EC HST Toilets: "Do not flush in the station"

[johnnychips]

Perhaps this has been raised before, but I was rather surprised on rising from my luxurious first class seat on an EC 125, to find a notice in the bog saying, "Do not flush in the station". I know they are old trains, but do they really still drop bangers and mash on the track? Do any other non-preserved trains do this?

 

[Anvil1984]

Quite a lot of units do. The 14xs and the majority of 150 - 156s to start with (some have been refurbed with CET tanks)

 

[Zoidberg]

Perhaps this has been raised before, ...

It has ... but the search function is not my friend as I cannot locate the relevant thread.

 

[starrymarkb]

HSTs and Mk3s are the only intercity stock to do so, for the most part they are being replaced in the next few years by IEP so it's not worth converting them. (and at the last refubishment the DfT reckoned IEP would be in full service by now so it wasn't done then)

Most stock built before the early 1990s dumps on the track, things like Sprinters will probably get tanks at their next major refurbishment (where they while need Accessible Toilets fitted) - some 158s (with SWT and Northern) have already been converted using a 159's bogs as the template.

 

[dannyandy]

As previously mentioned most 14x/15x units have these signs although I think quite a few people completely ignore them, you only have to look at the sleepers,ballast in stations. Ew!

 

[cf111]

some 158s (with SWT and Northern) have already been converted using a 159's bogs as the template.

The refurbished ScotRail 158s have retention tanks fitted as well.

 

[johnnychips]

Well I'm really surprised. When did it become law that trains had to have tanks (or did the railway companies decide to do it off their own back)?

I suppose it's not self-evident when compared to some eastern European trains when you push a button, a flap opens and you can see the track flashing beneath your...erm...

 

[scotsman]

The refurbished ScotRail 158s have retention tanks fitted as well.

News to me, I heard that the alterations to fit tanks would require changes to the bogies

 

[starrymarkb]

News to me, I heard that the alterations to fit tanks would require changes to the bogies

It shouldn't do, retrofits have been done before (159/1s & SWT 158s)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Well I'm really surprised. When did it become law that trains had to have tanks (or did the railway companies decide to do it off their own back)?

I suppose it's not self-evident when compared to some eastern European trains when you push a button, a flap opens and you can see the track flashing beneath your...erm...

As I understand it BR started off their own back, mainly in the NSE area, I think it was written into the group standards later on though so further flush n dump stock can't be built, but there is no requirement that I know of to convert existing stock.

 

[asylumxl]

HSTs and Mk3s are the only intercity stock to do so, for the most part they are being replaced in the next few years by IEP so it's not worth converting them. (and at the last refubishment the DfT reckoned IEP would be in full service by now so it wasn't done then)

While the MK4s have retention tanks, they were known to leak when close to the brim, much to the dismay of people working on the track .

 

[Johnny_w]

as a Kid travelling in the 80's I used to love German Stock!

Watching the track go by under the toilet flap!

And the state of the tracks last time I was in Paddington was vomit-inducing to say the least.

JW

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Well I'm really surprised. When did it become law that trains had to have tanks (or did the railway companies decide to do it off their own back)?

I'm not sure it is illegal even today - just socially unacceptable in new stock.
The first retention toilet stock was class 317 working on St Pancras-Bedford, built in 1981.
But I think the last new dump-toilet stock was the class 158 last built in 1992.
That leaves most Mk3-based stock with dump toilets, although a few types have been retrofitted with retention toilets (as were the 159s from new).
Even now, refurbs do not necessarily remove the dump toilets.

It would be interesting identifying the "cleanest" routes in the UK.
The WCML must be one of the best, with 390, 221 and 350 stock fitted with retention toilets.
GW must be one of the worst, with all the HSTs and Sprinters.

That mine of information Wikipedia doesn't think toilet type is worth recording in its technical descriptions of UK stock classes.

 

[EssexGonzo]

as a Kid travelling in the 80's I used to love German Stock!

Watching the track go by under the toilet flap!

And the state of the tracks last time I was in Paddington was vomit-inducing to say the least.

JW

Not to mention LST - there was some press on this a few weeks ago.

