Closure of Teesside Airport station

[Bletchleyite]

Does anyone suspect somebody forgot about FoI?

 

[Watershed]

Does anyone suspect somebody forgot about FoI?

Anybody working in the rail industry should consider their correspondence fair game for FoI, and act accordingly! Even stuff written whilst Northern was a privately owned operator (and similarly over at LNER, Southeastern & ScotRail) can be released.

But yes, some of that correspondence doesn't strike me as particularly professional. Perhaps the kind of thing best kept to an in-person conversation!

 

[swt_passenger]

Yes, the station has been a flop but in that case the airport is valuable even if it doesn't have much of a passenger service.

I don’t know how you came to that conclusion. It seems to have been explained freight is non-existent?

 

[ainsworth74]

As can be noted from an even older Northern email chain, this isn’t a new problem either - a previous operator (Peel) had a similar reticence to part with funds:

...It was built specially at the behest of the then Airport Authority (at that time part of the now defunct Cleveland County Council). There was no viable business case for the venture, so the British Railway Board (BRB) would only build the station on the strict understanding that the airport maintained and renewed it.

...

Whoever at the BRB managed that deserves a medal. Successfully arranged for the railway to dodge a bullet many decades later when the business case that showed there was no viable case was proven totally correct and so now someone has to pay for a station that is pointless!

Also always nice to see your own thoughts backed up by those involved internally:

The truth is we could stop everything there but it would not make a difference as the station is still a mile from the airport’s entrance and as said above, nothing really flies from there anymore!

Preach anonymous Northern employee!

 

[swt_passenger]

Whoever at the BRB managed that deserves a medal. Successfully arranged for the railway to dodge a bullet many decades later when the business case that showed there was no viable case was proven totally correct and so now someone has to pay for a station that is pointless!

Also always nice to see your own thoughts backed up by those involved internally:



Preach anonymous Northern employee!

So rail professionals over many years consider it a total basket case, what a surprise…

 

[Watershed]

Whoever at the BRB managed that deserves a medal. Successfully arranged for the railway to dodge a bullet many decades later when the business case that showed there was no viable case was proven totally correct and so now someone has to pay for a station that is pointless!

The real question is whether that understanding is actually legally binding - or whether it was just a 'gentlemen's agreement' that the airport can now go back on.

Also always nice to see your own thoughts backed up by those involved internally:


Preach anonymous Northern employee!

It's actually half a mile from the terminal building - a 10 minute walk on average. Given how small the terminal is, you're likely to be walking a lot further if you fly from Heathrow, Gatwick or Stansted, even though the respective stations are in/adjacent to the terminal at each of those airports.

Still, the mere fact that there is a walk to get to the terminal building is off-putting, even if that gives a false impression. And certainly the walk is not along a nice pleasant path.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

The real question is whether that understanding is actually legally binding - or whether it was just a 'gentlemen's agreement' that the airport can now go back on.


It's actually half a mile from the terminal building - a 10 minute walk on average. Given how small the terminal is, you're likely to be walking a lot further if you fly from Heathrow, Gatwick or Stansted, even though the respective stations are in/adjacent to the terminal at each of those airports.

Still, the mere fact that there is a walk to get to the terminal building is off-putting, even if that gives a false impression. And certainly the walk is not along a nice pleasant path.

The walking you do inside Heathrow or Gatwick is indoors and catered, most of it after you've checked in and got rid of your suitcase. Nobody flying from Heathrow walks there from Staines or West Drayton- which is pretty much the equivalent of what air passengers at Teesside are expected to do.

 

[Watershed]

The walking you do inside Heathrow or Gatwick is indoors and catered, most of it after you've checked in and got rid of your suitcase. Nobody flying from Heathrow walks there from Staines or West Drayton- which is pretty much the equivalent of what air passengers at Teesside are expected to do.

I really don't think the 3 mile walk from Staines/West Drayton etc. to Heathrow can be compared to the half mile walk from Teeside Airport station to the terminal. In fact at Manchester Airport it's almost that far from the rail station to security at Terminal 3, where most of the low cost carriers fly from.

