Current second hand car prices

[GS250]

Is there any sign of 3-5 year old car prices dropping? Looking to change my otherwise lovely Lexus GS to something more suited to the rugged surfaces of Skye as going to be spending more time there.

 

[JohnMcL7]

I've seen differing opinions on this and some are saying they're seeing prices coming down with new car supplies improving although I've been closely following a few cars and they're still a high price. I'm looking at a similar range of vehicles and seeing a drop in the number of second hand vehicles around the three year old mark due to the drop in production in 2020.

 

[GS250]

Yes, the 2019-2021 models seem to be offering the least value for money. Naturally this has cascaded somewhat to older models too.

Probably worth holding on until next winter really.

 

[HOOVER29]

Been to our local garage this afternoon.
Usual humdrum of metal ie people carriers big cars etc etc are all being replaced by small efficient cars.

Also they did have one small automatic car on the forecourt & that sold within an hour of being marked up.
They can’t get small automatic cars at all, like hens teeth.

 

[Sm5]

New car prices seem to have jumped, and offer less features.

ive decided to keep my old car, as at 2017 it still offers much more than a 2023 one and its a whole different world better than a 2020/21 car… I was seeing cars with manual windows and empty void panels where screens should be, when new then !

I did look at upgrading to the newer car of the same spec as mine, and found the price was 50% higher, so ho hum to that.

i suspect the industry is in limbo, until new electric models emerge later in the decade, at a price point that can be supported for the majority, and so limps along with older ranges, sold at higher prices in smaller volumes.

Thats going to strangle the s/h market with people like me, who decide to stick with what they have already instead of upgrading.

Electric cars still involve too much sacrifice, and needing compromises… i am also seeing more dead batteries, decapitating drivers enroute, resulting in cars stranded in awkward places at junctions, traffic lights etc that the owners seem unable to move, and causing chaos. Its only going to get worse.

Whats needed is a family car capable of 500 motorway miles in winter at 3 years old, and charges in an hour, costing around the average annual salary, not requiring its own mortgage to charge it.

 

[RailWonderer]

The UK is obsessed with having the newest car. In Europe, especially Eastern Europe they drive 15-20 year old cars for hundreds of thousands of miles and when maintained properly run like a dream. This mentality of complaining about high used car prices is because of this obsession for new, new, new. You can find brilliant value 2008-2012 era vehicles. I'm not calling you a complainer but if you broaden your search you'd be amazed what's on the market.

 

[Snow1964]

The market is very split.

diesel has fallen out of favour (as we are having to import from elsewhere instead of Russia, so now relatively expensive). If it is older than 7 years then likely to have low emission zone restrictions.

Definite move to smaller petrols, which can be cheaper to run than the big diesels.

One other oddity, look down any secondhand car lot of 1-3 year old cars, and the unsold ones will be monochrome colours (black, grey, white). So don't let a salesman tell you they are popular colours. The reality is people have had 3 drab years, want something bright and chearful.

A quick warning, Cars built within last 2 years often have odd specs, due to semiconductor shortages, many were built with less gadgets. But are sometimes advertised as to current spec with a small print disclaimer at end of advert.

I personally think that unless there is a good reason to change your car now, would be better waiting until 2024 when new cars sales volume should be higher, and thus trade in volumes higher. It might cost you £1-2k overhaul/repairs to keep it running another 12-18 months, but hopefully prices will ease more than that.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think the ULEZ will be pushing up the value of used diesels under 5 years old from people who prefer a diesel, particularly vans which rarely have petrol versions.

 

[JohnMcL7]

One other oddity, look down any secondhand car lot of 1-3 year old cars, and the unsold ones will be monochrome colours (black, grey, white). So don't let a salesman tell you they are popular colours. The reality is people have had 3 drab years, want something bright and chearful.

No it's not the reality, the salesmen is correct black, white and grey are popular colours and people are not changing cars to get something bright and cheerful, they're continuing to buy grey, black and white cars which have been the top three colours for the last 12 years:

Car colours: grey is UK’s favourite shade for new cars again in 2022 | Auto Express

The most popular car colours were overwhelmingly monotone again in 2022 but some brighter shades have shown growth.

www.autoexpress.co.uk

 

[GS250]

The UK is obsessed with having the newest car. In Europe, especially Eastern Europe they drive 15-20 year old cars for hundreds of thousands of miles and when maintained properly run like a dream. This mentality of complaining about high used car prices is because of this obsession for new, new, new. You can find brilliant value 2008-2012 era vehicles. I'm not calling you a complainer but if you broaden your search you'd be amazed what's on the market.

Agree with this to a point. Mine is a 2012 that's basically just worn in at 62k and has a full dealer history. Reliability wise it will blow virtually anything else away that's been built in the last 5 years.

