e-petitions

[rods1249]

A petition to re nationalise the railway, not sure what the response will be
http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/630

 

[Hydro]

not sure what the response will be

I do!

 

[All Line Rover]

Advantages of privatization:

• Better rolling stock
• Cheaper fares when booked in Advance
• Much cheaper First Class fares
• Better customer service
• Higher salaries for staff
• A much more complicated fares system

Disadvantages of privatization:

• The cost to the taxpayer hasn't reduced at all
• "On the day" fares have increased dramatically
• Communication between TOC's (who run different lines) has severely reduced
• A much more complicated fares system

I'm not going to vote "YES, re-nationalize the railway," because I think that privatization has brought some significant advantages. At the same time, I am not old enough to remember what "British Rail" was like, so can't comment much.

 

[SS4]

Advantages of privatization:

• A much more complicated fares system

That's an advantage?! Care to expand on exactly how

I suppose TOC only tickets (such as Virgin in the West Midlands) are a good example

I've not voted on this issue because, like ALR, I'm not old enough to remember BR

 

[90019]

A petition to re nationalise the railway, not sure what the response will be

I've got a fairly good idea what it will be.

 

[ainsworth74]

Advantages of privatization:

• A much more complicated fares system

Sorry exactly how is our byzantine fare structure a good thing?

As for the petition I can't actually access the site at this moment (it would appear to be being overwhelmed with requests) but I can't see this petition making the 100,000 to even be considered for a debate.

 

[jopsuk]

With the excitement over the site, I think certain people have mistaken "parliament might have a debate about it (if the committee decides it's worthwhile of parliament's time after 100,000 people sign)" with "it'll become law". There's debates quite often on various subjects in parliament that lead nowhere near law.

 

[yorksrob]

Advantages of privatization:

• Better rolling stock

• 
  
  That's always an interesting one. If you were to look around the network in around 1994, you'd find that there was actually quite a lot of fairly new rolling stock around the place then.
  
  As for e-petitions in general, perhaps it's about time the public had a constitutional way of forcing a vote on issues if it could obtain an adequate quorum.

 

[WatcherZero]

Do you think they would accept an e-petition banning e-petitions?

 

[Yew]

Could we suggest Loco haulage for the IEP?

 

[jopsuk]

Do you think they would accept an e-petition banning e-petitions?

There are several calling for the site to be shut down.

 

[WatcherZero]

Sign me up then!

 

[Failed Unit]

That's always an interesting one. If you were to look around the network in around 1994, you'd find that there was actually quite a lot of fairly new rolling stock around the place then.

As for e-petitions in general, perhaps it's about time the public had a constitutional way of forcing a vote on issues if it could obtain an adequate quorum.

Yep love them or hate them the later years of BR gave us.

Sprinters,
Networkers.
Class 319 - 322
Ic225

The mk1 replacement is often argued would have happened sooner if privatisation didn't get in the way.

 

[Hydro]

NSE wanted a uniform Networker fleet to replace the slamdoors, IIRC.

 

[Greenback]

Advantages of privatization:

• Better rolling stock Not necessarily. Impossibel to prove one way or the other
• Cheaper fares when booked in Advance Again, no way of knowing how BR would have developed the fares system
• Much cheaper First Class fares Highly debatable
• Better customer service Probably true
• Higher salaries for staff Definitely true, possibly not an advantage!
• A much more complicated fares system Not an advantage at all, definitely a disadvantage.

Disadvantages of privatization:

• The cost to the taxpayer hasn't reduced at all It appears to have increased substantially
• "On the day" fares have increased dramatically Yes, far in excess of inflation
• Communication between TOC's (who run different lines) has severely reduced Communication under BR was not perfect, but technology was not so advanced
• A much more complicated fares system I still can't see where the advantage is!

I'm not going to vote "YES, re-nationalize the railway," because I think that privatization has brought some significant advantages. At the same time, I am not old enough to remember what "British Rail" was like, so can't comment much.

I am old enough to remmber BR well, and I would vote for re-nationalisation.

With the excitement over the site, I think certain people have mistaken "parliament might have a debate about it (if the committee decides it's worthwhile of parliament's time after 100,000 people sign)" with "it'll become law". There's debates quite often on various subjects in parliament that lead nowhere near law.

I think you are right. There are far too many of these online petitions, campaigns or whatever. Not many people take any notice at all.

Do you think they would accept an e-petition banning e-petitions?

I hope so! I would sign it!

There are several calling for the site to be shut down.

Can you direct me to one?!

 

[SwindonPkwy]

e-petition = debate = a handful of MP's late into the evening when parliament's 'normal business' has been concluded. The chances of things passing into law are very slim.

With regard to nationalisation, whilst the franchise model is not perfect, the fact that we are all able to compare the various TOC's is a good thing. I believe that our railways are in better shape now than for a long time. My opinion has been formed as a rail user (and enthusiast) and not as 'an insider'.

 

[Greenback]

e-petition = debate = a handful of MP's late into the evening when parliament's 'normal business' has been concluded. The chances of things passing into law are very slim.

With regard to nationalisation, whilst the franchise model is not perfect, the fact that we are all able to compare the various TOC's is a good thing. I believe that our railways are in better shape now than for a long time. My opinion has been formed as a rail user (and enthusiast) and not as 'an insider'.

I don't really see that comparing TOC's is particularly advantageous. It's a bit like comparing appela and bananas. The only way you cna compare Scotrail with Great Western is on the sleeper service. Otherwise their operations are completely different.

