Colne- Manchester- London service.

[Popper]

After seeing the 'Three Counties Railway' thread pop up I decided I would put my idea of an OAO route. Grand Union and Alliance both have permission to use it!

The route would start at Colne, the northern terminus of a single track branch (which would need a passing loop at some point.) It would go southwards calling at all stations (Nelson, Brierfield, Burnley Central, Burnley Barracks) till the junction with the Halifax- Preston line. It would head westwards calling at Accrington and Blackburn, before heading south at a junction to call at Darwen and Bromley Cross. Then it joins the Preston- Manchester line at Bolton, stopping at the station there. It continues south east calling at Kearsley, Clifton and Manchester Piccadilly where it joins the electrified line. It would run south to the WCML calling at Stockport then Crewe before heading south east to London Euston.

In short:
Clone-Nelson-Brierfield-Burnley Central- Burnley Barracks- Accrington- Blackburn- Darwen- Bromley Cross- Bolton- Kearsley- Clifton- Manchester Piccadilly- Stockport- Crewe- London Euston.

I don't know if TRACKMAPS is anything to go by, but it identified where the population were so I based my stops on it. It would give direct London service to Colne, Burnley, Accrington, Blackburn, Bolton as well as many smaller towns.

I'm no railway expert, so it would be nice if you could give me your ideas about how to improve the idea. Also it would be nice to hear you criticisms too even if it a subtle hint that it just won't work!

 

[gnolife]

well, i can tell you that Clifton is a deserted shack, so an open access would corner the market there. I think that the section between Salford Crescent and Piccadilly is at capacity, as is the Stockport Viaduct. Routing through Heald Green instead of Stockport would alleviate this though.

 

[northwichcat]

Other operators can run Piccadilly or Stockport to London under competition protection, so with that route as stands Piccadilly and Stockport would have to be set down only southbound and pick up only northbound.

I'd re-route that service personally to either go via Hartford and Winsford or to Victoria and then to Stockport via Denton.

 

[lancastrian]

well, i can tell you that Clifton is a deserted shack, so an open access would corner the market there. I think that the section between Salford Crescent and Piccadilly is at capacity, as is the Stockport Viaduct. Routing through Heald Green instead of Stockport would alleviate this though.

So true, I have not actually checked lately but I think that very few train call there these days. To be honest to stop these Colne - London trains at so many back gates is really self defeating. The idea of a Colne to London service is a good idea, but you are not stopping at the right places. I would suggest the following starting at Colne - Nelson - Burnely Central - Blackburn - Bolton - Salford Central - Manchester Victoria - Stockport - Wilmslow - Sandbach - Crewe - Lichfield - Tamworth - Rugby - Milton Keynes - Euston.

I know that others will have other ideas, and the route between Victoria & Stockport is via the Ashton Moss lines, and onto Guide Bridge - Denton - Stockport Line.

However popper, you are quite right that not only would the Rose Grove - Colne line need a passing loop somewhere along it. My idea would be one at Burnley Central and another at Nelson. The ideal would be if they reopened the Colne to Skipton line and redouble the whole of the Rose Grove - Colne line.

The other capacity problem, yet again caused by the shortsighted idea of singling every possible line, is between Blackburn & Bolton. Again the right thing would be to re-double the whole lot, but some bright spark decided to save money and only replace the over road bridge at King William, between Bromy Cross & Turton for single track only, morrons.

So if the track from Blackburn to Darwen was redoubled, along with the final couple of miles from Hall i'th' Wood into Bolton. As well as a dynamic loop between Entwistle and Turton, reopening this station as well, then it might be a goer.

I await, comments, being shot down and others view with interest.

 

[tbtc]

Sorry to make the obvious comment, but any spare paths on the WCML and spare stock should really go towards providing an improved service on routes like London - Liverpool, interesting though this idea is...

 

[MidnightFlyer]

So true, I have not actually checked lately but I think that very few train call there these days. To be honest to stop these Colne - London trains at so many back gates is really self defeating. The idea of a Colne to London service is a good idea, but you are not stopping at the right places. I would suggest the following starting at Colne - Nelson - Burnely Central - Blackburn - Bolton - Salford Central - Manchester Victoria - Stockport - Wilmslow - Sandbach - Crewe - Lichfield - Tamworth - Rugby - Milton Keynes - Euston.

I know that others will have other ideas, and the route between Victoria & Stockport is via the Ashton Moss lines, and onto Guide Bridge - Denton - Stockport Line.

However popper, you are quite right that not only would the Rose Grove - Colne line need a passing loop somewhere along it. My idea would be one at Burnley Central and another at Nelson. The ideal would be if they reopened the Colne to Skipton line and redouble the whole of the Rose Grove - Colne line.

