Crewe - Birmingham Stns Off Peak validity

[ole man]

Im catching the 09.01 from crewe to birmingham new st on a monday,which is classed as off peak,but i want to buy the tickets before 09.00 will i be charged peak rate? Will i have to state to the ticket staff what i am doing?

 

[yorkie]

The restrictions for a Crewe - Birmingham Stations Off Peak Return ticket is:-

SVR - OFF-PEAK R LMR
00000 - ANY PERMITTED

1 Adult @£ 22.10 = £ 22.10
__________
£ 22.10

Standard Class Return
From: 1243 CREWE
To : 0418 BIRMINGHAM STNS

Restriction : CS

OUTWARD and RETURN travel:

By any train except those
timed to depart Mondays-
Fridays before 0900.

Ticket office staff should ask what time you wish to travel and if you state the 09:01 they should sell the Off Peak Return ticket.

If you wish to travel earlier than 09:00 they will offer to sell you the £40.90 Anytime Return.

A good way round this is to get an Anytime Day Return from Crewe to Stafford for £10.20, and an Anytime Day Return from Stafford to Birmingham Stns for £10.70. Total cost £20.90 but the trains must call at Stafford on both outward and return journeys.

Through trains from Crewe to Birmingham that call at Stafford are at the following times between 0730 and 0900 (you can look up any times you want on the National Rail website - but be careful to ensure the train calls at Stafford and does not pass through without stopping):

0740
0749
0801
0822
0849

Note that you must specifically ask for these tickets. If you ask for them, the seller is obliged to sell them. But they are not supposed to offer them to you unless you ask.

 

[ole man]

Thank you very much, think i will do what you suggest and split the journey up.
How come TOC's havent clicked on to this yet? Or do they know and there's nothing they can do?

 

[First class]

A West Midlands day ranger is the better option for you (off peak).

£20.00, (£13.20 with railcard), as much travel in the area after 09:00am!

Valid by any operator.

-

 

[ole man]

Thank you also, bet they don't tell you that though,there is probably many ways you could get cheap tickets.Mr doe from rail mag tells you ways to do it, bet the TOC's hate him.

 

[First class]

Thank you also, bet they don't tell you that though,there is probably many ways you could get cheap tickets.Mr doe from rail mag tells you ways to do it, bet the TOC's hate him.

TOCs like him, actually (in my experience anyway).

He makes the mistake of alerting TOCs to the anomalies which are in turn corrected.

Strange thing is that he actually emails the TOCs to tell them an anomaly exists!

You find an anomaly, you keep it private!

 

[martinsh]

A good way round this is to get an Anytime Day Return from Crewe to Stafford for £10.20, and an Anytime Day Return from Stafford to Birmingham Stns for £10.70. Total cost £20.90 but the trains must call at Stafford on both outward and return journeys.

There is also an Offpeak Day Return Stafford - Birmingham @ £9.10 - valid outward after 9am, but there are some evening restrictions on returning from Birmingham, I think

 

[bb21]

There is also an Offpeak Day Return Stafford - Birmingham @ £9.10 - valid outward after 9am, but there are some evening restrictions on returning from Birmingham, I think

This is it.

By any train_except not valid
Mon - Fri on any train
departing Birmingham New
Street, Birmingham Snow Hill,
Birmingham Moor Street, Five
Ways or Jewellery Quarter
between 1635 and 1800
inclusive.

 

[Paul Kelly]

Is the West Midlands Day Ranger really valid between Coventry and Leamington Spa? Or is that map out of date? It could have saved me a few more pounds on a single journey I was making between Stoke-on-Trent and Oxford last June if it was (could have bought LMS to Banbury instead of COV to Banbury, and then a (Network Railcard-discounted) Oxford Evening Out day ranger for Banbury - Oxford).

 

[bb21]

Is the West Midlands Day Ranger really valid between Coventry and Leamington Spa? Or is that map out of date? It could have saved me a few more pounds on a single journey I was making between Stoke-on-Trent and Oxford last June if it was (could have bought LMS to Banbury instead of COV to Banbury, and then a (Network Railcard-discounted) Oxford Evening Out day ranger for Banbury - Oxford).

It is valid to Leamington Spa.

NRE map here.

