Daily station parking charge

[talldave]

I wanted to drop my other half's car at the station today so it's there for when she gets back from a trip, so was looking at the charges yesterday. There are TfL signs up about a new provider taking over, but it's still "£4 daily" although the payment machine is no longer in use so it's a RingGo job.

What's interesting is that RingGo's "day" runs to 4.30am. So if you arrive just after midnight and pay the "daily" charge - you get 4 hours of parking and 20 hours of opportunity for a "Parking Charge Notice".

This seems misleading and wrong but is it just a RingGo thing or was it always that way with the local machine? The 4.30am cut-off feels very "rail" specific, but wouldn't one expect a 28 hour window aligned with ticketing validity?

 

[jon81uk]

TfL day runs to 04.30 too, so day tickets and caps run through to then.
I assume the parking time was chosen by TfL to match the ticketing one.

 

[ess]

Very annoying for anyone working night shifts

 

[Bletchleyite]

I don't think RingGo can cope with a 28.5 hour day (edit: it can now but I'm fairly sure it couldn't originally). Chiltern used to have it set midnight to midnight, with an informal statement of "we won't ticket you in the middle of the night because we won't be out checking then" if you ever queried it. It probably makes more sense, rather than using 0430 as a blanket thing, to set the boundary between days somewhere between the end and start of service, as only a very few stations have a full 24 hour service.

Someone wanting to drop off a car in the middle of the night at a time when there's no service is just falling into an unintentional niche, I guess, sadly. A shift worker is probably better with a parking season ticket.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Apr 2023 ==

Very annoying for anyone working night shifts

Daily parking tickets are a very expensive way to do it if you travel daily. You want a parking season ticket for that.

 

[swt_passenger]

I don't think RingGo can cope with a 28.5 hour day. Chiltern used to have it set midnight to midnight, with an informal statement of "we won't ticket you in the middle of the night because we won't be out checking then" if you ever queried it. It probably makes more sense, rather than using 0430 as a blanket thing, to set the boundary between days somewhere between the end and start of service, as only a very few stations have a full 24 hour service.

Yes, I remember having the same conversation with SWT - their RINGO payments also ended at midnight, before the last service got back, they said that would be OK because they wouldn’t be checking tickets at that time of night.

Edit to add:

I just made a dummy purchase at Swanwick and it allowed for a “day” starting at 0001 this morning, and finishing at 0400 tomorrow morning.

So what they’ll accept must vary by site…

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes, I remember having the same conversation with SWT - their RINGO payments also ended at midnight, before the last service got back, they said that would be OK because they wouldn’t be checking tickets at that time of night.

Edit to add:

I just made a dummy purchase at Swanwick and it allowed for a “day” starting at 0001 this morning, and finishing at 0400 tomorrow morning.

So what they’ll accept must vary by site…

RingGo has had a lot of development on it over the past few years so it is possible it does now support "odd days" like those but not all of the TOCs have updated all car parks to take advantage of it.

Chiltern now appear (I just tried it) to allow 0000-0230 the day after as one day (they use 0230 as the breakpoint for some reason). More important to get it right when it's ANPR as "we aren't checking at 4am, don't worry" doesn't work in that context.

 

[isaashthomas]

I wanted to drop my other half's car at the station today so it's there for when she gets back from a trip, so was looking at the charges yesterday. There are TfL signs up about a new provider taking over, but it's still "£4 daily" although the payment machine is no longer in use so it's a RingGo job.

What's interesting is that RingGo's "day" runs to 4.30am. So if you arrive just after midnight and pay the "daily" charge - you get 4 hours of parking and 20 hours of opportunity for a "Parking Charge Notice".

This seems misleading and wrong but is it just a RingGo thing or was it always that way with the local machine? The 4.30am cut-off feels very "rail" specific, but wouldn't one expect a 28 hour window aligned with ticketing validity?

It's possible that the 4:30 am cut-off time for RingGo's "day" is specific to this particular parking lot and may not be aligned with the validity of tickets or other parking lots. It's always best to double-check the rules and regulations for the specific parking lot you plan to use.

 

[jon81uk]

It's possible that the 4:30 am cut-off time for RingGo's "day" is specific to this particular parking lot and may not be aligned with the validity of tickets or other parking lots. It's always best to double-check the rules and regulations for the specific parking lot you plan to use.

All the parking at TfL stations I’ve used runs through to 04.30

 

[talldave]

It's possible that the 4:30 am cut-off time for RingGo's "day" is specific to this particular parking lot and may not be aligned with the validity of tickets or other parking lots. It's always best to double-check the rules and regulations for the specific parking lot you plan to use.

The signs clearly say £4 daily, so anyone parking at 1am or 2am could reasonably expect to be covered for the whole day until midnight. This is at Norwood Junction. It's great value bearing in mind that 2 hours in nearby streets set you back £4!

In view of the comments about RingGo, I'll contact them to see what they say.

