Could Scotrail HSTs be extended to 6 coaches?

[Aaron_TTL]

Moderator note: Split from

ScotRail HST Introduction - Updates & Discussion

A close friend of mine came across a set of documents lying on the table in a staff bothy regarding in-depth details of the refurbishment plan for the ScotRail HST fleet. I can't find any released PDFs online nor on this forum, so I've started this thread dedicated to the ScotRail HST arrival...

www.railforums.co.uk

I was reading back to when the HSTs were first announced on this forum and lots of folk said it would be reasonably easy to acquire more Mk3's to get up to 2+5's or even 2+6's - Is this still a possiiblity?

Or have a lot of the spare MK3s been scrappd now?

 

[scotraildriver]

I was reading back to when the HSTs were first announced on this forum and lots of folk said it would be reasonably easy to acquire more Mk3's to get up to 2+5's or even 2+6's - Is this still a possiiblity? Or have a lot of the spare MK3s been scrappd now?

ScotRail's contract with Wabtec is now complete (after 8 protracted years). Given the nightmare it has been there's little to no chance they'll want anything else done.

 

[Speed43125]

Theoretically I suppose they could buy some former XC coaches from Doric.

Money aside, they would need different interiors to match the Scottish ones and that pushes you back to sub 5 years from the 2030 date when they might be replaced anyway.

 

[43096]

Theoretically I suppose they could buy some former XC coaches from Doric.

Money aside, they would need different interiors to match the Scottish ones and that pushes you back to sub 5 years from the 2030 date when they might be replaced anyway.

Better bet would be former GWR vehicles.

 

[Indigo Soup]

There was originally a notion of running two 2+6 sets, but that was dropped very early on. I assume they would have been dedicated to Aberdeen-Edinburgh as that's the busiest route; I'm not sure if a 2+6 set would fit into Queen Street without messing up the platform allocation for the 8-car Edinburgh-Glasgow shuttles.

At this point, I suspect the only way to get longer HSTs for Scotrail is to break up some of the existing sets. Dropping one 2+4 set would let you extend three sets by one car each, with one of the three getting an additional TSD, and the other two an additional TS. Remarshalling all nine would make 23 2+5 sets. Remarshalling the whole lot would give you 19 2+6 sets; I'm assuming you wouldn't want to make 2+7 sets with the spare TFCs, but you could.

Depending on how straightforward it is to detach and reattach power cars, this might actually be possible without knackering the diagrams. There are currently only 15 HST diagrams, and AFAIK this is driven by power car availability.

 

[John Bishop]

Not going to happen at all.

 

[Mitchell Hurd]

Better bet would be former GWR vehicles.

I was thinking the same thing (even the TGS coaches would be ideal) - the interior could be kept but just have ScotRail antimacassars. That could be the unreserved coach.

 

[Mitchell Hurd]

There was originally a notion of running two 2+6 sets, but that was dropped very early on. I assume they would have been dedicated to Aberdeen-Edinburgh as that's the busiest route; I'm not sure if a 2+6 set would fit into Queen Street without messing up the platform allocation for the 8-car Edinburgh-Glasgow shuttles.

At this point, I suspect the only way to get longer HSTs for Scotrail is to break up some of the existing sets. Dropping one 2+4 set would let you extend three sets by one car each, with one of the three getting an additional TSD, and the other two an additional TS. Remarshalling all nine would make 23 2+5 sets. Remarshalling the whole lot would give you 19 2+6 sets; I'm assuming you wouldn't want to make 2+7 sets with the spare TFCs, but you could.

Depending on how straightforward it is to detach and reattach power cars, this might actually be possible without knackering the diagrams. There are currently only 15 HST diagrams, and AFAIK this is driven by power car availability.

Would 2+6 and 2+7's have been able to keep to the timings ok?

 

[Speed43125]

Better bet would be former GWR vehicles.

I didn't realize there were any left in the country. Are there any more at Great Yarmouth/Ely?

 

[43096]

I didn't realize there were any left in the country. Are there any more at Great Yarmouth/Ely?

There’s some still in service which come out of service once the 175s come on stream with GWR.