Could the Blyth and Tyne route be reopened?

[James_D]

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/new...sport-secretary-chris-grayling-backs-15800477

Transport Secretary Chris Grayling has thrown his support behind plans to bring back passenger trains between Ashington and Newcastle.

Northumberland County Council is putting together proposals to restore services to a track which links Newcastle City Centre to Ashington and Blyth.

Only freight trains have operated on the Ashington, Blyth and Tyne Line since passenger stations were closed in 1964.

The council aims to submit a full business case and design details by the end of the year, and says the plan is to run passenger trains along the 20-mile route by 2022.

On Friday, the Secretary of State arrived at Morpeth Railway Station and travelled on a section of the proposed Northumberland Line. Senior councillors and officers took the Minister through the plans along the route.

Chris Grayling took a trip on a 156 from Morpeth down the Blyth and Tyne today, he backs reopening it to passenger use by 2022. Shall we file this under 'I'll believe it when i see it' or is this maybe a step change we haven't seen before and it will happen?

If it were my decision, i'd run Northern services from Newcastle up the Blyth and Tyne and Terminate at Morpeth, and back again. 2tph in the peaks, 1tph otherwise. Then give TPE the existing paths for the Northern Morpeths up the ECML, stopping at Cramlington on the new Edinburgh services. Would make more sense to me given TPE will probably be using 125mph stock. May also open possibility for a new station at Killingworth?

Or if you want to go super duper crazy, have a 2tph service all day, one service continuing up the B&T towards Ashington, terminating at Newbiggin/Woodhorn, and the other branching off at Bedlington and continuing to Morpeth as above. Heady ideas indeed.

Thoughts?

 

[edwin_m]

From link above, my bold:

He also said he was supportive of the Northumberland Line proposals in principle.

He added: "There are about six places around the country where there is a real opportunity to bring back passengers to lines that haven't had them since the days of Dr Beeching. This is really one of them.

"It's an established railway line and it's still got a lot of the infrastructure that you would need. And there are credible exciting proposals to bring it back to life.

"So I'm very supportive of this, I'm very hopeful that we'll get a good proposal coming out of Nexus and the two authorities in the next few months."

When asked about the help the Government would give to the project, he said: "I never make absolute commitments to provide funding but I would say this is a really strong candidate.

So he's all in favour of the council spending their own money to develop the proposal but he's making no promises. In fact from his last quote he's not going to agree funding for anything...

 

[Bertie the bus]

At least he didn't say subject to a business case being made but this is effectively that but worded differently:

"So I'm very supportive of this, I'm very hopeful that we'll get a good proposal coming out of Nexus and the two authorities in the next few months."

 

[yorksrob]

Put your money where your mouth is Mr Grayling. Expecting Councils to stump up, isn't enough.

 

[tbtc]

Well, after he suggested that Skipton - Colne was worth investigating then it'd be pretty insulting to Northumbria if he didn't sound supportive of what ought to be a much simpler scheme with tangible benefits.

• You've got a big city (Newcastle)
• You've got an economically deprived post-industrial area (Ashington, Blyth)
• You've got a frequent high quality bus service linking these towns to Newcastle (which shows that there's a significant market there for good public transport)

(or, more to the point, it doesn't rely on benefitting a couple of freight services a day, it doesn't rely on being a useful diversionary route a couple of weekends a year, it is based on everyday simple quantifiable benefits)

I've not idea about the cost/benefit analysis but if a scheme like this isn't worthy of consideration then we can forget any new lines.

 

[Killingworth]

We must guard against undue cynicism. He may have used the same phraseology many times before across the nation. Sounds encouraging until the business case comes into play. The Grip process is interminable with many pit falls along the way.

Any new Killingworth station would need to be north of the old station and level crossing but might well support a park and ride facility.

Even when agreed the delays go on. I hope this will succeed. Every morning in my youth I'd see the Blyth flyer come down through West Jesmond about 8.30 on its way to Manors hauled by a V3 2-6-2 tank engine. Would it have done better commercially going to the Central? Who knows for certain but then there wasn't sufficient platform space at the east end.

I got a photo with my pin hole box camera one day, but it came out badly!

 

[yorksrob]

We must guard against undue cynicism. He may have used the same phraseology many times before across the nation. Sounds encouraging until the business case comes into play. The Grip process is interminable with many pit falls along the way.