 

[jon81uk]

The signs clearly say £4 daily, so anyone parking at 1am or 2am could reasonably expect to be covered for the whole day until midnight. This is at Norwood Junction. It's great value bearing in mind that 2 hours in nearby streets set you back £4!

In view of the comments about RingGo, I'll contact them to see what they say.

I’ve not used RingGo, we use PayByPhone when we park at Epping, Debden or Loughton stations but the PayByPhone app makes it clear it is until 04.30.

 

[talldave]

I’ve not used RingGo, we use PayByPhone when we park at Epping, Debden or Loughton stations but the PayByPhone app makes it clear it is until 04.30.

The following day if you're parking at 00:10? Ie a 28hr day?

 

[jon81uk]

The following day if you're parking at 00:10? Ie a 28hr day?

I’ve never parked that late so don’t know. But when parking at 5pm it clearly said to 04.30 when selecting one day of parking.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The following day if you're parking at 00:10? Ie a 28hr day?

Chiltern's lets you do that (up to 0230 on day two). It offers you a cheaper rate for parking between 0001 and 0230 only (the evening rate).

 

[CyrusWuff]

Chiltern now appear (I just tried it) to allow 0000-0230 the day after as one day (they use 0230 as the breakpoint for some reason).

Most likely because all the regular services should have arrived at their destination by 0230.

No use if they're running additional trains early on New Year's Day though, as the last one tends to leave Marylebone at 0300.

 

[talldave]

I’ve not used RingGo, we use PayByPhone when we park at Epping, Debden or Loughton stations but the PayByPhone app makes it clear it is until 04.30.

I've just realised it's PayByPhone I was experimenting with. That doesn't fill me with confidence as their support is hopeless (took them almost 2 years to add one of their car parks to their map).

 

[talldave]

Well my concern about the hopelessness of PayByPhone was valid as I got a reply to my query today, 7 weeks later!

They say they mimic the pay machines - which are no longer in use! And that TfL are aware that their day ends at 04:30. They don’t seem to get the point that a daily charge of £4 paid shortly after midnight should buy you more than 4 hours.

I know this is a trivial corner case, but it's wrong. Any suggestions for a contact in TfL who could clarify the intended charging structure? Or do I go straight to Trading Standards?

 

[telstarbox]

I don't think RingGo can cope with a 28.5 hour day (edit: it can now but I'm fairly sure it couldn't originally). Chiltern used to have it set midnight to midnight, with an informal statement of "we won't ticket you in the middle of the night because we won't be out checking then" if you ever queried it. It probably makes more sense, rather than using 0430 as a blanket thing, to set the boundary between days somewhere between the end and start of service, as only a very few stations have a full 24 hour service.

Someone wanting to drop off a car in the middle of the night at a time when there's no service is just falling into an unintentional niche, I guess, sadly. A shift worker is probably better with a parking season ticket.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Apr 2023 ==



Daily parking tickets are a very expensive way to do it if you travel daily. You want a parking season ticket for that.

As a side point, do RingGo etc send data through to enforcement officers on the ground so they can find vehicles which have overstayed?

 

[Bletchleyite]

As a side point, do RingGo etc send data through to enforcement officers on the ground so they can find vehicles which have overstayed?

Yes, or the ANPR system if it's that.

 

[telstarbox]

Makes sense. I definitely didn't do this in a seaside town the other week (topped up when I remembered!)

 

[talldave]

I've contacted Saba UK who manage TfL car parks (not entirely sure what that entails). If they understand the 04:29 problem, hopefully I can get them and PaybyPhone talking!!

 

[jon81uk]

I've contacted Saba UK who manage TfL car parks (not entirely sure what that entails). If they understand the 04:29 problem, hopefully I can get them and PaybyPhone talking!!

Its not really a Paybyphone issue though, the information in the app is the same (or better) than on signage on the TfL car parks which are put up by NCP/Saba.
the signage states "daily charge" and so does the app.

 

[talldave]

Its not really a Paybyphone issue though, the information in the app is the same (or better) than on signage on the TfL car parks which are put up by NCP/Saba.
the signage states "daily charge" and so does the app.

I agree, PaybyPhone are only doing what they've been told by Saba.

Saba have confirmed they have a simple 04:30 - 04:30 day. My gripe is clearly with them that no sane person would interpret the meaning of "daily rate" as being based on an 04:30 day. I will attempt to persuade Saba that the rail industry works on the basis of "until 04:29 on the day after validity ends" and that that is perhaps the model they should follow.

In the good old days when you paid for parking at the ticket office, did it follow the "04:29 tomorrow" expiry approach?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

In the good old days when you paid for parking at the ticket office, did it follow the "04:29 tomorrow" expiry approach?

At Chorley, such tickets tend only to be valid until 23:59 on the day of issue. (Which seems to be a tad unfair, as Chorley has trains calling at 00:03, 00:09 and 00:39).