Drivers stuck in a queue on a level crossing

[Gloster]

Hasn't there been more than one case of someone attempting to drive down the railway line at a level crossing? If people can do this kind of thing, I am not surprised that people in a traffic queue can be unaware of a railway line. In such cases, people tend to get "tunnel vision", concentrating on the rear of the car ahead. Even yellow box markings may not be much belp if they are hidden under the car ahead.

There was another case at Brockenhurst recently. There have been several cases over the years where somebody coming north on Lymington Road has turned left to go into Station Approach while they were still on the crossing, instead of immediately on leaving it. The most recent case was less explicable as the car was heading south and turned left, but there are no sideroads on that side directly off Lymington Road either side of the crossing.

I suspect that incidents or near accidents happen almost daily, but you don’t hear of them unless someone gets hurt or, perish the thought, a car is damaged. Inconvenience for rail passengers and cost to the railway is just ignored or headlined as ‘another train delay’.

 

[Trainman40083]

So it has finally happened - the article refers to a train hitting a car last month. Thankfully there were no injuries (presumably the train just wiped off a bumper).

There are two AHB crossings in succession after leaving North Staffs Junction on the Uttoxeter line. The first is Findern crossing (Findern Lane) followed by Willington crossing (Etwall Road). I started a thread on this forum back in 2021 about a traffic queue tailing back over the first of these as a result of an event at Mercia Marina (which, notably, they never repeated), otherwise traffic over this crossing is fairly light. Willington crossing (which I'm less familiar with) is the busier of the two. There's a traffic light junction about 300 yards away, if this is causing queues over the crossing then something definitely needs to be looked at. But knowing the BBC's (and the rest of the mainstream media's) penchant for hyperbole, it's probably just a result of the said A38 roadworks and isn't normally a problem.

A friend of mine once lived in Hilton. He was a railway engineer. He was at home when a car got taken out by a train on Marston Lane?, nearer to Tutbury. He was first on scene.

 

[chiltern trev]

It does look as though the level crossing rubber has been replaced but the yellow box not "repainted." That is no excuse for motorists to ignore it, but Darwin's Law applies, and evolution will proceed...

The Google maps street view image shows nice clean black rubber without yellow and that image is dated March 2023.

 

[Rescars]

Haven't there also been instances when car drivers claim to have been misled by their sat navs? Just about understandable if there is a road junction immediately after a level crossing and the sat nav is vociferously demanding a turn to the left. Old fashioned gates providing a physical barrier across the line would prevent this sort of error of course, but despite their absence it's not unreasonable to expect a motorist to be able to tell the difference between a roadway and a railway - even if some potholed road surfaces are looking increasingly like ballast!

 

[Trainman40083]

Haven't there also been instances when car drivers claim to have been misled by their sat navs? Just about understandable if there is a road junction immediately after a level crossing and the sat nav is vociferously demanding a turn to the left. Old fashioned gates providing a physical barrier across the line would prevent this sort of error of course, but despite their absence it's not unreasonable to expect a motorist to be able to tell the difference between a roadway and a railway - even if some potholed road surfaces are looking increasingly like ballast!

Now that reminds me of an incident at Egginton Level Crossing. Was more farm gates rather than barriers. Crossing keeper was shutting the gates and a car crashed through, crushing him.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Personally I’d only commit to a level crossing once it’s physically impossible for the vehicle in front not to clear it. Takes all sorts I guess…

Even that is risk-taking.

I wouldn't even move until there was at least a space as long as my own car clear of the other side of the crossing.

That is the ideal, but really wouldn't work at the level crossing I use most frequently (North Sheen). After queuing for as many as three trains to pass, to expect drivers to then leave at least three car lengths (the distance between the gates, plus another car length) between each other would reduce the number of cars crossing before the wig wags start again (unknowable, and possibly be as soon as 30 seconds later) to a quarter. I have often had to queue for the crossing to go through its cycle three times before getting across.

