Control Period 5

[LNW-GW Joint]

DfT put this out in relation to the Industry Plan, mostly commenting on the process up to approval of the CP5 plan.

http://www.dft.gov.uk/publications/villiers-20110928

At least it does not dismiss it out of hand.

Note the remark about DfT specifying outputs rather than specific improvements. No micromanagement here!

 

[button_boxer]

the Midland Main Line from Bedford to Corby, Nottingham, and Sheffield via Derby;

This sounds rather short sighted. The report says:

The core scheme proposes overhead electrification for the Bedford to Sheffield via Derby, Kettering to Corby and Trent Junction to Nottingham sections of route. The case to electrify other sections of the route for operational and diversionary purposes is being examined along with the rolling stock requirements for the route.

Hopefully they'll see sense and add in at least the Erewash Valley and Sheffield to Doncaster, plus maybe Nottingham to Grantham. Even if the business case for those is marginal it's surely going to be cheaper overall to add them on to the main project rather than doing them as separate small projects later on.

 

[swt_passenger]

DfT put this out in relation to the Industry Plan, mostly commenting on the process up to approval of the CP5 plan.

http://www.dft.gov.uk/publications/villiers-20110928

At least it does not dismiss it out of hand.

They can't (yet) - they will have to follow the timetable in the legislation.

They'll probably just dismiss it in 2013...

 

[sprinterguy]

Hopefully they'll see sense and add in at least the Erewash Valley and Sheffield to Doncaster, plus maybe Nottingham to Grantham. Even if the business case for those is marginal it's surely going to be cheaper overall to add them on to the main project rather than doing them as separate small projects later on.

Agreed. Ideally, MML electrification done properly would be extensive another to give an electrified cross-country route as well as the MML itself, by electrifying Birmingham to Derby, and beyond Sheffield to Doncaster, Leeds and York (as well as the Erewash valley as a diversionary route of course).

Between the three electrification schemes covering the Cardiff Valleys, Transpennine and Midland Main Line, they have the potential to get a good way towards total Pacer replacement, and the latter two could provide a pretty comprehensive electrified commuter/local rail operation in South and West Yorkshire if all the little links between them were connected up. Transpennine electrification should really go as far as Hull to assist this aim.

 

[MidlandMainlie]

Agreed. Ideally, MML electrification done properly would be extensive another to give an electrified cross-country route as well as the MML itself, by electrifying Birmingham to Derby, and beyond Sheffield to Doncaster, Leeds and York (as well as the Erewash valley as a diversionary route of course).

Agreed though I would add Derby - Crewe to that list aswell. All that is neded then to electrify the core cross-country route is Bristol - Birmingham.

 

[tbtc]

This is Network Rails business plan, the Crewe Chester according to rumours is something the Dft is trying to sell in the WCML tendering as an optional extra, if so it would be Franchise led improvements.

Thanks.

Ideally I'd like to think that the DFT and Network Rail would be working towards similar goals, but thats me being naive!

I'm happy for any improvement though, whether from the DFT/ Network Rail/ TOCs showing initiative...

 

[northwichcat]

Agreed though I would add Derby - Crewe to that list aswell.

As the West Coast RUS recommends extending the route to Manchester Airport using longer trains and most of the route is already electrified that makes sense.

 

[brianthegiant]

Oh i agree, photovoltaic panels are a waste of time and money in this country. The only reason renewables are profitable in the UK are due to ROCs or FITs (depending on who is generating it).

Fossil fuels and nulcear are also heavily subsidised, the difference is that that the levelised cost of energy (p/kWh) for renewables is continuing to fall due to increase economies of scale and R&D, meanwhile the cost of fossil fuels continues to rise due to scarcity.

Wind power is already cheaper than nuclear for electricity generation, parity with Gas will happen within the next few years. Coal is out of the running for new capacity due to high carbon emissions & high cost/risks of carbon capture & storage.

Our north sea reserves are dwindling and we are now net importers of oil and gas. So it is right that we should diversify our energy supply to minimise imports from unreliable sources like Russia, and make use of the excellent wind, wave, tidal and hydro resource that we have in this country.

Also those who compare emissions from Diesel engines with emissions from power stations, overlook the increased efficiency of electric stock due to regenerative braking, also the greater efficiency and more comprehensive pollution controls of a 500MW power station compared with a 500kW train engine. Also that grid electricity is now about 10% renewables and rising.

 

[HSTEd]

Wind power is already cheaper than nuclear for electricity generation, parity with Gas will happen within the next few years. Coal is out of the running for new capacity due to high carbon emissions & high cost/risks of carbon capture & storage.

Nuclear power is only more expensive than wind in a series of highly specific scenarios none of which are transferable to the real world, once you include the cost of energy storage to allow you to provide electricity when its needed rather than when the wind chooses to provide it, and the backup capacity to provide reserve electricity in times when there is no major wind for over a week (such as happened in the middle of last winter if anyone remembers) the price skyrockets.

Nuclears prices are also inflated drastically by the fact that we are having to rebuild the entire supply chain for reactor components almost from scratch due to the Post Three Mile Island effective moratorium on new power plants in most of the world.

There is a reason that the nation with the highest percentage of nuclear power generation in europe also has the lowest electricity prices in europe.