Declassified first class and staff use.

[J663738]

I was on a GWR class 166 train yesterday and sat in the comfy seats in what would have been the old first section. I got funny looks from the about 6 GWR staff for daring to enter 'their' private staff room. I have noticed this on TfW as well, the Standard Plus area where it's mainly used by staff, as TfW have "forgotten" to remove the signage, so most passengers are not sure it's now open to all.
Anyway, on my journey yesterday, the GWR staff loudly slagged everyone from passengers they had helped, to dogs that should not be allowed on trains, then to GWR management and rosters and how incompetent everything is. It doesn't give a great experience to fare paying passengers on a GWR train hearing how badly run the GWR is, even if it's true!

I know BA have strict rules for staff travelling free, not to openly engage in company talk and basically sit in business/first or where ever and basically blend in.

 

[185]

I know BA have strict rules for staff travelling free, not to openly engage in company talk and basically sit in business/first or where ever and basically blend in.

The UK railway isn't BA. Besides, more likely to get a complimentary coffee and vastly superior service on the railway than the glorified easyJet with a flag. Someone else's conversation, none of my business.

 

[DelW]

I was on a GWR class 166 train yesterday and sat in the comfy seats in what would have been the old first section. I got funny looks from the about 6 GWR staff for daring to enter 'their' private staff room. I have noticed this on TfW as well, the Standard Plus area where it's mainly used by staff, as TfW have "forgotten" to remove the signage, so most passengers are not sure it's now open to all.
Anyway, on my journey yesterday, the GWR staff loudly slagged everyone from passengers they had helped, to dogs that should not be allowed on trains, then to GWR management and rosters and how incompetent everything is. It doesn't give a great experience to fare paying passengers on a GWR train hearing how badly run the GWR is, even if it's true!

I haven't encountered that on TfW, though I always sit in there if it's available. I think an increasing number of passengers are aware that anyone can sit in SP with a standard ticket.

I agree though that conversations such as you heard should be kept for messrooms or other non-public locations. I was often critical of my (non-railway) employer, but was always careful of who might be listening. You might have been a member of management travelling incognito!

 

[TheManBehind]

I was on a GWR class 166 train yesterday and sat in the comfy seats in what would have been the old first section. I got funny looks from the about 6 GWR staff for daring to enter 'their' private staff room. I have noticed this on TfW as well, the Standard Plus area where it's mainly used by staff, as TfW have "forgotten" to remove the signage, so most passengers are not sure it's now open to all.
Anyway, on my journey yesterday, the GWR staff loudly slagged everyone from passengers they had helped, to dogs that should not be allowed on trains, then to GWR management and rosters and how incompetent everything is. It doesn't give a great experience to fare paying passengers on a GWR train hearing how badly run the GWR is, even if it's true!

I know BA have strict rules for staff travelling free, not to openly engage in company talk and basically sit in business/first or where ever and basically blend in.

Thus has it always been unfortunately. Some people will never understand the principle of biting the hand that feeds you.

 

[jon0844]

In any job these days, always say and do things you can defend if someone has been filming or recording you.

 

[styles]

In any job these days, always say and do things you can defend if someone has been filming or recording you.

Not even restricted to jobs, but everyday life.

This is a lot of recording and record keeping these days.

 

[ValleyLines142]

This was quite common during the pandemic. The entire 16 seats would be 'closed off' for staff who required social distancing, even though in reality there would never be that many staff passing on one train!

As a GWR colleague myself, I agree with @DelW, you have to be so careful as a lot of GWR senior management travel incognito and even tuck their lanyards/ID passes/badges under their coats! Not that I have anything to rant about, but I regularly tell my lot to be careful just incase.

 

[tram21]

And mystery shopping takes place at great lengths on the UK Rail network, and that wouldn't look good in a mystery shopper report!

 

[Fokx]

This was quite common during the pandemic. The entire 16 seats would be 'closed off' for staff who required social distancing, even though in reality there would never be that many staff passing on one train!

Because staff travelling pass would also have to socially distance from one another at a distance of 2 meters. In reality that would mean that around 3 or 4 seats could actually be utilised.