At busy times (like when the Rugby is on at Twickenham) there can be tailbacks from the Great Chertsey Road roundabout 200 yards beyond, but people are suually sensible and don't enter the crossing if the traffic beyond is actually stationary.

It is a full barrier crossing, and monitored, so there is little risk of being trapped. More caution is needed at an AHB.

 

[WestAnglian]

You can see why the railway is going to the expense of having obstacle detectors at certain level crossings.

Obstacle detection is a cost-saving measure to remove the need for a signaller to look at the CCTV and press the clear button, isn't it? I'm not claiming that it's installed just to save money, but that would be a consequence.

 

[Trainman40083]

Obstacle detection is a cost-saving measure to remove the need for a signaller to look at the CCTV and press the clear button, isn't it? I'm not claiming that it's installed just to save money, but that would be a consequence.

I remember the first installation of obstacle detection equipment. Can't recall which crossing it was; but it was in the York/Scarborough area. The signalman decided to leave the CCTV equipment on. Barriers would not lower. Seagulls on the crossing. Well it sure picked them up.

 

[greatkingrat]

Imagine needing a yellow box to make you aware that stopping on a train track is a silly idea.

So much signage and instruction is needed in most cases now not necessarily because people aren’t aware of the rules, they just will willing ignore them if they think they can get away with it.

Imagine needing TPWS to stop train drivers passing red signals?

The railway rightly has multiple safety systems in place, there is no reason why level crossings should be any different.

 

[Annetts key]

Not applicable here where the crossing appears to be an AHB type. But at a MCB or a CCTV MCB crossing where there are full barriers that close the entire carriageway, it is fun to lower them and trap a car or van or lorry, and then wait for the driver to panic and get out and quickly look around for the train... (not knowing that no railway employee would allow a train to approach under these circumstances).

There are also far too many people (drivers, cyclists and pedestrians) who ignore the amber lights and sometimes the flashing red lights on the wig-says and only stop when they see the barriers lowering.

Part of the problem is that they think that because they are on a public road, they have some kind of right.

Some even do these stupid things when railway staff (dressed in orange) are stood at the level crossing... Even sometimes when one barrier is down (due to a fault)...

Maintenance staff, MOMs, signallers and crossing keepers often have abusive language shouted at them.

This kind of behaviour now means that when carrying out routine maintenance at a level crossing, I now recommend that the maintenance staff obtain a temporary road closure from the road authority and block the road.

Although not practical if attending due to a failure of the level crossing equipment.

 

[MarkyT]

I really dislike AHBCs. They rely on far greater road user discipline than alternative full barrier and locally monitored types. I've noticed in many recent projects where crossing equipment was renewed, conversion from AHBC to full barrier MCB-OD also occurred. With modern growth in road traffic, it's likely at many existing sites, AHBCs wouldn't be permitted under the rules applying at their time of original construction, with qualifying sites subject to a maximum traffic flow limit and having no significant junctions or other potential sources of obstruction nearby that could plausibly initiate a blocking back event over the railway.

The MCB-OD type is much safer, but road closure time is typically extended substantially for each train passage. In some locations, a new crossing type may be suitable today, with Full Barriers, Obstacle Detection technology, and Local monitoring. Like an ABCL (Automatic (half) Barrier Crossing Locally monitored), the AFBCL (Automatic Full Barrier Crossing Locally monitored) type can permit a much shorter road closure time than an MCB-OD, but sighting constraints can limit rail approach speed, which in any case cannot exceed 55mph, bearing in mind that for local monitoring the approaching train must be able to make a stop before the road from the point any obstruction becomes visible or if the drivers flashing white light fails to illuminate. The speed limit can be a major limitation for fast and heavy operations, but in some locations, such as where all trains are slowing due to local track geometry or a nearby station stop, it may not be a problem.

 

[Bald Rick]

But at a MCB or a CCTV MCB crossing where there are full barriers that close the entire carriageway, it is fun to lower them and trap a car or van or lorry, and then wait for the driver to panic and get out and quickly look around for the train... (not knowing that no railway employee would allow a train to approach under these circumstances).