But agreed - an outdoor walk is always going to be less attractive than an indoor one, particularly an unsigned one along poorly maintained roads, as is the case at Teesside.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I don’t know how you came to that conclusion. It seems to have been explained freight is non-existent?

That was about East Midlands as per my quote.

 

[swt_passenger]

That was about East Midlands as per my quote.

Oh right we had mixed up airports a bit?

 

[bramling]

Anybody working in the rail industry should consider their correspondence fair game for FoI, and act accordingly! Even stuff written whilst Northern was a privately owned operator (and similarly over at LNER, Southeastern & ScotRail) can be released.

But yes, some of that correspondence doesn't strike me as particularly professional. Perhaps the kind of thing best kept to an in-person conversation!

I wouldn’t necessarily say it’s unprofessional. They seem to have had an open-minded look at the situation and come to a reasonable conclusion. Can’t really expect more than that.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Oh right we had mixed up airports a bit?

Yep, there were a few comparisons regarding East Midlands Parkway, which is a fairly unsuccessful airport(ish) station for a much more successful airport.

 

[Trainfan2019]

I've just been reading through all the documents relating to the station temporary closure, what an interesting read, genuinely! The chance to be able to read the Network Rail station condition reports and the various emails between the rail companies and airport was quite an eye opener. Just shows the work that goes on behind the scenes even regarding what looks like an old, abandoned 2 platform station which is falling apart.

 

[ainsworth74]

I've just been reading through all the documents relating to the station temporary closure, what an interesting read, genuinely! The chance to be able to read the Network Rail station condition reports and the various emails between the rail companies and airport was quite an eye opener. Just shows the work that goes on behind the scenes even regarding what looks like an old, abandoned 2 platform station which is falling apart.

Agreed it was a fascinating, if nerdy ( ), read. Might request the one for my local station, but then again perhaps it'll also suffer a closure for safety reasons if anyone pays too close attention to it as its of similar vintage and construction to Teesside Airport!

 

[Bald Rick]

So rail professionals over many years consider it a total basket case, what a surprise…

Rail professionals are right Shock!

 

[xotGD]

Yep, there were a few comparisons regarding East Midlands Parkway, which is a fairly unsuccessful airport(ish) station for a much more successful airport.

It isn't an airport station. It is a parkway station in the East Midlands.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

It isn't an airport station. It is a parkway station in the East Midlands.

There was a bus link to the Airport when it first opened- presumably that was part of the business case?

As a Parkway I'm not sure how useful it is really. For London travellers already on the M1, if you want to park & ride it makes more sense to carry on to Luton with its much more frequent service. For Nottingham, if you drive further in you can use the tram P&R (where parking was free when I last used it- though that was a decade ago). I guess the other meaning of Parkway stations (suburbanites avoiding driving into the city for long distance travel) applies, but when I've used the station (as part of MegaBusPlus journeys) the car-park is far from full and the prices are pretty steep.

Back to Teesside Airport, to an extent I can see why some are concerned that this is another "closure by stealth" like IBM and British Steel Redcar. However I'd say it's more like Newhaven Marine- it's no longer well-sited for the sole reason it exists in the first place. At a time when immense pressure is being put on controlling costs, doing anything other than closure and demolition to this decrepit and useless station would be a waste. If in the future there's an Eco Town built there, the station would need rebuilding from the ground up anyway.

 

[Trainfan2019]

I watched another Teesside Airport station video on YouTube yesterday. This one included the walk from the station to the airport buildings and it certainly looked a long walk. No wonder the station has never really done well.

I find it strange how Northern seem to be accumulating a selection of temporarily closed stations - Teesside Airport, British Steel Redcar, Stanlow and Thornton, Manchester United. 2 of the closed stations have unsafe bridges.

 

[MadMarsupial]

In the 1980s I believe there was a Teachers Training Centre/College close to Teeside Airport Station, which generated a fair amount of passengers. Not there now.

Middleton St George College of Education was based nearby ( old RAF Buildings? ) but it was small and short lived ( 1968 - 1979 ). Bob Marley played there according to an old students@ website.

 

[Class 170101]

All I would say is not to close the runways you have.