In any case, some people think that TOC A is far better/far worse than TOC B because of the livery, the fact that the sandwiches are nicer, or because they operate certain types of traction. All of which is pretty subjective!

 

[jopsuk]

Can you direct me to one?!

here...

 

[Greenback]

here...

Thanks - seems to be busy at the moment, I'll try later when most people are asleep! must be because of the capital punishment stuff in the news today...

 

[yorksrob]

e-petition = debate = a handful of MP's late into the evening when parliament's 'normal business' has been concluded. The chances of things passing into law are very slim.

Indeed. Whether one agrees with some of the views proposed or not, it couldn't automatically bring in a law, so it's hardly storming the Bastille. I tend to view debate as a good thing.

I believe that our railways are in better shape now than for a long time.

I think that where the railways are in better shape, has a lot to do with the Government keeping the money flowing.

 

[Greenback]

Indeed. Whether one agrees with some of the views proposed or not, it couldn't automatically bring in a law, so it's hardly storming the Bastille. I tend to view debate as a good thing.

It's a sop, to try and convince people that their views ar ebeing listened to by the professional political class!

 

[dggar]

Do you think they would accept an e-petition banning e-petitions?

I think I saw one when scanning the available petitions.

What I want to know is can you sign against what is proposed in the petition or do you have to start another one with the opposite proposal?

 

[tbtc]

How did the petition to bring back WSMR get on?

Or all the other ones?

 

[90019]

In any case, some people think that TOC A is far better/far worse than TOC B because of the livery, the fact that the sandwiches are nicer, or because they operate certain types of traction.

Or the seats have 0.1" more legroom.
Or the windows are 1" taller.
Or the drinks are colder.

 

[yorksrob]

It's a sop, to try and convince people that their views ar ebeing listened to by the professional political class!

True to an extent no doubt - but it does at least appear to end in some sort of a debate in parliament (which is different to the previous set up). It seems a worthwhile endevour to me at any rate.

 

[SwindonPkwy]

I fully appreciate that TOC A and TOC B may have very different operations. It doesn't stop me comparing their customer service, fare structures, websites and, yes, their sandwiches and liveries.

When travelling from any point A to point B in the UK, there is little actual choice between operators. What matters most importantly are fares, punctuality and quality of service: is it standing room only? Obviously, much of this is dictated by infrastructure and available rolling stock, things not controlled directly by TOC's.

However, and to conclude, if I get service with a smile and a decent ham sandwich, I am just that more likely to leave my car at home.

 

[All Line Rover]

That's an advantage?! Care to expand on exactly how

I suppose TOC only tickets (such as Virgin in the West Midlands) are a good example

I've not voted on this issue because, like ALR, I'm not old enough to remember BR

The advantage of a much more complicated fares system is that it introduces many discrepancies that the knowledgeable passenger can use to their advantage. One good example is the Routeing Guide. You can save a fortune using that! Such "loopholes" do not exist in other countries, such as France.

Of course, a much more complicated fares system is also a major disadvantage to passengers who are not "in the know." As you say, TOC only tickets may be considered an "exception" because of increased competition.

Advance tickets are difficult as to whether they are a disadvantage or an advantage. Yes, they have made the fares system more complicated. But they haven't made it much more complicated, and have made train travel extremely cheap for those who are able to book in advance.

 

[Yew]

The advantage of a much more complicated fares system is that it introduces many discrepancies that the knowledgeable passenger can use to their advantage. One good example is the Routeing Guide. You can save a fortune using that! Such "loopholes" do not exist in other countries, such as France.

Of course, a much more complicated fares system is also a major disadvantage to passengers who are not "in the know." As you say, TOC only tickets may be considered an "exception" because of increased competition.

Advance tickets are difficult as to whether they are a disadvantage or an advantage. Yes, they have made the fares system more complicated. But they haven't made it much more complicated, and have made train travel extremely cheap for those who are able to book in advance.

one day ill work out your cheap ticket to (was it france? or just on HS1?)

 

[tbtc]

The advantage of a much more complicated fares system is that it introduces many discrepancies that the knowledgeable passenger can use to their advantage. One good example is the Routeing Guide. You can save a fortune using that! Such "loopholes" do not exist in other countries, such as France.

Of course, a much more complicated fares system is also a major disadvantage to passengers who are not "in the know." As you say, TOC only tickets may be considered an "exception" because of increased competition.

Advance tickets are difficult as to whether they are a disadvantage or an advantage. Yes, they have made the fares system more complicated. But they haven't made it much more complicated, and have made train travel extremely cheap for those who are able to book in advance.

There were cheaper "loopholes" on BR too.

Most of the "loopholes" (e.g. splitting your journey at Cheltenham on XC) only bring the journey cost down to broadly what it would have been under BR - it's only "cheaper" compared to the high costs of "normal" tickets

 

[WestCoast]

The advantage of a much more complicated fares system is that it introduces many discrepancies that the knowledgeable passenger can use to their advantage. One good example is the Routeing Guide. You can save a fortune using that! Such "loopholes" do not exist in other countries, such as France.

Loopholes do exist in other countries, I can think of quite a few actually. However, they're never quite as complex as the UK! I sometimes think that having a complicated fares systems can be a good thing, but then I go to other countries and actually think, no, it's not. I can travel around cheaply in Germany, the Netherlands and Belgium without having to use every trick in the book just to get a decently priced ticket. For example, up to 5 people can roam around on DB's network (basically a one day ALR) on local trains for about £32 on a Sat/Sun. It's very refereshng and customer-friendly actually, plus it doesn't need a days planning!