Delayed Worcester Park to Eastbourne

[dewsnapsliding]

Long time lurker here, but I'm requesting advice about a journey I made last week.

I booked a ticket online using my Virgin Trains account, for work, from Worcester Park to Eastbourne for the 23/1/13, (an anytime day return from Worcester Park to Eastbourne - not via London for £28.10).

I collected the tickets from a ticket machine at Wimbledon Station whilst travelling to work a couple of weeks prior to the date.

When looking to book the journey, I needed to arrive in Eatbourne by around 10:30, and the suggested journey was the 08:25 to Clapham Junction, due to arrive 08:43. Southern train to Eastbourne 08:53 to arrive Eastbourne around 10:14.

As it was I thought that this was leaving me enough time, but on the 23/1/13 the SWT service from Worcester Park did not arrive Clapham Junction until 08:54 (at the earliest), and consequently I missed my train and had to wait 30 mins for the next Eastbourne train.

The question is, am I entitled to claim delay repay - as I understand it SWT have a limit of anything under 60 mins not being applicable? And if so, then who from - Virgin/SWT/Southern?

 

[maniacmartin]

If you do not qualify for Delay Repay under the scheme of the TOC whose service the initial delay occurred, then as far as I can see, you cannot make a claim at all, given that you have now travelled on the ticket.

 

[LexyBoy]

SWT don't operate a Delay Repay scheme, and as you say SWT only offer compensation for delays of 60 minutes or more (and then only if the cause was "within the Railway's control"), so you're not entitled to compensation in this instance.

I'd also comment that you'd be better off buying such walk-on tickets the day before or on the day in future, in case of a change of plans leaving you unable to use the ticket.

 

[swt_passenger]

SWT do not operate Delay Repay, they are still on the old system until the next time the franchise is re-let.

There's therefore no scope for compensation as far as I can see.

 

[island]

I'd also comment that you'd be better off buying such walk-on tickets the day before or on the day in future, in case of a change of plans leaving you unable to use the ticket.

Or in the alternative buying them from Southern!

 

[dewsnapsliding]

I'd also comment that you'd be better off buying such walk-on tickets the day before or on the day in future, in case of a change of plans leaving you unable to use the ticket.

Why? I had an appointment in Eastbourne, what benefit would there have been leaving it until closer to the time to purchase the ticket?

Or in the alternative buying them from Southern!

Again, apologies for the question but what difference would this have made? Would I have been able to claim from Southern if the journey had been delayed due to the initial SWT service?

It would appear that the chances of SWT ever having to pay out anything for delays is infintessimally small given the relatively high-frequency nature of most of their services. I understand that this is due to the nature of the franchise agreement, but who decided that a delay of 59 minutes is acceptable? :-x

 

[maniacmartin]

Why? I had an appointment in Eastbourne, what benefit would there have been leaving it until closer to the time to purchase the ticket?

Because if you later decided not to travel or your travel plans changed, you wouldn't be stuck with some tickets you no longer need. There is no financial benefit to buying walkup tickets in advance, although you might want to to avoid queues on the day or get seat reservations on services that allow them.

Again, apologies for the question but what difference would this have made? Would I have been able to claim from Southern if the journey had been delayed due to the initial SWT service?

If you purchase any walk-up tickets or Southern Advances (but not Advances for other Train Companies' services) on Southern's website, but don't ever collect them from the machine, you can apply for a full refund on their website, whether the train was delayed or not. You don't even have to give a reason at all. This is Southern's Money Back Guarantee, which other companies' websites don't offer.

It would appear that the chances of SWT ever having to pay out anything for delays is infintessimally small given the relatively high-frequency nature of most of their services. I understand that this is due to the nature of the franchise agreement, but who decided that a delay of 59 minutes is acceptable? :-x

Well, ultimately, the DfT allowed the franchise to be granted with those terms. There is good news though, in that all new franchises that have been agreed by the DfT have had to implement the Delay Repay scheme, so when SWT's franchise is up for renewal, we will probably see Delay Repay introduced.

 

[sarahj]

If you purchase any walk-up tickets or Southern Advances (but not Advances for other Train Companies' services) on Southern's website, but don't ever collect them from the machine, you can apply for a full refund on their website, whether the train was delayed or not. You don't even have to give a reason at all. This is Southern's Money Back Guarantee, which other companies' websites don't offer.


