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Cross county border bus pass validity question

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175mph

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I know the minimum validity of a concessionary fare bus pass is from 9 to 11 or something similar with some councils offering a 'discretionary element' where a concessionary fare bus pass is valid all day every day.

Which made me wonder:

Here in North Lincolnshire we've got the 'discretionary element' and I was told that even if you are outside North Lincolnshire, if you board a bus bound for a North Lincolnshire destination, you can use your bus pass as if in North Lincolnshire but on that service service only, any other service you'd have to wait until the valid hours.

For example, if you were in Hull and boarded the Humber Flyer or Humber Fastcat services before 9 oclock, because they are heading into North Lincolnshire your password would be accepted but not on any local Hull services before 9 oclock.

But last year when I was staying overnight in Grimsby, and got the 5 o'clock Humber Flyer service, the ticket machine lit up red on top when I try using my bus pass, obviously it had not accepted it.

Should it have accepted it even before 9 oclock considering the bus was heading into a 'discretionary element' area, or should it have accepted it only one crossing into the 'discretionary element' area?

On the back of the bus pass it states it's valid for journeys TO, FROM and WITHIN North Lincolnshire all day and every day.

The journeys to part seems to imply I should have been allowed to take that 5 o'clock in the morning Humber Flyer service as it was a journey TO North Lincolnshire.

Or was the ticket machine not accepting my pass at that time either a programming error, or intentional but the driver should have pressed the button to override the rejection at his discretion?

Any clarification on this matter appreciated.
 
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PeterC

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The pass is subject to the conditions set by the authority where the vehicle is boarded as they are the ones who pay the operator.

One county can make agreements with surrounding authorities or direct with operators for non standard acceptance but this is not automatic.
 

Statto

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I find the 11pm evening cut off for out of area ENCTS daft, as should be last service of the day, or until 4.30am on night services which allow out of area ENCTS.
 

PeterC

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I find the 11pm evening cut off for out of area ENCTS daft, as should be last service of the day, or until 4.30am on night services which allow out of area ENCTS.
I'd just like a bus to use mine on after 6pm
 

Olympian

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The pass is subject to the conditions set by the authority where the vehicle is boarded as they are the ones who pay the operator.
Boarding point authority pays operators during Core ENCTS times. Any enhancements outside those times are normally paid for by the card issuing authority, irrespective of boarding area.

In the OP's case it's a North Lincolnshire enhancement, paid for by them, however it sounds like the ticket machine hadn't been correctly configured for the enhancement.
 

Busaholic

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Let's get clear what the default position is on the English bus pass: it is 09.30 to 23.00 Mondays to Fridays, but all day Saturday and Sunday i.e. midnight Friday until midnight Sunday. So, if you had a 23.01 departure on a Friday you couldn't use it, but you could on a departure an hour later at 00.01! Mind you, I could imagine some drivers claiming that 00.01 departure is a Friday service, rather than a Saturday one, but that makes no difference to pass availability, in theory at least.
 

Deerfold

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Let's get clear what the default position is on the English bus pass: it is 09.30 to 23.00 Mondays to Fridays, but all day Saturday and Sunday i.e. midnight Friday until midnight Sunday. So, if you had a 23.01 departure on a Friday you couldn't use it, but you could on a departure an hour later at 00.01! Mind you, I could imagine some drivers claiming that 00.01 departure is a Friday service, rather than a Saturday one, but that makes no difference to pass availability, in theory at least.

True. In West Yorkshire 2300 to 0000 is added every day that doesn't already have it.
 

Harpers Tate

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I would imagine that, going back to the original point, the ticket machines (or their setup, at least) are not sophistcated enough to see any difference between passenger (a) boarding service (98) and passenger (b) boarding service (99), where both are before the nominal validity of the ENCTS pass. Therefore I suspect they very simply reject any pre-0925 (or so) swipe, and the expectation is that the driver will manually override where an exception is in place.
 

Statto

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True. In West Yorkshire 2300 to 0000 is added every day that doesn't already have it.

Is that only with West Yorkshire Metro issued passes, as that was already in the case before ENCTS came out, when WY Metro issued there own concessionary passes for the WY area, it's the same in the Merseyside area with Merseytravel issued ENCTS passes, which can be used until the last service of the day.

Does the 2300 Monday to Friday restriction still apply for out of area WY Metro issued passes in the WY Metro area, for example i have a Merseytravel issued ENCTS pass would that be valid after 2300 until the last bus in WY area?
 

175mph

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I would imagine that, going back to the original point, the ticket machines (or their setup, at least) are not sophistcated enough to see any difference between passenger (a) boarding service (98) and passenger (b) boarding service (99), where both are before the nominal validity of the ENCTS pass. Therefore I suspect they very simply reject any pre-0925 (or so) swipe, and the expectation is that the driver will manually override where an exception is in place.

So should I have argued with the bus driver to manually override it?
 
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