That’s not really fun, as there is a reasonably high risk that the driver will drive through the closed barrier to escape the crossing. I’ve been stood next to an LX when this has happened. I guess you know as well as anyone what a pain it can be to get the barrier back on, especially if the shear bolts haven’t done their job properly, or the skirt is damaged.

 

[P Binnersley]

It does look as though the level crossing rubber has been replaced but the yellow box not "repainted." That is no excuse for motorists to ignore it, but Darwin's Law applies, and evolution will proceed...

According to Google Streetview the crossing has been like that since at least 2008 (17 years)!

 

[PeterC]

Personally I’d only commit to a level crossing once it’s physically impossible for the vehicle in front not to clear it. Takes all sorts I guess…

I have done that on an ordinary box junction only for the driver in front to decide that he wanted to stop and admire some empty tarmac leaving me with my rear wheels still in the box.

 

[Harpo]

I remember the first installation of obstacle detection equipment. Can't recall which crossing it was; but it was in the York/Scarborough area. The signalman decided to leave the CCTV equipment on. Barriers would not lower. Seagulls on the crossing. Well it sure picked them up.

Filey was the OD test site. The initial production OD applications included LIDAR supplementary detectors as the main RADAR OD wasn’t certified to detect close enough to the crossing deck at that time.

Low level scanning was needed to achieve ORR approval, demonstrating that a child laying on the deck would be detected.

Production OD doesn’t need or include CCTV, it would just create a more expensive version of a CCTV crossing.

 

[norbitonflyer]

I have done that on an ordinary box junction only for the driver in front to decide that he wanted to stop and admire some empty tarmac leaving me with my rear wheels still in the box.

I had similar - someone switched lanes ahead of me and filled the gap that had been there when I entered the junction

 

[MarkyT]

Filey was the OD test site. The initial production OD applications included LIDAR supplementary detectors as the main RADAR OD wasn’t certified to detect close enough to the crossing deck at that time.

Low level scanning was needed to achieve ORR approval, demonstrating that a child laying on the deck would be detected.

Production OD doesn’t need or include CCTV, it would just create a more expensive version of a CCTV crossing.

I first came across OD as a consultant in the mid 90s when working on some signalling design for Swedish railways. They had recently started employing the tech in a full barrier configuration at rural crossings on upgraded mainlines where line speed could be up to 200km/h. A major concern going high speed through this landscape was 'elk-strike' and the massive creatures were known to follow roads and 'square up' to oncoming trains at crossings. Looking wider I found the tech already well established in Japan, allowing some insanely busy urban crossings to function safely.

 

[Annetts key]

That’s not really fun, as there is a reasonably high risk that the driver will drive through the closed barrier to escape the crossing. I’ve been stood next to an LX when this has happened. I guess you know as well as anyone what a pain it can be to get the barrier back on, especially if the shear bolts haven’t done their job properly, or the skirt is damaged.

Maybe I should clarify the context. Two S&T in orange stood next to the crossing and a third in the signal box operating the crossing controls.

In addition, the type of barriers were fibreglass BR Western Region types. These don't have shear bolts to worry about. The booms normally don't get damaged by road vehicles. Although the skirt may need repairs.

Further, where is the road vehicle going to go if the reason that they were trapped on the crossing is due to a queue of traffic beyond the crossing (and on the other side of the crossing).

You may get the idea that I'm talking about one specific crossing, and you would be right. This particular crossing has a checkpoint just beyond it. Hence very regular occurrence of queuing traffic.

And yes, it's not something that I would do for a crossing with BR943 barriers because they are a right pain if damaged by being hit by a road vehicle.

 

[Spartacus]

So it has finally happened - the article refers to a train hitting a car last month. Thankfully there were no injuries (presumably the train just wiped off a bumper).

