Draft Anglia route study published

[ironstone11]

No mention of Chelmsford North which seems odd given planning permission granted.

It appears several times in the document, including here:-

See para. 2.8.12

• Beaulieu Park
The proposal is for a new station approximately three miles to the
north-east of Chelmsford Station on the Great Eastern Main Line.
The current plans consist of a four-platform station and includes
proposals for approximately 1,400 car parking spaces at the station,
including 25 disabled spaces, comprising 300 premium spaces and
1,100 spaces in a multi-storey car park. Cycle parking and storage
for 500 cycles will be provided. The station will also be a bus
interchange for services in the Springfield area.

 

[evergreenadam]

para 5.4.4 reads as below. This is wrong. There are currently 3 12 car west anglia services in the morning peak, the 0647, 0717 and 0747 from Cambridge arriving Liv St 0755, 0825 and 0855. It is surprising that this is wrong in the consultation paper.

Generally as regards West Anglia the paper is uninspiring in my view. 4-tracking Coppermill to Brox is aired but basically dismissed as uneconomic, and there seem to be no other proposals for major infrastructure improvements to increase capacity or line speeds other than extending platforms so all Camb and Hertford East services can run as 12 cars. Para 5.4.12 suggests 4 extra 4 car units should be procured to strengthen Hertford East and Camb peak services, which is stated as being sufficient to meet capacity requirements to end of CP6.
It is not immediately clear how much traffic they are assuming from Stansted Airport, which has been volatile in the past. But overall 4 extra 12 car in place of 8 car services with no infrastructure improvements seems very un-ambitious for such a busy and congested route.
Currently almost none of the Stansted 'express' services run at line speed Stortford - Tott Hale as they all catch stopping services, and journey times to Stansted as is well known are poor, and the service is poor value for money given the premium fares charged to the airport.

Perhaps all this will be overtaken by CrossRail 2?

There is no discussion of any infrastructure changes at Brox. Currently as I understand it Hertford East to Liv St services cannot arrive on the down side nor can departures towards Hertford East leave from the up side. The only way to terminate an up Hertford East service and return it to Hertford East is to run it south of the station and then cross over to the down side, which is impractical cus it blocks the main line. This seems to me to be a major operating obstacle especially during disruption. Is there no possibility of signalling changes to allow services from Hert East to run into the down side and return to Hert East? Or even building a third track on the down side between Brox Junction to the station to keep Hert East services off the main line until south of Brox? (Admittedly it is a mile or so through a swamp so not easy to add extra track, but surely not impossible).


5.4.4 Cambridge and Stansted Airport services arriving into London Liverpool Street between 08:00 and 09:00 are all 8 carriages in length. The Stansted Airport services and one of the Cambridge services are run using rolling stock that tends to have a low number of seats per carriage. This is appropriate to meet the market for travel to and from the airport because passengers value comfort and space for luggage. Higher density rolling stock could mitigate the capacity gap into London in the peak, but will impact adversely on the airport passengers. Lengthening two of the services from 8 carriages to 12 carriages in length between 08:00 and 09:00 would meet the capacity gap by the end of CP6 and is likely to be the best option

I too noticed that mistake about there being no peak hour 12 car trains from Cambridge to Liverpool St, I couldn't believe they missed one of the big capacity enhancing measures in recent years! I will point that out in my consultation response.

Greater Anglia's own busy train information displayed on their website shows that many of the remaining 8 car trains currently leaving Harlow Town for Liverpool Street in the AM peak have no seats free. Increasing the length of just two more trains from Cambridge/Stansted Airport in the high AM peak to 12 cars given the likely increase in passenger numbers seems wholly inadequate and will leave many passengers standing for more than the 20 minutes allowed for the purposes of measuring overcrowding.

 

[Class 170101]

Increasing the length of just two more trains from Cambridge/Stansted Airport in the high AM peak to 12 cars given the likely increase in passenger numbers seems wholly inadequate and will leave many passengers standing for more than the 20 minutes allowed for the purposes of measuring overcrowding.

Does it?

Harlow Town to Tottenham Hale non-stop is currently less than 20 minutes. With inetrmediate stops does it actually count? I thought there was some wheeze where they could say it wasn't because trains stopped.

 

[PeterC]

For the GEML expansion of LST do they mean:

1. Crossrail won't release sufficient capacity
2. They are ignoring the capacity being released
3. They will claim credit for the capacity released by Crossrail

 

[evergreenadam]

Does it?

Harlow Town to Tottenham Hale non-stop is currently less than 20 minutes. With inetrmediate stops does it actually count? I thought there was some wheeze where they could say it wasn't because trains stopped.

You are right, most trains do stop within 20 mins of Tottenham Hale and would therefore be entitled to load to up to 135% of standard class seats on arrival at Tottenham Hale before being considered overcrowded for PIXC purposes. There is however one service originating at Stansted Airport which takes longer than 20 mins to cover the same distance during the height of the morning peak so that one would only have standard class seating allowance.

The fast trains from Cambridge (last stop Bishop's Stortford) would only have standard class seating allowance but most have already been lengthened to 12 cars presumably because they would exceed the PIXC target otherwise.

 

[Julia]

no mention of Soham station?