However my desire to renew is more based on fitness for purpose as opposed to vanity.

Lexus NX or top of the range Honda CRV is tempting.

 

[notverydeep]

I managed to sell an elderly relatives 2010 Toyota Auris Petrol - 75K miles for £3250 to Carwow, which I thought was a pretty strong price for a non part exchange sale to a dealer for a 12.5 year old car! ULEZ compliance is presumably pushing up 2006 to 2015 petrol cars, where there diesel counterparts are out of favour. That said, even these have risen from the kind of prices early in the pandemic, so my own 14 year old 151K diesel will have to carry on for the moment, though I could do with a bit more space for the children and the tent...

 

[HOOVER29]

My sister is looking to part ex her vintage vw polo.
Had it 19 yrs with mileage now on 96k.

Great little car.

Wants a small vw like a polo or Up to replace it.

Been told by the garage mechanic to hang fire if she defo wants a vw as the current selection are badly built & reliability is a tad iffy.

Was told the Ford Fiesta is a better bet at the moment, a make/model she doesn’t want.

 

[greyman42]

There is a programme called Motor Pickers on Quest. A guy was looking at a top end Audi E-Tron GT that was 1 year old. The price for a new model was £88,000 but the price for this 1 year old model was £90,000!

 

[Sm5]

I’m sure varnished undercoat grey was most popular as it was the cheapest, or in some cases the only colour available.

Stats dont always reveal fashion, but may reflect what manufacturers have chosen to be fashion, often based on cost, revenue potential.

those espousing older cars, need to examine their wallets in London.. ULEZ isnt your friend, no matter how good you think the car is.

 

[43066]

The UK is obsessed with having the newest car. In Europe, especially Eastern Europe they drive 15-20 year old cars for hundreds of thousands of miles and when maintained properly run like a dream. This mentality of complaining about high used car prices is because of this obsession for new, new, new. You can find brilliant value 2008-2012 era vehicles. I'm not calling you a complainer but if you broaden your search you'd be amazed what's on the market.

My understanding was that the obsession with getting a new car every three years (usually on an expensive PCP scheme) is actually what has kept UK used prices low compared to elsewhere.

The recent hike in used car prices has been caused by a reduction in supply of older cars, as people hang onto their cars longer; partly because of the component-led shortage of new cars, partly due to economic uncertainty.

The hikes in interest rates will also have affected the PCP and personal loan side of things, as money has been ridiculously cheap for years.

 

[GS250]

My understanding was that the obsession with getting a new car every three years (usually on an expensive PCP scheme) is actually what has kept UK used prices low compared to elsewhere.

The recent hike in used car prices has been caused by a reduction in supply of older cars, as people hang onto their cars longer; partly because of the component-led shortage of new cars, partly due to economic uncertainty.

The hikes in interest rates will also have affected the PCP and personal loan side of things, as money has been ridiculously cheap for years.

PCP is very attractive because you have generally been able to 'buy' a decent car for relatively low money. The problem is of course when the terms of lease run out and you either have to hand it back or officially purchase it. Garages will often be very harsh on what they consider 'wear' and you will most certainly pay for it.

I'd be interested to see what the market was like if PCP in particular was not a thing.

I've always saved up and bought with cash. Maximum fee paid was £14000 although that included a £4k trade in.

 

[HOOVER29]

PCP is very attractive because you have generally been able to 'buy' a decent car for relatively low money. The problem is of course when the terms of lease run out and you either have to hand it back or officially purchase it. Garages will often be very harsh on what they consider 'wear' and you will most certainly pay for it.

I'd be interested to see what the market was like if PCP in particular was not a thing.

I've always saved up and bought with cash. Maximum fee paid was £14000 although that included a £4k trade in.

I thought about pcp when I bought my golf sv 4 years ago.
Cost me £11,000.
Paid cash
PCP was attractive but as you said at the end of the lease period you either stump up & buy it & give it back.

I intend to keep the golf a fair while so stumping up that amount didn’t faze me

 

[43066]

PCP is very attractive because you have generally been able to 'buy' a decent car for relatively low money. The problem is of course when the terms of lease run out and you either have to hand it back or officially purchase it. Garages will often be very harsh on what they consider 'wear' and you will most certainly pay for it.

I suppose another way of putting it is that you’ve been able to buy a decent car for a relatively low monthly payment. People perceive they’re getting a bargain, but it’s actually an extremely expensive way of buying a car due to the high interest rates typically offered, and the fact interest accrues on the balloon payment throughout the agreement. But, as you said earlier, the snobbery of having a new reg plate drives it, as well as a lack of understanding about how the PCP product actually works.

I'd be interested to see what the market was like if PCP in particular was not a thing.