We had the same scenario at my TOC which was a first group company at the time.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Sep 2025 ==

And mystery shopping takes place at great lengths on the UK Rail network, and that wouldn't look good in a mystery shopper report!

Mystery shopping doesn't usually assess rail staff that aren't working the services though.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Sep 2025 ==

I was on a GWR class 166 train yesterday and sat in the comfy seats in what would have been the old first section. I got funny looks from the about 6 GWR staff for daring to enter 'their' private staff room. I have noticed this on TfW as well, the Standard Plus area where it's mainly used by staff, as TfW have "forgotten" to remove the signage, so most passengers are not sure it's now open to all.
Anyway, on my journey yesterday, the GWR staff loudly slagged everyone from passengers they had helped, to dogs that should not be allowed on trains, then to GWR management and rosters and how incompetent everything is. It doesn't give a great experience to fare paying passengers on a GWR train hearing how badly run the GWR is, even if it's true!

I know BA have strict rules for staff travelling free, not to openly engage in company talk and basically sit in business/first or where ever and basically blend in.

Whilst not appropriate in a customer facing environment, I can understand a small element of ranting about the annoying aspects of a job (we've all done it at some point). Where as you might have a bit of a rant about the stresses and gripes of a job with a colleague in a break room, rail staff won't see their close colleagues for weeks and months due to the shifts so unwisely do get a little carried away with the conversation, not wise but we're all human, and again not appropriate.

BA is nothing like the railway and their employee satisfaction is rock bottom (not that the individuals in your post seem happy) and the company is a shadow of it's former self which can even be seen on elements of the customer service experience. I believe they've recently made decisions to prevent staff from carrying coffee cups from retail outlets whilst in uniform and aren't allowed to consume food whilst walking. It's the expectations of Qatar and Emirates without the job satisfaction, treatment or salary.

I'd also disagree with you about Standard Plus on TfW as have other posters. I can't say I've mainly seen staff in that area.

 

[tram21]

Mystery shopping doesn't usually assess rail staff that aren't working the services though.

I don't know- if I was onboard with the sole purpose to assess the service, if I experienced that I'd definitely be putting it on an assessment form.

 

[styles]

Have a rant about your employer or industry by all means, but do it discretely. It's not even specific to the railway to be honest.

 

[Ellwill]

Agree with previous commenters re; slagging off your employer publicly. I couldn't imagine giving passengers dirty looks for the heinous crime of using the train however, that's just incredibly poor conduct in my opinion.

 

[bramling]

I was on a GWR class 166 train yesterday and sat in the comfy seats in what would have been the old first section. I got funny looks from the about 6 GWR staff for daring to enter 'their' private staff room. I have noticed this on TfW as well, the Standard Plus area where it's mainly used by staff, as TfW have "forgotten" to remove the signage, so most passengers are not sure it's now open to all.
Anyway, on my journey yesterday, the GWR staff loudly slagged everyone from passengers they had helped, to dogs that should not be allowed on trains, then to GWR management and rosters and how incompetent everything is. It doesn't give a great experience to fare paying passengers on a GWR train hearing how badly run the GWR is, even if it's true!

I know BA have strict rules for staff travelling free, not to openly engage in company talk and basically sit in business/first or where ever and basically blend in.

It happens on GTR a lot as well, and frankly it’s a right pain in the arse.

Wouldn’t go down well if it got filmed and posted on social media. It’s one thing to have opinions on how the company is run, but doing it whilst in uniform and on duty in a public space is not the time and place to broadcast those opinions.

I once actually filmed a GTR member of staff playing music out loud on GN, which needless to say he got shirty about. I reminded him in no uncertain terms who pays his wages and how his employer might view him breaching byelaws in that way, and he slunk off.

 

[transportphoto]

I reminded him in no uncertain terms who pays his wages and how his employer might view him breaching byelaws in that way, and he slunk off.

Are you implying here that you pay his wages, and therefore have decision making ability over him?

I’ve politely asked a member of staff if they’ve got some headphones before whilst they were watching some video shorts online during some downtime - there’s no need to start videoing people.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Are you implying here that you pay his wages, and therefore have decision making ability over him?

I’ve politely asked a member of staff if they’ve got some headphones before whilst they were watching some video shorts online during some downtime - there’s no need to start videoing people.