The other capacity problem, yet again caused by the shortsighted idea of singling every possible line, is between Blackburn & Bolton. Again the right thing would be to re-double the whole lot, but some bright spark decided to save money and only replace the over road bridge at King William, between Bromy Cross & Turton for single track only, morrons.

So if the track from Blackburn to Darwen was redoubled, along with the final couple of miles from Hall i'th' Wood into Bolton. As well as a dynamic loop between Entwistle and Turton, reopening this station as well, then it might be a goer.

I await, comments, being shot down and others view with interest.

I would say Accrington and Darwen would justify stops too. Ideally, Bolton-Blackburn would be doubled fully from BromleyCross-Bolton and Darwen-Blackburn (I'm unsure of alignments around Hall-i-th-Wood though), but that leaves you snookered around Entwistle, and Sough Tunnel cannot be doubled owing to a landslip on the northern tunnelmouth.

 

[lancastrian]

You could well be right concerning Accrington & Darwen. Both are largish towns and do deserve a through service to London if possible. Regarding the route through Hall i'th' Wood, it is double track from just south of the station there, all the way to Bromley Cross, it already has two platforms. The bit is the middle is the difficult bit. You could extend the double track soth from Darwen almost to Sough Tunnel, single track through the tunnel and then a dynamic loop from Entwistle to Turton. This would leave about two stretches of single track each of about 2/3 miles long, not to much of a problem with the current levels of service plus the extra trains to and from London

 

[GNERman]

Grand Union

No such company exists.

The route would start at Colne, the northern terminus of a single track branch (which would need a passing loop at some point.)

Wouldn't do anything on that branch until THIS get's the go ahead...

 

[Popper]

Grand Union

No such company exists.

I thought it was the owner of Grand Central.

Thanks everyone for your help.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Sorry to make the obvious comment, but any spare paths on the WCML and spare stock should really go towards providing an improved service on routes like London - Liverpool, interesting though this idea is...

Run just to Crewe or Stockport with good connections to London?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

well, i can tell you that Clifton is a deserted shack, so an open access would corner the market there. I think that the section between Salford Crescent and Piccadilly is at capacity, as is the Stockport Viaduct. Routing through Heald Green instead of Stockport would alleviate this though.

A DIRECT Heald Green to Blackburn service, without having to change at either Salford Crescent or Bolton I am all for that one.

What method of traction do you propose?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I'd re-route that service personally to either go via Hartford and Winsford or to Victoria and then to Stockport via Denton.

Keep up the good work in publicising the Stockport to Manchester Victoria line via the two junctions at Ashton Moss and Denton and Reddish South stations.

The more this route appears on any thread of the forum, the better will people know of it,

 

[samj1]

Personally could not see there being much demand from Colne or Burnley at all. Maybe Blackburn or Accrington however.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Personally could not see there being much demand from Colne or Burnley at all. Maybe Blackburn or Accrington however.

If the Todmorden Chord ever gets its new single track Manchester facing junction, services from the East Lancashire area to Manchester, via Todmorden and Rochdale will restore their direct link that was lost in the Beeching cuts. Lancashire County Council state this to be the highest on their list of transport improvemets.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I thought it was the owner of Grand Central

I just fed this into my business checker and it came up with the following:-

GRAND UNION RAILWAY COMPANY LIMITED
2 TEMPLE BACK EAST
TEMPLE QUAY
BRISTOL
BS1 6EG

This is an open-access railway company that has been set up by The Grand Central Railway.

Stated Aims:-
To provide a railway service on the West Coast Main Line to destinations in the North West and the North-East of England.

 

[Welshman]

Personally could not see there being much demand from Colne or Burnley at all. Maybe Blackburn or Accrington however.

IIRC, in the days of yore there used to be through coaches from Colne and Burnley to London Euston. I think they were worked via Rose Grove, Accrington, Baxenden Bank, Clifton Junction to Manchester Victoria, then Denton to Stockport, where they were attached to a London Rd [as then]- Euston service, and v.v.

I seem to remember the workings ceased when the Manchester Piccadilly- Euston electrification was completed in 1966.

The Colne portion probably did good business in the days of a thriving cotton industry in the Colne-Nelson-Burnley area, but I share the doubt that there would be the demand now. And I should imagine Blackburn pasengers would find it quicker to go via Preston.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The Colne portion probably did good business in the days of a thriving cotton industry in the Colne-Nelson-Burnley area, but I share the doubt that there would be the demand now. And I should imagine Blackburn pasengers would find it quicker to go via Preston.

A current view of what were working cotton establishments in this part of Lancashire would bear out exactly what you have said.

With regard to Blackburn passengers, they have access to Preston on both the Colne - Blackpool South service and the York - Hebden Bridge -Blackburn - Blackpool North service at this present time.