Delay Repay - what counts as arrived?

[mbreckers]

Hi folks,

quick question - What do Virgin Trains WC count as arrived for delay repay claims?

In this instance it is in relation to a train from London Euston to Glasgow Central, which was 29 minutes 45 seconds late approaching Glasgow Central.

As anyone who has arrived at Glasgow Central knows, it can sometimes take several minutes to travel across the bridge outside Central, and then actually getting into the platform. The train registered on RTT as approaching as it was starting its journey across the bridge as 29 and 3/4 late.

Service in question:

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P55228/2015/08/03/advanced

 

[najaB]

The train registered on RTT as approaching as it was starting its journey across the bridge as 29 and 3/4 late.

If shows as arrived 29 3/4 late now, but in my experience they would count that as 30 minutes. Though, that was when repay was only done in RTVs.

 

[mbreckers]

If shows as arrived 29 3/4 late now, but in my experience they would count that as 30 minutes. Though, that was when repay was only done in RTVs.

Yeah, I just dont know whether there is another monitoring point on the platform itself, or the monitoring point on the bridge is the final one.

But I will put a delay repay claim in anyway and see what happens / hope for the best

 

[gray1404]

If you were on the service, what time did it full into the platform and the doors were released. If you were on the service you would most likely know that information. If indeed the train (which you were on so should know) was 30 minutes late into the station then stand your ground if they reject your claim. Write back/email back insisting it was 30 minutes and you know because you were on the train (of course).

I think you will be fine though but do let us know how you get on.

 

[causton]

Yeah, I just dont know whether there is another monitoring point on the platform itself, or the monitoring point on the bridge is the final one.

But I will put a delay repay claim in anyway and see what happens / hope for the best

If it is, the system will add an offset to the time anyway, so it should be the time it got to the platform on average (not taking into account slow drivers, longer/shorter trains, different routes possibly etc)!
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Also just noticed you're using the lateness in the RTT advanced mode, which measures against the Working Timetable and not the Public Timetable. As the Public Timetable says 23, and yours arrived at 51 and 3/4, it could possibly be counted as only 28 late (as is shown in the RTT "simple" mode)...

 

[455driver]

So you basically want to bend the rules so you can make a claim!

 

[mbreckers]

So you basically want to bend the rules so you can make a claim!

Eh no actually, because the time sitting on that bridge could mean the difference between being over thirty minutes or not for delay repay

 

[gazthomas]

I think if you got off the train at 30 minutes or over that is adequate for delay repay

 

[Tom]

Eh no actually, because the time sitting on that bridge could mean the difference between being over thirty minutes or not for delay repay

The time on the bridge is in the most part irrelevant. While the time is derived from the time at which it passes the signal, an offset is added to the time which based on an average of several trains taking to arrive. In general, the time displayed is accurate to within about 15-20 seconds for wheels stop at the platform.

 

[455driver]

I think if you got off the train at 30 minutes or over that is adequate for delay repay

So if the train arrived at its final stop 27 minutes late all you have to do is sit there for 5 minutes and then claim that you were 32 minutes late. :roll:

 

[gray1404]

Hang on, you were on the train, so tell us what time did the train arrive at the platform and come to a stop? You should know if you were there on the said train. I'm wondering if you might have some doubts as to the validity of your claim, hence posting for others views cheaky! hehe

 

[mbreckers]

Hang on, you were on the train, so tell us what time did the train arrive at the platform and come to a stop? You should know if you were there on the said train. I'm wondering if you might have some doubts as to the validity of your claim, hence posting for others views cheaky! hehe

I never said I was on a train, a friend of mine was on the train, and he needs help with this sort of stuff.

Unfortunately he didn't check exactly what time the train arrived so I can only go with the information I can find.

Twitter didn't help as someone else on the train said it arrived 45 minutes late, I'm going on the basis that RTT is more accurate. I just don't want to help him doing a delay repay claim for it to be rejected, as he would interpret it differently to how you or I would.

 

[gray1404]

Sorry I wrongly assumed that you were on the train. In that case then, why not put in the claim anyway. If it gets rejected then it not like its a problem. It will just be a standard letter of "...sorry we can only award compensation for delays of 30 minutes or more and this does not apply to your train....." or something like that.

How would you friend view it if it got rejected?

You could Tweet VT and ask them to look up the train in question and how late it was? They'll be able to tell you if you have a valid claim (for your friend). I believe they are 24/7.

 

[mbreckers]

Sorry I wrongly assumed that you were on the train. In that case then, why not put in the claim anyway. If it gets rejected then it not like its a problem. It will just be a standard letter of "...sorry we can only award compensation for delays of 30 minutes or more and this does not apply to your train....." or something like that.

How would you friend view it if it got rejected?

Unfortunately he would view it as a personal attack on him, I know it wouldnt be but his mental health gets in the way of that

 

[gray1404]

Unfortunately he would view it as a personal attack on him, I know it wouldnt be but his mental health gets in the way of that

You could Tweet VT and ask them to look up the train in question and how late it was? They'll be able to tell you if you have a VALID claim (for your friend). I believe they are 24/7. [not sure if you saw thi on my last post as I added it in as an edit]

Oh yes, I understand mental heath issues and its good your able to help him in contacting Virgin.