 

[David Goddard]

Riding in an HST from Penzance during Summer 2012 we were told, on approaching the Royal Albert Bridge, not to use the toilets while crossing it in order to protect the maintenance workers who were restoring the bridge.

 

[Katada]

Riding in an HST from Penzance during Summer 2012 we were told, on approaching the Royal Albert Bridge, not to use the toilets while crossing it in order to protect the maintenance workers who were restoring the bridge.

My first thought was that would encourage every kid to flush the toilet, but then realised HSTs don't usually have scummy teenagers on them like you get in London

 

[Temple Meads]

My first thought was that would encourage every kid to flush the toilet, but then realised HSTs don't usually have scummy teenagers on them like you get in London

There are plenty of towns in Devon & Cornwall whose youth I would describe as 'scummy' - and they do most definitely travel by HST!

 

[Golden Gripper]

The first retention toilet stock was class 317 working on St Pancras-Bedford, built in 1981.

They were probably the first production run with retention toilets, but the first fitted was on a Mk1 in the late 1970s. BR built it for trials and it was put in a loco hauled set that ran between Liverpool and Newcastle.

 

[EM2]

Sorry for the thread resurrection, but does anyone know if EC drain the tanks of any of their stock at King's Cross? Or is the state of the trackbed simply customers not complying with the notice?

 

[ffm]

The latter and they would not drain toilet tanks in a station, or ever onto the tracks! There are special tank drain sites, at servicing depots.

 

[Eng274]

They were probably the first production run with retention toilets, but the first fitted was on a Mk1 in the late 1970s. BR built it for trials and it was put in a loco hauled set that ran between Liverpool and Newcastle.

The mark 2 seated coaches used on the caledonian sleeper also have retention tanks, no idea when they were fitted though.

 

[Nippy]

The problem at Paddington is that Network Rail charge 30p to go to the bog but there is an HST stood in Platform 1 with a free bog......

I hate going trackside where there are still dumping trains running about.

 

[asylumxl]

There are plenty of towns in Devon & Cornwall whose youth I would describe as 'scummy' - and they do most definitely travel by HST!

Yeh, like the janner youths on one side, and the little scene kids in Saltash on the other.

On a vaguely related note, on my way to Devon or returning I would often flush around Slough in a tribute to John Betjeman's dislike of the lovely place...

 

[transmanche]

On a vaguely related note, on my way to Devon or returning I would often flush around Slough in a tribute to John Betjeman's dislike of the lovely place...

Come, friendly bums...

 

[PG]

The problem at Paddington is that Network Rail charge 30p to go to the bog but there is an HST stood in Platform 1 with a free bog......

What do the cleaners do when turning round HSTs at Paddington if the toilet needs attention?...

 

[cjohnson]

Sorry for the thread resurrection, but does anyone know if EC drain the tanks of any of their stock at King's Cross? Or is the state of the trackbed simply customers not complying with the notice?

In the news today... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-26444107

Train companies have been criticised for dumping toilet waste on the tracks at some of London's mainline stations.

The effluent has been dumped at King's Cross, Paddington and Liverpool Street.

Modern trains are fitted with toilet tanks, which are pumped out at the depot when they become full, but older rolling stock does not have this.

Unions say it is a health risk and companies should fit older trains with the tanks. The firms say the number of trains where it happens is decreasing.

Since 1996, all new trains have had tanks fitted.

 

[matchmaker]

The mark 2 seated coaches used on the caledonian sleeper also have retention tanks, no idea when they were fitted though.

So do the Mk 3 sleepers.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Come, friendly bums...

Poetry in motions...

 

[Aictos]

Sorry for the thread resurrection, but does anyone know if EC drain the tanks of any of their stock at King's Cross? Or is the state of the trackbed simply customers not complying with the notice?

EC empty the CET tanks at Ferme Park, you can see the equipment on the left side of any train heading north just before it goes though the washer.

 

[asylumxl]

Poetry in motions...

Come friendly bums and fall on Slough!
The tracks full of fecelence now,
From many a bladder and a bowel,
The odour, Death!

 

[EM2]

So, when the BBC Transport Correspondent (https://twitter.com/bbctomedwards) says on Twitter:

On station sewage at Kings X - every toilet is being flushed on @eastcoastuk before departure - I don't think it's passengers

that's obviously not correct?