 

[evergreenadam]

no mention of Soham station?

There was a mention, as an aspiration of local communities etc. But work to double sections of single line between Bury and Ely via Soham is necessary primarily to facilitate more frequent freight services. When that is done there will also be more line capacity for extra passenger services. The Ipswich-Ely service is proposed to be increased to hourly at which point it would be attractive enough to generate decent patronage from a new station at Soham.

 

[MarkyT]

There was a mention, as an aspiration of local communities etc. But work to double sections of single line between Bury and Ely via Soham is necessary primarily to facilitate more frequent freight services. When that is done there will also be more line capacity for extra passenger services. The Ipswich-Ely service is proposed to be increased to hourly at which point it would be attractive enough to generate decent patronage from a new station at Soham.

Perhaps an hourly Ely - Soham - Newmarket - Cambridge service could be a better commercial bet, strengthening the popular Cambridge -Newmarket connection to half hourly assuming there was sufficient capacity on the single line sections. Not saying an enhanced Ipswich Ely service should't call as well if the station was there.

 

[Tobbes]

Given the growth of Cambridge, then better commuter journeys from the Soham/Newmarket areas would be valuable. Cambridge also strikes me as a potentially major beneficiary of tram-trains with on-street running into the centre of town - will watch the forthcoming experiments with interest. (And perhaps then we can be rid of the ludicrous busway.... and use the busway to reinstate a northern route for East West Rail from Bedford.)

 

[MarkyT]

Perhaps an hourly Ely - Soham - Newmarket - Cambridge service could be a better commercial bet

I forgot to mention that would also need the reinstatement of the missing leg in the triangular junction just north of Newmarket!

.... and use the busway to reinstate a northern route for East West Rail from Bedford.

Always thought that would be a good idea. It's a fairly well engineered route with wide curves capable of reasonable speed throughout. Probably quite difficult to get into Huntingdon and link to the ECML, where the long closed old route has been blocked in a number of places, so perhaps a largely new alignment would be needed in that area. A triangular junction with the ECML could allow services from Cambridge to Peterborough along one leg and Bedford along the other. Peterborough - Cambridge via Huntingdon would be quite a bit shorter and quicker than via March, requiring less new electrification mileage overall that could be shared with the EWR trains coming from Bedford.

 

[Tobbes]

Sorry, I should've been clearer - I would take E-WR to St Neots with a station at Great Cambourne before heading to Bedford. A tram-train link would then be laid over the busway nonsense to Huntingdon, terminating at the mainline station via Oakington, Fenstanton and Hemmingsford Grey.

 

[jopsuk]

Large sections of Cambridge-Newmarket have the space for (re?)doubling- I think including the bridges (over a path on Coldham's common, a foot bridge over the line there, over Barnwell Road and Coldham's Lane and the Tin's path bridge over the line).

To support a Cambridge-Ely via Newmarket service, a couple of additional stations would be a good idea. One for Cherry Hinton & Fulbourn- by Tesco- might be useful, and a Six Mile Bottom Parkway.

Forget the cast.iron fantasies of replacing the busway with a railway again. Once the new station is built that would be rather impractical, to say the least.

 

[Tobbes]

The problem with writing off the busway option is that it is remains the easiest route into Cambridge from the NW. I agree that the new station won't work for EWR trains over the busway alignment, but since this is a crayons out exercise, I'd build an EWR station closer to the centre of the Science Park. This routing also allows for a station out at Gt Cambourne in the middle of an area which IIRC is having lots of new housing. Interchange at St Neots for Peterborough and the ECML is an added attraction - going all the way to Huntingdon to come back to Bedford seems a little silly, and would have a serious knock-on effect for Ox-Cambs journey times.

And yes, fully agree on the benefits of a new station for Cherry Hinton / Fulbourn and Six Mile Bottom.

 

[CockneySparrow]

Perhaps an hourly Ely - Soham - Newmarket - Cambridge service could be a better commercial bet, strengthening the popular Cambridge -Newmarket connection to half hourly assuming there was sufficient capacity on the single line sections. Not saying an enhanced Ipswich Ely service should't call as well if the station was there.

Cant do it, the train would have to leave Ely go through to Bury and reverse back towards Newmarket and Cambridge, unless they re instate the missing track at Chippenham

 

[MarkyT]

Cant do it, the train would have to leave Ely go through to Bury and reverse back towards Newmarket and Cambridge, unless they re instate the missing track at Chippenham

Agreed there is a missing leg in the triangle, but on the bright side the former track bed there looks unobstructed.

 

[CockneySparrow]

Agreed there is a missing leg in the triangle, but on the bright side the former track bed there looks unobstructed.

The track bed is on a slight embankment with a couple of gaps to allow vehicles through, not sure what happens when it hits the tunnel the other end though Newmarket side, not sure whether it used to go through the existing tunnel or whether there is a second tunnel

 

[Tobbes]

I thought the missing SW-N curve on the Newmarket triangle joined the existing Kennett - Newmarket line short of the tunnel?

 

[CockneySparrow]

I thought the missing SW-N curve on the Newmarket triangle joined the existing Kennett - Newmarket line short of the tunnel?

Maybe but it isn't visible if it is, just before the tunnel is a load of trees that side