Diverting Thameslink via Clapham Junction?

[Fenchurch SP]

Currently if the route via London Bridge is unavailable the usual diversions take either of two routes through Tulse Hill. This route is very slow even with a clear run(which is rare).
The alternative using the fast lines between East Croydon and Clapham Junction then via Factory Junction and Lougborough Junction would seem to be faster. It has been used on very rare occasions in the Class 319 era so maybe the 700s are not cleared for this route? Or is it the conflicts with the Southeastern Victoria services?

 

[Sad Sprinter]

I would imagine it would be too much of a pain to get the Thameslink off the Atlantic Lines onto the Chatham at Wandsworth Road.

 

[yoyothehobo]

It would be a very long way round and i dont think the track layout allows for it in a realistic manner.



This is what you would have to deal with

 

[43096]

It’s been done on the overnight Thameslink services. Not sure when the last diversions that way were, but I did it back in 2015 on a pair of 387s.

 

[JonathanH]

At one point, some Thameslink drivers had route knowledge via Clapham Junction, but both this, and more widespread knowledge of the route via Crystal Palace was allowed to lapse in favour of the Streatham route as the single alternative to going via London Bridge.

The Clapham Junction route was fine for overnight or limited ad hoc diversions but just too congested for it to be the primary diversionary route.

It did feel marginally quicker than going via Streatham. It was cleared for 700s.

 

[30907]

The advantage is being able to use the Fasts up to Pouparts Jn (and for a northbound train there's less conflict). But it's a perceived advantage, and the distance is longer.

On a rough-and-ready comparison of running times, East Croydon to Loughborough Jn (start to pass) is 20min, while the booked time via Streatham is 18min with a Selhurst stop for staff. I don't think you could match that via CLJ even in the dead of night.
During the day it would be a bother (or something) to path, not that Streatham is easy I assume.

 

[PGAT]

Even if the distance is longer, I think passengers would appreciate a decently long 70mph stretch instead of loads of slow agonising journeys via Tulse Hill

 

[JonathanH]

Even if the distance is longer, I think passengers would appreciate a decently long 70mph stretch instead of loads of slow agonising journeys via Tulse Hill

Yes, absolutely. From experience, it is a very smooth journey via Clapham Junction (indeed surprisingly so) compared to the awkward late night crawl via Herne Hill, Tulse Hill and Streatham.

 

[Jan Mayen]

The one time I was went that way, it was late at night. I only realised what was happening when the lineside foliage could be heard scrapping along the outside of the Class 700.

 

[PGAT]

Just for fun I did some maths and it turns out East Croydon to Loughborough Junction would take 16 minutes via Clapham, as opposed to 23 minutes via Streatham.

 

[30907]

Just for fun I did some maths and it turns out East Croydon to Loughborough Junction would take 16 minutes via Clapham, as opposed to 23 minutes via Streatham.

Remarkable, when tonight's 2311 HRH-PBO is allowed 17 plus pathing (to allow forca Selhurst stop).
I have managed to get the time via CLJ down to 17min rather than 20 (I forgot how slow the route from P1 to Longhedge on the Overground side was!)

 

[Bald Rick]

Currently if the route via London Bridge is unavailable the usual diversions take either of two routes through Tulse Hill. This route is very slow even with a clear run(which is rare).
The alternative using the fast lines between East Croydon and Clapham Junction then via Factory Junction and Lougborough Junction would seem to be faster. It has been used on very rare occasions in the Class 319 era so maybe the 700s are not cleared for this route? Or is it the conflicts with the Southeastern Victoria services?

It cost well over £1m to get the drivers trained for that route back 10 years ago, and IIRC it was only Blackfriars depot (since gone) and another link of drivers who signed it. Now, with many more drivers signing Blackfriars to Croydon, it would cost easily 3-4 times that to gain that knowledge, and then a way would have to be found to keep it, which itself wouldn’t be easy.