Crew Changes on the WCML

[rishton82]

Yesterday I used the 12:28 Virgin departure off Euston and was wondering why they did a driver change at Crewe, as I thought all the crew changes were done at Preston.

 

[waterboo]

Hello guys,
Just out of interest, i wanted to know how many miles WCML drivers would have to have knowledge of when driving the route.
Therefore, whereabouts do crew changes occur when a Virgin trains service from London Euston departs enroute to Glasgow Central?

Many Thanks

 

[PHILIPE]

Hello guys,
Just out of interest, i wanted to know how many miles WCML drivers would have to have knowledge of when driving the route.
Therefore, whereabouts do crew changes occur when a Virgin trains service from London Euston departs enroute to Glasgow Central?

Many Thanks

Preston

 

[Boodiggy]

Hi,

VT also have crew changes at Crewe.

Thanks

 

[dk1]

Yeah, just Preston usually on a Glasgow. Think many diagrams consist of Preston-Euston-Birmingham-Preston & vice versa with PNBs in London &/or Brum.

 

[A-driver]

Although to specifically answer how many miles they learn, that's not quite how it works. Each depot signs certain routes. There is a difference between where they have knowledge and how far they can actually drive. I believe Preston actually sign the entire line Glasgow-London but would never do the entire like on a day as its too long to drive without a break (concentration, hunger, toilet needs etc prevent that) plus a Preston driver would be pushed to drive to glasgow, up to London then back home within a reasonable length working day.

 

[dk1]

Preston has one of the most varied diagrams for route knowledge in that they sign the entire WCML from London-Glasgow via both Trent Valley, West Midlands, Manchester & Settle & Carlisle. As said no way would they do an entire journey as max rostered continous driving time would be around 4hrs & max rostered turn would be around 10hrs although this does vary TOC to TOC.

 

[PHILIPE]

A Preston driver has worked through from Glasgow to Euston on a special speed record run (special arrangements issued to ensure clear road throughout) about 10 years ago for which a DVD was produced. There was another Preston driver present to take over if required.

 

[dk1]

A Preston driver has worked through from Glasgow to Euston on a special speed record run (special arrangements issued to ensure clear road throughout) about 10 years ago for which a DVD was produced. There was another Preston driver present to take over if required.

Virgin Angels

 

[Galvanize]

Yeah, just Preston usually on a Glasgow. Think many diagrams consist of Preston-Euston-Birmingham-Preston & vice versa with PNBs in London &/or Brum.

The "Triangle Job" as is mentioned on here or other forums that Virgin drivers tend to do to avoid repetition?

Am I right in thinking the Train Managers on VT don't get official PNBs as part of their rostered turns or am I getting mixed up?

 

[najaB]

Yesterday I used the 12:28 Virgin departure off Euston and was wondering why they did a driver change at Crewe, as I thought all the crew changes were done at Preston.

I was on a service that did the driver change at Lancaster. At least that was the plan as the train was heavily delayed and (presumption here) the driver ran out of hours at Preston.

Cue long delay at Preston while they waited for the driver to come down from Lancaster on a southbound service.

Edit: Unless the TM was talking cobblers, but I doubt that's the case as the initial reason for the delay at Preston was waiting for her to come off the previous southbound service.

 

[Ianno87]

A Preston driver has worked through from Glasgow to Euston on a special speed record run (special arrangements issued to ensure clear road throughout) about 10 years ago for which a DVD was produced. There was another Preston driver present to take over if required.

I seem to recall from the DVD (supplied with the Railway Magazine) the intention was to switch over (on the move) half-way. But then the original driver was still fresh as a daisy, so kept going!

Cab view of going non-stop through Preston (with Virgin staff waving) was somewhat strange...

 

[dk1]

The "Triangle Job" as is mentioned on here or other forums that Virgin drivers tend to do to avoid repetition?

Am I right in thinking the Train Managers on VT don't get official PNBs as part of their rostered turns or am I getting mixed up?

Guards do not tend to be able to demand PNBs in the same way as drivers. They often lost a break but refuse to do revenue duties in protest.

I wish I had the same repetitive route agreement as VT. Get bored out of my brains most days.

 

[rishton82]

Why would the do it on that service as there is not a timetabled stop and I have used that train on before and they have only changed crew at Preston.

 

[craigybagel]

Guards do not tend to be able to demand PNBs in the same way as drivers. They often lost a break but refuse to do revenue duties in protest.

I wish I had the same repetitive route agreement as VT. Get bored out of my brains most days.

The "Triangle Job" as is mentioned on here or other forums that Virgin drivers tend to do to avoid repetition?

Am I right in thinking the Train Managers on VT don't get official PNBs as part of their rostered turns or am I getting mixed up?

VT TMs don't have PNBs included in their diagram like the drivers or guards at most other companies do. If their train inbound runs late and they have to head straight back out again, tough.

Speaking of TMs, whilst the drivers do always swap over at Preston, there are (or at least used to be when I left) two jobs for Preston TMs that see them pass through the station, working the first Crewe-Glasgow in the morning, and the last Glasgow-Crewe at night. They travel PASS between Preston and Crewe in the Highland sleeper, or a taxi if that's not running.

 

[Galvanize]

VT TMs don't have PNBs included in their diagram like the drivers or guards at most other companies do. If their train inbound runs late and they have to head straight back out again, tough.

Ouch! I think I read somewhere before that the argument is that there's usually enough time between station stops to have a "break" if they don't have time during the turnaround.

So everything south of Preston is either a Euston, Wolverhampton or Preston TM on the Anglo-Scottish jobs, and north of Preston is Preston, Glasgow or Edinburgh crews I'm guessing.

 

[craigybagel]

So everything south of Preston is either a Euston, Wolverhampton or Preston TM on the Anglo-Scottish jobs, and north of Preston is Preston, Glasgow or Edinburgh crews I'm guessing.

For TMs yes that's exactly it. On the drivers side, there certainly used to be one link at Manchester who also signed Preston, although I'm not sure if that was just for when Crewe-Preston is blocked and services are diverted via Manchester or whether they sign the direct route through Wigan and Warrington as well.