the safety distance (E.g. anti-climb cages or very high parapets) and 2. You educate people on the risks of doing so in the hope that it will dissuade them from trying it in the first place.
When the MML electrification to Corby started there was a massive publicity campaign (especially in Schools, but everywhere) to warn people that the new OLE was not to be messed with.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

It may be worth pointing out that all of the TOCs are currently “nationalised”, however they are still being operated as Franchises. some by operator of last resort, some continue to be run by the original franchise owner. The reality is this is the worst of both worlds and doesn't sell either the nationalisation or privatisation arguments at all.

There were some images on twotter showing the damage to the OHLE but I am struggling to find them now. One showed a cross-span wire had snapped between two of the running lines, these hold the catenary wires across 4 running lines so when one breaks all lines are affected.

 

[Hadders]

BUses still replacing trains between Stevenage and Hertford North this afternoon.

 

[Mcq]

Line closed all day today bus all the way - chaps still working between Winchmore Hill & Grange Park tonight (23:10) - presumably scheduled possession.

 

[malc-c]

Well open train shows the turnback in use so that would suggest things are back to normal. No further follow up on BBC local website as to the condition of the person injured, or what it was that was being dangled over the bridge