It's a pity they didn't show a picture of the car. If the train had hit it a foot or so further back the driver wouldn't have just got a sore thumb and embarrassing insurance assessment for their troubles.

 

[Tetragon213]

Stick a camera up, and start sending £140 fines through peoples' letterboxes. I'm sure word will get out quickly not to stop on the crossing!

There need to be consequences for the message to stick, and ideally that consequence should be less lethal than "Hixon/Lockington repeat no. 3".

 

[QueensCurve]

News story about a Level Crossing in the Midlands where drivers frequently get stuck in a queue /jam that blocks the rail line, and presumably holds up trains

Warning as drivers seen queuing on level crossing near Willington

Police say drivers have been stopping on the crossing in a village in south Derbyshire.

www.bbc.co.uk

Many, possibly most, drivers are very bad at this. When the vehicle in front stops, they stop right on it's tail. Box junctions, junctions generally and level crossings get obstructed. The solution is to follow at no less than 2 seconds headway and therefore to have spare time to scan the general situation rather than just the back of the vehicle in front.

 

[jfollows]

I amuse myself sometimes when I’m in slow moving traffic - easily amused I know - with the white KEEP CLEAR things painted in the road. They’re only usually stating the obvious, ie don’t block the junction, but I observe them, then move forward when the road ahead clears, and stop with the rear of my car on the line. The car behind inevitably follows me and ends up blocking the junction. Even better when someone else wants to turn and can’t. I know, I’m very shallow.

 

[cool110]

Many, possibly most, drivers are very bad at this. When the vehicle in front stops, they stop right on it's tail. Box junctions, junctions generally and level crossings get obstructed.

Even so called professional drivers. Had a Metrolink driver on the PA joking that "they'll let anyone drive a bus these days" after one blocked us arriving into Shudehill.

 

[work-traveller]

The obvious presence of a railway should be reason enough to no drive onto the LX and (knowingly) block it, regardless of the condition of yellow roadpaint and highway signage. This would seem like reasonable grounds a a fine and points on the driving license - at the least.

 

[Gloster]

The obvious presence of a railway should be reason enough to no drive onto the LX and (knowingly) block it, regardless of the condition of yellow roadpaint and highway signage. This would seem like reasonable grounds a a fine and points on the driving license - at the least.

Yes, but too many drivers see themselves as rulers of the King‘s Highway: nobody should get in their way and nothing should delay them. Poop, poop! There are also all too many people behind the steering wheel who are driving on auto-pilot, particularly on their regular route. If they aren’t used to being stopped on a crossing, the thought that they might be and the possible consequences aren’t even considered.

 

[Krokodil]

The obvious presence of a railway should be reason enough to no drive onto the LX and (knowingly) block it, regardless of the condition of yellow roadpaint and highway signage. This would seem like reasonable grounds a a fine and points on the driving license - at the least.

If you're expecting motorists to pay attention to the road ahead you're going to be disappointed.

 

[styles]

Should be careless driving FPNs all round for people stopping on level crossings; regardless of congestion, yellow boxes, etc.

That said I would yellow box them all anyway.

 

[45Fox]

Some people might assume erroneously that there is a signalman to stop trains if the crossing is blocked. Perhaps they should have red boxes (ie like red routes in London) to distinguish them from the more common and less important ones at road junctions.

They're only at 'manned' level crossings anyway. Even though they operate automatically, they're not classed as automatic crossings.

AHB crossings are entirely automatic and they rely entirely on road users to use them properly. There is nothing at the crossing which checks whether the line is clear and indeed in most cases there isn't even a protecting signal.

Ignorance among the general public (road users) as to how AHB crossings work and the protection of them from train movements was a major part of the horrendous Hixon accident in 1968.
Incidentally, not that far away from the crossing here.

 

[edwin_m]

Ignorance among the general public (road users) as to how AHB crossings work and the protection of them from train movements was a major part of the horrendous Hixon accident in 1968.

Not only the general public, also the specialist staff operating the exceptional load and the police escorting it.