I think it is perfectly acceptable to record evidence of a member of staff, and who they are, flagrantly breaching a Railway Byelaw, in order to send that evidence to their employer.

Staff should know that under no circumstances is it acceptable to breach Railway Byelaws while in uniform, and that if they are seen to do so that the matter is likely to be reported and result in disciplinary action.

I've seen it too, and it really makes me very angry, far more so than if it's some thoughtless little chav.

 

[transportphoto]

Staff should know that under no circumstances is it acceptable to breach Railway Byelaws while in uniform, and that if they are seen to do so that the matter is likely to be reported and result in disciplinary action.

Perhaps I’ve a different outlook on life; a polite conversation with someone can nip a problem in the bud without the need to escalate to threatening people with their jobs.

 

[bramling]

Are you implying here that you pay his wages, and therefore have decision making ability over him?

I’ve politely asked a member of staff if they’ve got some headphones before whilst they were watching some video shorts online during some downtime - there’s no need to start videoing people.

Staff absolutely should behave themselves when travelling in uniform, no exceptions. Shouldn't need to be told, and frankly first thing in the morning of all times should know better. It happens a lot on GTR, and my patience is very thin for it.

One thing watching a video and accidentally letting the volume creep up a bit (though still unacceptable), but playing music out loud is just plain rude and arrogant, and IMO deserves no niceties.

 

[styles]

Perhaps I’ve a different outlook on life; a polite conversation with someone can nip a problem in the bud without the need to escalate to threatening people with their jobs.

Quite.

Telling people 'who pays their wages' is totally unnecessary and incredibly patronising. Also factually incorrect a lot of the time.

 

[Deepgreen]

Are you implying here that you pay his wages, and therefore have decision making ability over him?

I’ve politely asked a member of staff if they’ve got some headphones before whilst they were watching some video shorts online during some downtime - there’s no need to start videoing people.

This sort of behaviour needs to be called out and that includes gathering evidence. I would have no hesitation in telling staff to behave (and have done on my line where uniformed staff were transgressing), and would record where necessary. There is a pervasive attitude these days that "I'll do as I like, and you can't do anything about it" which is bad enough among passengers, but in staff it is appalling. The trend to play media out loud is a major topic these days, and I am totally intolerant of it.

 

[transportphoto]

Staff absolutely should behave themselves when travelling in uniform, no exceptions. Shouldn't need to be told, and frankly first thing in the morning of all times should know better. It happens a lot on GTR, and my patience is very thin for it.

I can’t disagree with you; it’s an irritant. We disagree on the approach to dealing with the situation but I don’t think we will be able to agree here.

Your implied point that you pay their wages is wholly incorrect. I’ll duck out of the thread there though as I can see this quickly spiralling.

 

[bramling]

Quite.

Telling people 'who pays their wages' is totally unnecessary and incredibly patronising. Also factually incorrect a lot of the time.

I completely agree it's incredibly patronising, which was exactly the intention. Play music out loud on a train when in uniform, and expect to be treated like an imbecile.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Sep 2025 ==

I can’t disagree with you; it’s an irritant. We disagree on the approach to dealing with the situation but I don’t think we will be able to agree here.

Your implied point that you pay their wages is wholly incorrect. I’ll duck out of the thread there though as I can see this quickly spiralling.

For clarity, I never said "I pay your wages". He was, however, reminded that the public does, which they do in the form of taxation and fares.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Perhaps I’ve a different outlook on life; a polite conversation with someone can nip a problem in the bud without the need to escalate to threatening people with their jobs.

There are certain acts that are so obviously wrong (and those doing them should know they are wrong) that niceties can be quite validly bypassed.

A uniformed member of staff wilfully committing a breach of the Railway Bylaws while on duty is one of those acts. What other parts of the Rulebook might they be wilfully disregarding too? Ones that perhaps impact my safety rather than simply my enjoyment of the day?

 

[godfreycomplex]

Perhaps I’ve a different outlook on life; a polite conversation with someone can nip a problem in the bud without the need to escalate to threatening people with their jobs.

Absolutely the correct attitude

Your implied point that you pay their wages is wholly incorrect. I’ll duck out of the thread there though as I can see this quickly spiralling.