Look at Heathrow trying to add a 3rd Runway and the big stink thats causing

A similar stink (though perhaps not as big) will happen at Gatwick should a second runway be built there.

I am fairly sure there were protests when Manchester was creating its second runway and before.

Yet Manston Airport has gone in recent years (it appears) and is now being used as a Brexit lorry park.

The UK needs to value the runways that already exist and bring them into full use and make as much use of them as possible as they are going to be easier to use than to create new runways. So in terms of Teeside Airport I wouldn't write off the station just yet despite its poor state and location.

 

[Agent_Squash]

All I would say is not to close the runways you have.

Look at Heathrow trying to add a 3rd Runway and the big stink thats causing

A similar stink (though perhaps not as big) will happen at Gatwick should a second runway be built there.

I am fairly sure there were protests when Manchester was creating its second runway and before.

Yet Manston Airport has gone in recent years (it appears) and is now being used as a Brexit lorry park.

The UK needs to value the runways that already exist and bring them into full use and make as much use of them as possible as they are going to be easier to use than to create new runways. So in terms of Teeside Airport I wouldn't write off the station just yet despite its poor state and location.

Teesside is not the answer to the shortage of runways in the South East by a long shot.

Airlines prefer a single airport - the fact that there is already 6 is troublesome enough.

Manchester and Birmingham will fulfil an overflow role for the South East through HS2, and Liverpool, Leeds, Humberside and Newcastle will all be put to greater use before Teesside is considered the only option.

It should close.

 

[Class 170101]

Teesside is not the answer to the shortage of runways in the South East by a long shot.

Maybe, Maybe not but I wouldn't close it, whilst passengers might not use it perhaps Freight could and potentially will release slots at Heathrow for passenger flights (which will help HS2 BTW).

Airlines prefer a single airport - the fact that there is already 6 is troublesome enough.

What they prefer and what they will get is a totally different matter, they have to respect politics and their communities in which they are located. Not sure there is widespread support for new runways post pandemic and post COP26. Not even sure Heathrow Airport Limited is ready to expand now as a result fo the former.

Manchester and Birmingham will fulfil an overflow role for the South East through HS2, and Liverpool, Leeds, Humberside and Newcastle will all be put to greater use before Teesside is considered the only option.

Thats as may be but I doubt we will see a 3rd Runway at Heathrow any time soon, post pandemic its surely moved further to the right.

It should close.

No, as once its gone it will be more difficult to re-open just look at the issues around East West Rail and re-opening parts of that.

 

[The Quincunx]

I watched another Teesside Airport station video on YouTube yesterday. This one included the walk from the station to the airport buildings and it certainly looked a long walk. No wonder the station has never really done well.

I find it strange how Northern seem to be accumulating a selection of temporarily closed stations - Teesside Airport, British Steel Redcar, Stanlow and Thornton, Manchester United. 2 of the closed stations have unsafe bridges.

The closure provisions do not apply to Manchester United station as it has not had "regular scheduled passenger services".

 

[pdeaves]

orthern seem to be accumulating a selection of temporarily closed stations - Teesside Airport, British Steel Redcar, Stanlow and Thornton, Manchester United

and Kirton Lindsey and Brigg...

 

[ainsworth74]

Having heard so much about it over so many years and considering that it could fall down at any moment I thought I might finally take advantage of the bank holiday (and the nice weather!) to actually visit the station and do the walk from the station to the terminal building for myself. So I made my way to Darlington on 2D11 the 0953 arrival into Darlington (in the hands of 156 482) and, having stocked up on water from Smiths (it was hot!), made my way north out of the station before intercepting the B6279 named "Tornado Way" in honour of the locomotive of the same name. My reason for this was this road (at this point) is actually on the route of the original Stockton & Darlington Railway. The line through present day Darlington station and on to Dinsdale actually came about later. Thankfully event the road gives way to a much more pleasant and slightly more obviously an ex-railway environment with a good surface underfoot and overhanging greenery giving relief from the traffic and tarmac!