This is of course that you dont travel. Not picking them up and travelling would be seen as not having a valid ticket.

SJ

 

[Bill Badger]

It would appear that the chances of SWT ever having to pay out anything for delays is infintessimally small given the relatively high-frequency nature of most of their services. I understand that this is due to the nature of the franchise agreement, but who decided that a delay of 59 minutes is acceptable? :-x

I made my first claim in 12 years of living in SWT land about 3 weeks ago, following a signal failure at Surbiton! They are clearly not well geared up for the process though. No standard form so I had to write a letter, receive a written acknowledgement back, saying they will review it and write back to me in a further 20 working days.

 

[bb21]

I understand that this is due to the nature of the franchise agreement, but who decided that a delay of 59 minutes is acceptable? :-x

A line has to be drawn somewhere. What do you suggest then as the threshold and why?

Why is a delay of 29 minutes acceptable under Delay Repay but a delay of 30 minutes not?

 

[dewsnapsliding]

Thanks to all the advice - particularly that of Southern's Money Back Guarantee, as that is well worth knowing.

A line has to be drawn somewhere. What do you suggest then as the threshold and why?

Why is a delay of 29 minutes acceptable under Delay Repay but a delay of 30 minutes not?

I'm looking at it from a pov of any service failing to be delivered in 59 minutes. The longer the service takes (duration), the more acceptable significant delays would seem to be, i.e. an hour delay on a 12-hour flight.
However, on a high-frequency route in my example from Worcester Park to Clapham Junction, the fact that a service took around 30 mins for a timetabled 18 minute journey is fairly ridiculous. (I use the word timetabled as I appreciate how slowly the train generally runs on the route anyway). (The conductor on said train indicated that the delay was down to a late-running train in front of us).

There has to be a line somewhere, but 59 mins on SWT's high-frequency service is (imo) way too far in the favour of the Operator. Where is the incentive to run a "better" service recovery?

Perhaps the delay "acceptable limit" should be worked out as a %late of timetabled journey. For the hard of Maths, there could even be a calculator on the website of the TOC in question linked to actual recorded time data, to establish if there was a case for a claim anyway. This would prevent people claiming without reason, and save the TOC's time and effort in replying.

 

[reb0118]

Perhaps the delay "acceptable limit" should be worked out as a % late of timetabled journey. For the hard of Maths, there could even be a calculator on the website of the TOC in question linked to actual recorded time data, to establish if there was a case for a claim anyway. This would prevent people claiming without reason, and save the TOC's time and effort in replying.

You have raised a good point. A 10 minute delay on the 50 min shuttle service between Edinburgh & Glasgow is significant. Not so on the 10 hr. Sleeper service from Aberdeen to London.

 

[bb21]

Perhaps the delay "acceptable limit" should be worked out as a %late of timetabled journey. For the hard of Maths, there could even be a calculator on the website of the TOC in question linked to actual recorded time data, to establish if there was a case for a claim anyway. This would prevent people claiming without reason, and save the TOC's time and effort in replying.

Yes, I agree that this could be a seemingly fairer alternative, however the bottom line is that there is a line to be drawn. Wherever that line is, the same situation will exist where some people who, had they been delayed by an extra minute, would be entitled to compensation whereas as things stand they get nothing.

I do not disagree that being delayed by half an hour on an 18-minute journey is not really acceptable.

 

[greatkingrat]

The other anomaly is that compensation depends on the ticket price for the whole journey, not just the bit that was delayed.

So if an East Coast train is delayed for an hour between Newcastle and Edinburgh, a person with a London - Edinburgh ticket gets far more compensation than a person with a Newcastle - Edinburgh ticket, even though they have both been delayed for exactly the same time.

 

[bb21]

The other anomaly is that compensation depends on the ticket price for the whole journey, not just the bit that was delayed.

So if an East Coast train is delayed for an hour between Newcastle and Edinburgh, a person with a London - Edinburgh ticket gets far more compensation than a person with a Newcastle - Edinburgh ticket, even though they have both been delayed for exactly the same time.

True, but then on the other side of the coin the person with a ticket from London might argue that the delay rendered his journey pointless as he no longer had time to do whatever he planned to do. Therefore it is the whole journey that should be compensated for.

One of those shings where there isn't a "fair" solution to all I'm afraid.