Agreed. I suspect the market would be as it was in the 90s (and remains in other parts of Europe). A few other suggestions:

The “premium” brands wouldn’t have moved into the mainstream in quite the way they did. Mondeo Man of the ‘90s is likely to be “BMW 5 series man” today.

We wouldn’t have had the new car price inflation we have seen, which has come about largely because virtually nobody pays the list price and just focus on the monthlies, which are made artificially low by PCP arrangements.

New car sales would have been a lot lower and consequently used cars would likely have remained more expensive rather than getting as cheap as they were just before the recent distortions of the market.

The challenge for the car industry is going to be coping with money being a lot more expensive going forward, in addition to the switch to electrification and various other challenges.

 

[Kite159]

The UK is obsessed with having the newest car

It doesn't help that the UK is one of the few countries which put age on the number plates. I suspect if the number plates didn't have the year on new cars wouldn't be so popular as you can't 'show' off to neighbours (and others) that you have a brand new car with a '23' plate.

PCP is a good way to trap people into getting a new car every 3-4 years to avoid the large payment at the end of the lease.

 

[route101]

It doesn't help that the UK is one of the few countries which put age on the number plates. I suspect if the number plates didn't have the year on new cars wouldn't be so popular as you can't 'show' off to neighbours (and others) that you have a brand new car with a '23' plate.

PCP is a good way to trap people into getting a new car every 3-4 years to avoid the large payment at the end of the lease.

What other countries put an age on cars? Ireland?

 

[Jamesrob637]

What other countries put an age on cars? Ireland?

Italy I believe.

 

[Snow1964]

I suppose another way of putting it is that you’ve been able to buy a decent car for a relatively low monthly payment. People perceive they’re getting a bargain, but it’s actually an extremely expensive way of buying a car due to the high interest rates typically offered

Firstly on PCP you don't buy until you pay balloon, you are simply renting.

I knew someone that whenever someone said they have a new car always gave the same answer, but mines paid for. Which used to shut up most people.

There are people who are financially stupid. I just looked up a car manufacturer website and did a 4 year finance example on cheapest car. Cash price £17,990. Total payable £21,258.41, clearly that is costing £3268.41 interest
But those two figures are not next to each other in the example, instead line 2 in bold says monthly payment £209.03. Clearly what they want people to focus on, they even have a manufacturer contribution. Great get £500 off to spend £3268 interest !

 

[pdq]

Firstly on PCP you don't buy until you pay balloon, you are simply renting.

That's not strictly true. On PCP, you are the registered owner of the car - i.e. the V5 is in your name. With a lease (PCH - personal contract hire) the car belongs to the leasing company and the lessee does not have direct access to the V5.
At the end of the 3 year (or whatever) period, with PCP you have the right to make the final payment - whether outright or via another finance product - and continue to own the car; you also have the right to hand it back in which case you cease to own it in the same way as selling any car to a trader. With leasing, there is no right to purchase the car: although it's sometimes an option, in which case you're purchasing from the leasing company or their agent - and you will be the 2nd owner on the V5 even though you've been the only driver.

 

[GS250]

Firstly on PCP you don't buy until you pay balloon, you are simply renting.

I knew someone that whenever someone said they have a new car always gave the same answer, but mines paid for. Which used to shut up most people.

There are people who are financially stupid. I just looked up a car manufacturer website and did a 4 year finance example on cheapest car. Cash price £17,990. Total payable £21,258.41, clearly that is costing £3268.41 interest
But those two figures are not next to each other in the example, instead line 2 in bold says monthly payment £209.03. Clearly what they want people to focus on, they even have a manufacturer contribution. Great get £500 off to spend £3268 interest !

As I said, my maximum spend on a car was £14000 for my current, actual spend from me 10k with the trade in. Interest paid zero. This for a 6 year old, very low mileage luxury car from a main dealer. I saved up for around 4 years to be able to pull this off. Return on investment has been fantastic. You could say by avoiding finance all my servicing costs have been covered over 4 years. I'm not bothered about 'age' of a vehicle which helps.

I'm not flush with cash, however I know others with less disposable income than me who are driving around in some quite fancy brand new vehicles. God knows what they are paying every month.

 

[RichJF]

If you're going down the monthly route, go for HP if you can still find it! Least that way the more the number of payments, the more % of the car you own. Or at least that's the agreement on my little Vauxhall!

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you're going down the monthly route, go for HP if you can still find it! Least that way the more the number of payments, the more % of the car you own. Or at least that's the agreement on my little Vauxhall!

Or take an unsecured personal loan. You can compare them using sites like MoneySavingExpert, and if you've got a good credit rating you will almost certainly beat any rate a dealer will offer, and if you prefer you can take one with no deposit at all because it isn't tied to the car's value. I have never found dealer HP to be better value (dealers have generally laughed and said they had no chance of matching it when I've told them the figure, it's a quick way to get them to shut up about finance! ); it only makes sense to go with the dealer finance if they are offering a very special deal e.g. 0%.