Yep…

 

[Fokx]

There are certain acts that are so obviously wrong (and those doing them should know they are wrong) that niceties can be quite validly bypassed.

A uniformed member of staff wilfully committing a breach of the Railway Bylaws while on duty is one of those acts. What other parts of the Rulebook might they be wilfully disregarding too? Ones that perhaps impact my safety rather than simply my enjoyment of the day?

Railway bylaws are not part of the Railway rulebook.

Please do not try to imply that someone playing something aloud on their phone is somehow likely to be endangering the safety of them self, yourself and the Railway.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Please do not try to imply that someone playing something aloud on their phone is somehow likely to be endangering the safety of them self, yourself and the Railway.

I'm not implying it, quite the opposite, I'm explicitly stating it. If you consider it OK to break one of your employer's rules, one that is considered serious important to be stated in law, which other ones might you also be willing to break?

Someone who has such wilful disregard for the rules and policies of the railway as well as the comfort of the customers thereon (whether the Byelaws or the Rulebook) while in uniform is not, in my view, to be trusted in that role. It is unacceptable conduct and quite right and proper to report it in my view, and I would hope it would be taken seriously given that it is breaking the law and interfering with the comfort of those on the railway as well as bringing it into disrepute.

 

[styles]

I'm not implying it, quite the opposite, I'm explicitly stating it. If you consider it OK to break one of your employer's rules, one that is considered serious important to be stated in law, which other ones might you also be willing to break?

Someone who has such wilful disregard for the rules and policies of the railway as well as the comfort of the customers thereon (whether the Byelaws or the Rulebook) while in uniform is not, in my view, to be trusted in that role. It is unacceptable conduct and quite right and proper to report it in my view, and I would hope it would be taken seriously given that it is breaking the law and interfering with the comfort of those on the railway as well as bringing it into disrepute.

I think that's a stretch honestly.

Breaking one rule which is aimed at passenger comfort is not the same as a significant safety breach.

It's more akin to a receptionist taking a personal phone call - a polite word or even a formal complaint, sure, but there's no need to patronise people with phrases like, remember who pays your wages.

 

[bramling]

I'm not implying it, quite the opposite, I'm explicitly stating it. If you consider it OK to break one of your employer's rules, one that is considered serious important to be stated in law, which other ones might you also be willing to break?

Someone who has such wilful disregard for the rules and policies of the railway as well as the comfort of the customers thereon (whether the Byelaws or the Rulebook) while in uniform is not, in my view, to be trusted in that role. It is unacceptable conduct and quite right and proper to report it in my view, and I would hope it would be taken seriously given that it is breaking the law and interfering with the comfort of those on the railway as well as bringing it into disrepute.

I agree with the above. It’s so utterly arrogant to walk into a virtually empty train first thing in the morning, sit near someone else, in full uniform, and then start playing music out loud. Behaving in that way, as far as I am concerned, forfeits any right to be treated with respect.

 

[Krokodil]

I couldn't imagine giving passengers dirty looks for the heinous crime of using the train however, that's just incredibly poor conduct in my opinion.

Assuming that it even happens. The OP doesn‘t know the intent behind someone else's facial expression, if indeed it wasn't just the nature of their resting face.

This bit sounds like the people who go into a pub in Wales and complains that "everyone stopped speaking English and switched to Welsh when we walked in".

 

[LCC106]

As a driver I’ll openly admit I have very little knowledge of railway byelaws. I wouldn’t like to be called out by a complete stranger complaining to my employer. Instead I agree with the sensible approach to talk to the person directly and ask them to quieten down, use earphones, outline the error of their ways etc.

 

[styles]

As a driver I’ll openly admit I have very little knowledge of railway byelaws. I wouldn’t like to be called out by a complete stranger complaining to my employer. Instead I agree with the sensible approach to talk to the person directly and ask them to quieten down, use earphones, outline the error of their ways etc.

The bylaw regarding playing music/sound to the annoyance of any person is so rarely enforced (I have never heard of it before enforced, but I'm sure it's happened at some point) it may as well not exist. The bylaw actually creates an offence of singing if even one person is annoyed by it. Using it as a means to threaten somebody with their job is pretty wild imo when a simple request to turn it down would do in the first instance.