Any new Killingworth station would need to be north of the old station and level crossing but might well support a park and ride facility.

Even when agreed the delays go on. I hope this will succeed. Every morning in my youth I'd see the Blyth flyer come down through West Jesmond about 8.30 on its way to Manors hauled by a V3 2-6-2 tank engine. Would it have done better commercially going to the Central? Who knows for certain but then there wasn't sufficient platform space at the east end.

I got a photo with my pin hole box camera one day, but it came out badly!

View attachment 58921

If it had hung on until about 1981, there would have been a plethora of spare platforms at the East end of Central station.

 

[edwin_m]

If it had hung on until about 1981, there would have been a plethora of spare platforms at the East end of Central station.

But it wouldn't be running via West Jesmond...

It seems to me that current DfT policy is to make encouraging noises about re-openings but offering everything short of actual assistance. The rose-tinted brigade gets all excited and DfT doesn't get any hassle from the authority until they've been away and done another study. I imagine by the time reality sets in the current incumbent will be long gone.

 

[yorksrob]

But it wouldn't be running via West Jesmond...

It seems to me that current DfT policy is to make encouraging noises about re-openings but offering everything short of actual assistance. The rose-tinted brigade gets all excited and DfT doesn't get any hassle from the authority until they've been away and done another study. I imagine by the time reality sets in the current incumbent will be long gone.

Wouldn't it ? Where would it come in out of interest.

BTW, I agree entirely about central Government jumping on the bandwagon about reopenings and never putting up any funds.

 

[edwin_m]

Wouldn't it ? Where would it come in out of interest.

West Jesmond became a Metro route, the creation of Metro also being the reason those platforms at Central would have become available. A train from Blyth would then have had to use the route proposed for the reinstated Ashington service, via Seghill and the third track alongside the Metro to join the ECML at Benton Junction.

 

[yorksrob]

West Jesmond became a Metro route, the creation of Metro also being the reason those platforms at Central would have become available. A train from Blyth would then have had to use the route proposed for the reinstated Ashington service, via Seghill and the third track alongside the Metro to join the ECML at Benton Junction.

Ah, they couldn't have just laid a line alongside the metro then !

 

[Killingworth]

I've been away from the North-East too long, but weren't there plans suggested at one time to link the Blyth line into the Metro sytem?

 

[NewcastleOne]

I've been away from the North-East too long, but weren't there plans suggested at one time to link the Blyth line into the Metro sytem?

Yes there has, quite a lot but mostly it’s been the usual political nonsense. I seem to believe a London Overground like Plan could work with Ashington&blyth.
-
Hopefully the area gets the funding. The potential is there with routes to Morpeth and Newbiggn (if Track is restored). This link will help open areas such as Ashington,Blyth
And Bedlington to the Cobalt Business Park as well as Newcastle CC which is under going investment which creates jobs with new offices in the plan.

 

[edwin_m]

Ah, they couldn't have just laid a line alongside the metro then !

Plenty of room east of Benton to do that, in fact it may have been four-track in heavy rail days. West of Benton including West Jesmond is heavily built up suburban areas and widening would have been very disruptive.

In fact the previous Tyneside Electric network included fast trains from the coast using the Benton curve to get a qucker route into Central avoiding Jesmond etc, this section of the ECML having third rail for that reason. So the only reason the Blyth train went on the slower route via Jesmond would appear to be the need as mentioned to terminate it at Manors, where the old northward-facing part of the station had spare platforms but I think the eastward-facing part didn't.

 

[Killingworth]

Plenty of room east of Benton to do that, in fact it may have been four-track in heavy rail days. West of Benton including West Jesmond is heavily built up suburban areas and widening would have been very disruptive.

In fact the previous Tyneside Electric network included fast trains from the coast using the Benton curve to get a qucker route into Central avoiding Jesmond etc, this section of the ECML having third rail for that reason. So the only reason the Blyth train went on the slower route via Jesmond would appear to be the need as mentioned to terminate it at Manors, where the old northward-facing part of the station had spare platforms but I think the eastward-facing part didn't.

It also stopped at Jesmond.

 

[a_c_skinner]

Out for a walk recently Mrs S asked me about a bit of the Blyth and Tyne route we could see (she feigns catatonic boredom when I talk about railways, but it is just an act). I explained as well as I could but then realised I'd no idea what needed to be done to upgrade it to passenger use. Stations obviously, but what else? Better track and signals? That doesn't seem to make sense. Speeds upgraded? What?