There's a reason dealers push their finance - they get a whacking commission for it - and YOU are paying that commission if you go through them.

 

[Snow1964]

There's a reason dealers push their finance - they get a whacking commission for it - and YOU are paying that commission if you go through them.

What is not openly advertised is you often take out a PCP, keep any incentive freebies (discount, manufacturer contribution, free fuel, servicing etc), and but pay it off during the cooling off period (days 1-13) with no interest and no early repayment fee. I know VW group finance does this, and few others.

Basically all your incentives are subsidised by those who can't afford to pay it off. Or who don't think to take the incentives then quickly switch to cheaper bank loan.

But I wouldn't tell the dealer if you are going to do this, however if they lose their commission it is not your problem.

 

[A0]

My sister is looking to part ex her vintage vw polo.
Had it 19 yrs with mileage now on 96k.

Great little car.

Wants a small vw like a polo or Up to replace it.

Been told by the garage mechanic to hang fire if she defo wants a vw as the current selection are badly built & reliability is a tad iffy.

Was told the Ford Fiesta is a better bet at the moment, a make/model she doesn’t want.

The motor trade gets a bad press - but it sounds like this garage is trying to do the right thing by your sister but she doesn't like the advice.

So her choices are:

1- Change her views on what car she does want.
2- Ignore the garage and run the risk with another VW. But she loses any right to complain if the garage are right and a new VW gives her problems.

 

[43066]

That's not strictly true. On PCP, you are the registered owner of the car - i.e. the V5 is in your name. With a lease (PCH - personal contract hire) the car belongs to the leasing company and the lessee does not have direct access to the V5.
At the end of the 3 year (or whatever) period, with PCP you have the right to make the final payment - whether outright or via another finance product - and continue to own the car; you also have the right to hand it back in which case you cease to own it in the same way as selling any car to a trader. With leasing, there is no right to purchase the car: although it's sometimes an option, in which case you're purchasing from the leasing company or their agent - and you will be the 2nd owner on the V5 even though you've been the only driver.

I think I’m right in saying that with HP/PCP agreements, although you will be the registered keeper on the V5, the finance agreement you sign will make it clear that you won’t actually legally own the car until you make the final payment.

This is to cover the finance company, both by preventing you passing legal title to the car if you sell it*, and enabling them to immediately repossess it if you fall behind on payments. Because they continue to own the car throughout the agreement, there’s no need for them to go to court, instruct bailiffs etc. they can simply remove the car from the roadside!

The advantage for you is that, because HP/PCP are consumer credit agreements, you can do what’s called a voluntary termination and simply hand back the car once you’ve paid back more than 50% of the contract value.

*this is why it’s so important to do an HPI check on a used vehicle before buying - if there’s any outstanding finance you will potentially lose the vehicle.

Or take an unsecured personal loan. You can compare them using sites like MoneySavingExpert, and if you've got a good credit rating you will almost certainly beat any rate a dealer will offer, and if you prefer you can take one with no deposit at all because it isn't tied to the car's value. I have never found dealer HP to be better value (dealers have generally laughed and said they had no chance of matching it when I've told them the figure, it's a quick way to get them to shut up about finance! ); it only makes sense to go with the dealer finance if they are offering a very special deal e.g. 0%.

Definitely the cheapest way of doing it (other than buying outright for cash), The only downside is the lack of the ability to voluntarily terminate; you’d need to sell the car and pay off the loan balance with the proceeds.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Mar 2023 ==

What is not openly advertised is you often take out a PCP, keep any incentive freebies (discount, manufacturer contribution, free fuel, servicing etc), and but pay it off during the cooling off period (days 1-13) with no interest and no early repayment fee. I know VW group finance does this, and few others.

Basically all your incentives are subsidised by those who can't afford to pay it off. Or who don't think to take the incentives then quickly switch to cheaper bank loan.

But I wouldn't tell the dealer if you are going to do this, however if they lose their commission it is not your problem.

True - so that’s potentially even cheaper than a “straight” cash purchase as you’ll benefit from the discounts that are meant to incentivise people to enter into finance.

There’s absolutely nothing the dealer can do about it because you have the legal right to cancel within the 14 days.

 

[DelW]

... it only makes sense to go with the dealer finance if they are offering a very special deal e.g. 0%.

There's a reason dealers push their finance - they get a whacking commission for it - and YOU are paying that commission if you go through them.

When I bought a new Focus in 2012, there was an additional £1000 discount (off around £20k cash price after other discounts) for taking Ford finance. The minimum requirement was to borrow 20% of the price, and I could (and did) pay it off after the first month, so the interest was negligible. The dealer suggested that route, so I suppose it achieved whatever their incentive scheme required.