 

[Paul Kelly]

Is that new? The current map on the London Midland website says it isn't:

 

[bb21]

Given that the LM map still includes the line between Walsall and Wolverhampton, I would trust the "definitive source" that is NRE.

Anyhow wouldn't it be because the LM map only shows sections where LM operates?

 

[thewolf]

There is still one service a day which operates Walsall to Wolverhampton direct...

Oh never mind, are you saying that's why its a more reliable source?

 

[bb21]

Under any circumstance, I would think that information given out on NRE trumps information given out by any individual TOC, as it is the "definitive source". However if there is something to our benefit on LM's website, an LM guard is hardly going to argue against it if you present it to him/her. An XC guard might. An XC guard cannot argue against information given out on the NRE site though.

 

[Paul Kelly]

Good to know. The map from the manual posted by First_class looks like an edited version of the LM map. They haven't moved the "Walsall" text down a bit after deleteing the line between there and Wolverhampton; it looks slightly out of place.

 

[yorkie]

Oh never mind, are you saying that's why its a more reliable source?

Not sure what you mean, but the National Rail website claims to be "authoritative" however where you have confusion like this (which is not at all uncommon with Rovers & Rangers) my advice is to use whichever map/description is more favourable.

The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999
Written contracts
7. - (1) A seller or supplier shall ensure that any written term of a contract is expressed in plain, intelligible language.
(2) If there is doubt about the meaning of a written term, the interpretation which is most favourable to the consumer shall prevail but this rule shall not apply in proceedings brought under regulation 12.
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si1999/19992083.htm

 

[bnm]

There is also an Offpeak Day Return Stafford - Birmingham @ £9.10 - valid outward after 9am, but there are some evening restrictions on returning from Birmingham, I think

And to avoid those evening restrictions just buy a Stafford - Smethwick Galton Bridge ticket instead. Same price as the Stafford - Birmingham fare and valid via Birmingham New Street.

 

[mumrar]

And to avoid those evening restrictions just buy a Stafford - Smethwick Galton Bridge ticket instead. Same price as the Stafford - Birmingham fare and valid via Birmingham New Street.

But you'd need to catch a train that called at Galton Bridge then too don't forget.

 

[bb21]

But you'd need to catch a train that called at Galton Bridge then too don't forget.

Why?

It is perfectly fine to go Stafford (- Wolves) - Walsall - Perry Barr - New Street - Smethwick and stop short.

 

[SS4]

Why?

It is perfectly fine to go Stafford (- Wolves) - Walsall - Perry Barr - New Street - Smethwick and stop short.

Isn't the only service from Wolves to Walsall avoiding Birmingham late at night though?

 

[bb21]

Isn't the only service from Wolves to Walsall avoiding Birmingham late at night though?

Yes, of course.

Anyhow he is not allowed to go via Smethwick Group stations between Stafford and New Street.

The other alternative is to go down the Trent Valley via Nuneaton, then New Street.

Edit:

There is an easement allowing doubleback between New Street and Smethwick Group, applicable to journeys from beyond Dudley Port, however on Saturdays and Sundays only. (Easement 30055)

 

[yorkie]

I don't think it's worth the tiny saving compared to the Anytime Day ticket if the purpose is to pay the Off Peak Day fare, given the huge increase in journey time, but the journey could be made on a Trent Valley route service to Rugeley (and then via Walsall), or Tamworth, or Nuneaton. These are all permitted routes.

The other alternative is to go down the Trent Valley via Nuneaton, then New Street.

I agree it is down the Trent Valley, then up the Tame Valley (but it's Up the Trent Valley Line )

 

[OwlMan]

Isn't the only service from Wolves to Walsall avoiding Birmingham late at night though?

There is no direct service from Wolves - Walsall at all. There is one evening train from Walsall - Wolves.

Peter

PS THere is always the super off-peak return from Liverpool toTamworth (see previous discussions)

 

[bnm]

Yes, of course.

Anyhow he is not allowed to go via Smethwick Group stations between Stafford and New Street.

The other alternative is to go down the Trent Valley via Nuneaton, then New Street.

Edit:

There is an easement allowing doubleback between New Street and Smethwick Group, applicable to journeys from beyond Dudley Port, however on Saturdays and Sundays only. (Easement 30055)

Ahh, I missed the Saturday and Sunday bit when I read the easement. So Stafford - University instead. Again same fares as to New Street but no evening restriction.