In that case I would recommend you allow him to use your address as a correspondence address and offer to take it up with Virgin for him. You can apply using his name (or even your name if your acting on his behalf as Support) at your address and you can open any correspondence. If they reply with compensation you can give him the good news. If its a negative reply, you can just tell him simply that you've been in touch with Virgin and they've said the train was not late enough and he need not see the letter. That way he won't see it as a personal attack.

 

[mbreckers]

You could Tweet VT and ask them to look up the train in question and how late it was? They'll be able to tell you if you have a VALID claim (for your friend). I believe they are 24/7. [not sure if you saw thi on my last post as I added it in as an edit]

Oh yes, I understand mental heath issues and its good your able to help him in contacting Virgin.

In that case I would recommend you allow him to use your address as a correspondence address and offer to take it up with Virgin for him. You can apply using his name (or even your name if your acting on his behalf as Support) at your address and you can open any correspondence. If they reply with compensation you can give him the good news. If its a negative reply, you can just tell him simply that you've been in touch with Virgin and they've said the train was not late enough and he need not see the letter. That way he won't see it as a personal attack.

Thank you, I never even thought of tweeting them, how could I have forgotten about that

It's a difficult balance between support and him maintaining his own independence and again if I'm doing things that he would view behind his back he would view it differently

But yeah, I will tweet VT just now

 

[gray1404]

Great, let us know what they say.

 

[bnm]

Ignore the naysayers.

If you don't ask, you don't get.

 

[mbreckers]

Great, let us know what they say.

They've already got back to me:

it arrived 19:51hrs at 29 minutes late ^AN

At the Platform mbreckers, please still submit your claim ^AN

 

[gray1404]

So thats the greenlight then for the claim to go in hey

 

[mbreckers]

So thats the greenlight then for the claim to go in hey

Yep I'll help him submit it when I next see him on Wednesday

 

[yorkie]

If they don't accept it your next port of call is Transport Focus.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

So if the train arrived at its final stop 27 minutes late all you have to do is sit there for 5 minutes and then claim that you were 32 minutes late. :roll:

Is anyone actually suggesting that?!

 

[Camden]

So you basically want to bend the rules so you can make a claim!

I think by most reasonable peoples standards, a train passenger's journey cannot be said to have come to an end until the train is at the their station, at a platform with the doors open so they can actually get off.

So if the train arrived at its final stop 27 minutes late all you have to do is sit there for 5 minutes and then claim that you were 32 minutes late. :roll:

So if the train "arrived" at its final stop 27 minutes late, all it would have to do is sit still on the approach to the platform for another 10 hours and none of the passengers on board would be entitled to a bean, with it being claimed the train was "on time within 30 minutes"?

See how that works?

 

[najaB]

I think by most reasonable peoples standards, a train passenger's journey cannot be said to have come to an end until the train is at the their station, at a platform with the doors open so they can actually get off.

I believe that is the standard that the TOCs operate by and it is a reasonable one. 445Driver was responding to the suggestion that it's the time you step onto the platform that should count.

 

[talldave]

I use the time the doors open. I recently saw someone using their phone to take a video as we got off at Waterloo East, pointing the camera at the platform clock. The doors opened 30m 07s late, I submitted a claim that was paid ok (without video evidence! ).

 

[crehld]

So if the train arrived at its final stop 27 minutes late all you have to do is sit there for 5 minutes and then claim that you were 32 minutes late. :roll:

What a ridiculous statement. This has not been suggested by anyone ... unless you're advocating it?

Is anyone actually suggesting that?!

Of course they're not!

I think by most reasonable peoples standards, a train passenger's journey cannot be said to have come to an end until the train is at the their station, at a platform with the doors open so they can actually get off.

Indeed.

I use the time the doors open. I recently saw someone using their phone to take a video as we got off at Waterloo East, pointing the camera at the platform clock. The doors opened 30m 07s late, I submitted a claim that was paid ok (without video evidence! ).

I also use the time the doors open, making a note of the time on the platform clocks. Don't see the need for video evidence as my word and the train companies' own records should be (and indeed always is) good enough.

 

[455driver]

What a ridiculous statement. This has not been suggested by anyone ... unless you're advocating it?



Of course they're not!

See post #8
It's only a short step from quickly getting off the train to sitting on it for a few minutes so you can make a claim, especially with some of the ridiculous suggestions put forward on this forum.

 

[DaleCooper]

See post #8
It's only a short step from quickly getting off the train to sitting on it for a few minutes so you can make a claim, especially with some of the ridiculous suggestions put forward on this forum.

You have misinterpreted the content of post #8 (below), why not admit it and save yourself further embarrassment?

I think if you got off the train at 30 minutes or over that is adequate for delay repay

 

[crehld]

See post #8
It's only a short step from quickly getting off the train to sitting on it for a few minutes so you can make a claim, especially with some of the ridiculous suggestions put forward on this forum.

Thanks for clarifying. Although I think you've found something in post #8 which isn't actually there!! Not everyone is out to defraud the system you know.

 

[455driver]

Thanks for clarifying. Although I think you've found something in post #8 which isn't actually there!! Not everyone is out to defraud the system you know.

Oh there seem to be plenty on here trying to claim when they shouldn't be able to, I am not saying everyone is but there are quite a few!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

You have misinterpreted the content of post #8 (below), why not admit it and save yourself further embarrassment?

I don't think I have, by what Is written in post 8 the actual arrival time of the train appears to be irrelevant and the only thing that matters is the time you step off the train onto the platform!