Doubt about advance ticket- missed connection

[rumoto]

Hello everyone,

last Tuesday I did a journey between Derby and Swindon using an Advance ticket.

The issue was that the 1829 train from Crosscountry suffered a 16-minute delay in Birmingham and I lost the connection in Cheltenham Spa to the 2001 train to Swindon; in this case, the connection time in Cheltenham is 11 minutes, more than the minimum connection time for this station.

My question is if I could have had the right to catch the 2025 train in Cheltenham and later changing in Bristol Parkway at 2103, arriving to Swindon half an hour earlier than waiting to the next Cheltenham-Swindon train via Stroud.

This time I preferred to wait to the 2100 Cheltenham-Swindon train, but I don't know if changing at Bristol in that situation is allowed using the same advance ticket.

Thanks

 

[221129]

Hello everyone,

last Tuesday I did a journey between Derby and Swindon using an Advance ticket.

The issue was that the 1829 train from Crosscountry suffered a 16-minute delay in Birmingham and I lost the connection in Cheltenham Spa to the 2001 train to Swindon; in this case, the connection time in Cheltenham is 11 minutes, more than the minimum connection time for this station.

My question is if I could have had the right to catch the 2025 train in Cheltenham and later changing in Bristol Parkway at 2103, arriving to Swindon half an hour earlier than waiting to the next Cheltenham-Swindon train via Stroud.

This time I preferred to wait to the 2100 Cheltenham-Swindon train, but I don't know if changing at Bristol in that situation is allowed using the same advance ticket.

Thanks

Officially no. But if you spoke to the TM on the XC and got your ticket endorsed and then spoke to the TM of the Parkway - Swindon train I am sure you'd be okay.

 

[Paul Kelly]

My question is if I could have had the right to catch the 2025 train in Cheltenham and later changing in Bristol Parkway at 2103, arriving to Swindon half an hour earlier than waiting to the next Cheltenham-Swindon train via Stroud.

Was there anything written on your ticket that indicated you have to go via Stroud? As far as I can see the only advance fares between Derby and Swindon that would be valid via Cheltenham are routed XC & CONNECTIONS, i.e. no route restriction apart from the fact that the itinerary must include CrossCountry (XC).

The terms and conditions for advance fares say If delays occur while travelling, you will be allowed to take the next available train(s) to complete your journey. To go via Bristol Parkway is certainly a permitted route between Derby and Swindon (available on map combination PY+SB, and if the next available trains followed that route, there should be no issue at all as far as I can see.

Officially no. But if you spoke to the TM on the XC and got your ticket endorsed and then spoke to the TM of the Parkway - Swindon train I am sure you'd be okay.

And what is your "official" source for that?

 

[ValleyLines142]

As you waited for the following service from Cheltenham to Swindon, and subsequently arrived at Swindon at 2207 instead of 2100, you should definitely be entitled to Delay Repay.

More info here.

 

[AlterEgo]

Was there anything written on your ticket that indicated you have to go via Stroud? As far as I can see the only advance fares between Derby and Swindon that would be valid via Cheltenham are routed XC & CONNECTIONS, i.e. no route restriction apart from the fact that the itinerary must include CrossCountry (XC).

The terms and conditions for advance fares say If delays occur while travelling, you will be allowed to take the next available train(s) to complete your journey. To go via Bristol Parkway is certainly a permitted route between Derby and Swindon (available on map combination PY+SB, and if the next available trains followed that route, there should be no issue at all as far as I can see.

And what is your "official" source for that?

If a delay occurs on an advance ticket, am I right in thinking your argument is that it converts the ticket into one valid by any permitted route? Is that supported by any documentation?

 

[Paul Kelly]

If a delay occurs on an advance ticket, am I right in thinking your argument is that it converts the ticket into one valid by any permitted route? Is that supported by any documentation?

I don't think there is any "conversion" required. There is no documentation I'm aware of that restricts the route taken by "the next available train(s)" to follow exactly the same route as the original booked itinerary.

An example that has been quoted on the forum before (see here for an example: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=1005324&postcount=13) is a journey from London St Pancras to Leeds, changing at Sheffield for a Northern semi-fast service via Barnsley and Wakefield Kirkgate. If the train into Sheffield is delayed passengers are permitted to travel on a fast CrossCountry service from Sheffield to Leeds which takes the route via Moorthorpe and Wakefield Westgate. I don't see how this situation is any different.

 

[Merseysider]

Spanner in the works - it may be slightly different if the Advance shows a 'via' location:

AP XC ONLY WVH
AP RUGBY
AP SLOUGH
AP SWINDON/NEWBRY

I believe a TOC restriction would only be enforceable if printed on the ticket. In the event of delay the aforementioned, except the first, would allow any train on the route to be taken.