Andrew

 

[swt_passenger]

Stations basically, I’d have thought. Charters and demonstrations for local politicians seem to run without issues, there was such a trip last month mentioned in a couple of threads at the time. It seems to be maintained to a reasonable standard for freight anyway.

 

[pdeaves]

Probably also 'fettle' the track (or relay it) to make it suitable for regular passenger movements and/or higher speeds (as opposed to occasional low speed specials). Maybe alter all the signalling to suit higher speeds and more trains running.

 

[deltic08]

Would have thought the 40/50mph route would be fast enough at the moment. Station platforms first, signalling second and then level crossings with trackwork last when traffic has built up a bit. Bedlington Jnc S&C has a 10mph limit so that may need doing sooner rather than later.

Maybe just a bit of tamping would bring it up to 60mph, where curvature allows, without track replacement as much is cwr on concrete sleepers.

 

[Killingworth]

When they converted the North Tyneside lines for Metro the old tracks remained for many years. Mind you some were used daily by coal trains and the section from Benton to Manors was used as a relief for the ECML when any engineering work was needed on the mainline. Many old sleepers remained from the third rail electrification days for decades after it was removed. I'd have thought much of the track would still be usable on the Blyth and Tyne with moderate work for a fairly light operation.

 

[deltic08]

Metro have announced today that they want money from Government to extend the system. One extension is to Ashington and Morpeth via Bedlington. No mention of Newbiggin.
Would this be better and more flexible as heavy rail and not light rail and is this Nexus just trying to cherry pick?
At least heavy rail could be introduced quicker and cheaper without installing all that overhead.

 

[edwin_m]

Metro have announced today that they want money from Government to extend the system. One extension is to Ashington and Morpeth via Bedlington. No mention of Newbiggin.
Would this be better and more flexible as heavy rail and not light rail and is this Nexus just trying to cherry pick?
At least heavy rail could be introduced quicker and cheaper without installing all that overhead.

The new Metro units will be more heavy-rail like with the intention of running them on nearby parts of Network Rail too.

 

[NewcastleOne]

The new Metro units will be more heavy-rail like with the intention of running them on nearby parts of Network Rail too.

But they aren’t set to go up to Ashington.
The plan for AB&T from what is believed is to have a London Overground style service on the line just with lower frequencies.

 

[edwin_m]

But they aren’t set to go up to Ashington.
The plan for AB&T from what is believed is to have a London Overground style service on the line just with lower frequencies.

I was responding to deltic08 suggesting that it would be a Metro route.

 

[Killingworth]

After waiting so long it needs to be right. Integrating with Metro and through running to Monument or heavy rail to Central?

Metro's wish list is ambitious. Wishful thinking, much of which has been around for many years.

 

[adrock1976]

After waiting so long it needs to be right. Integrating with Metro and through running to Monument or heavy rail to Central?

Metro's wish list is ambitious. Wishful thinking, much of which has been around for many years.

It only took 22 years for the Tyne & Wear Metro to reach Wearside back in 2002, from when the first section in Tyneside opened in 1980.

 

[TUC]

At an online event tonight where the Prime Minister and Chancellor were taking questions from Conservative Party members, Boris Johnson made a reference to a visit to Blyth yesterday, and started to say 'And we're reversing the Beeching cuts and reopening the Blyth rail line'. He then stopped himself and said 'Actually I'm not sure if we've announced that yet, but oh well I've done it now'.

There was the government announcement at the start of 2020 about funding the business case on potential investment, but this seemed to go further and confirm that the reopening would go ahead.

 

[edwin_m]

I hope Northumberland Council and the people of Blyth hold his feet to the fire and make sure he delivers.

 

[Gloster]

I hope Northumberland Council and the people of Blyth hold his feet to the fire and make sure he delivers.

It would be more effective to hold another part of his anatomy to the fire, although it is probably used to getting hot to due to overuse.

More seriously, because it is Boris Johnson they will be able to get away with backing out at a later date if necessary, using the, “ It’s only Boris”, argument/excuse.

 

[Oxfordblues]

The government could organise a demonstration special train on the Blyth and Tyne to show the locals what might be possible. Here in Oxford a while ago I joined a special DMU on the Cowley branch with a temporary "station" at the Business Park. I was very impressed, as I'm sure would the Red Wall voters.