A few miles outside of Darlington the old alignment intercepts the current railway just to the east of Dinsdale station having passed through the northern parts of Middleton St George. Whilst not clear from maps there is actually a footpath which follows the current railway on it's northside between it and the A67 until a convenient foot crossing allows you to cross the railway and access the road to the airport.

As you might imagine there's very little signage for the airport station but I did find one somewhat battered sign:


(This sign has certainly seen better days but it does still at least point the way correctly!)

A few hundred meters further on and we reach our primary objective!


(A shot of the subject of this thread, Teesside Airport station, in all its, er, glory?)

It was at this point that the two gentlemen who had been following me for the last five minutes or so caught up and revealed themselves to be members of Cleveland Police (the actual police not security) who enquired what I was up to and once I explained I'd come to check out the airport station they, whilst clearly slightly bemused, gamely engaged in a brief chat about the station and indeed the airport itself before wishing me well and resuming their foot patrol of the airport and its environs.

I had considered vaulting the fence to the access ramp just to quickly put a foot on the platform proper but with the police not long departed I decided discretion was the better part of valour and did not pass the metal fence blocking the entrance to the station (which ironically looks like it has only recently been refurbished as it's in extraordinarily good nick!).

So lets say our passenger has just arrived off of 2D32 the 1203 arrival from Bishop Auckland:


(156 463 rattling through, of course in reality non-stop, on its way to Saltburn, but it looks close enough to stopped we can pretend it's actually called at the station)

They find themselves, and their suitcase, confronted with this on arrival:


(This is taken from the bottom of the access ramp, if you squint you can just make out the retreating form of the two friendly police officers that stopped for a chat)

You will notice that there are no signs pointing the way, nor indeed is there a pavement. However there is only one obvious direction to go so our intrepid passenger heads the only way they can go:


(The somewhat desolate station access road, no pavement so you have a choice of grass verge or road for yourself and your suitcase)

At the end of the road you find yourself facing a widening out area. Still no pavement, nor indeed signs, but thankfully there remains really only one direction to go in:


(The road continues with no pavement nor, indeed, grass verge meaning our intrepid passenger can only really walk on the road)

A few hundred meters on (the reverse side of the sign that pointed us towards the station earlier) we find the only sign that I saw indicating which way the terminal buildings actually are but we can at least walk out of the road on the dusty gravel path which is next to the road:


(The one sign indicating which way to go for the terminal)

A couple of hundred meters further we come to a junction, no signage, no pavement but thankfully there's only one way to go real as the other direction rapidly leads to a gate which I think must give access to the apron and control tower. The way we actually have to go however feels like you're wandering through the yard of a FedEx office rather than a recognised walking route to the airport terminal:


(The fork in the road, to the left a gate and the air traffic control tower (not pictured) and to the right the way we need to go through a yard full of FedEx vans and lorries)

Finally a few hundred more meters on we reach journeys end, the terminal building in site!


(The road directly outside the terminal building)

Now, there isn't actually a proper pedestrian crossing and, in reality, there is no pedestrian access. Those barriers block the road and the gate on the pavement (the first pavement we've had on this walk!) is locked with a code. But I won't hold that against the airport as presumably it would be simple for them to have the gate open for pedestrian access from the station were there any reason to do so.

In reality any passenger has to walk down the side of the car park (just to the right in the above image), then down a road marked as access for the airport hotel, swing down the side of the hotel, then through another gate which is not obviously for public use before finally being able to reach the airport terminal proper:


(The walk through the car park, to the terminal building, having had to go somewhat out of my way to actually get there)

Now, like I said above, I won't hold this detour against the airport as why provide a route for people who don't exist (passengers using the airport station to access the airport terminal). But still, even without the detour, it's an impressively desolate and unwelcoming route. Also quite a distance.

Whilst in good weather like I had it's not an unpleasant walk in anything other than a sunny day such as night or in the rain it would be a trudge and whilst I take on board those that say "it's no further than walking around some terminals in Heathrow" it really doesn't feel the same as walking from say Manchester Airport station to the terminal buildings there where you're fully under cover, there's plenty of signage and your actually in the airport, if not the right terminal, almost immediately.

I've also done that walk and it felt nothing like as off-putting as the walk from Tesside Airport station to the terminal was.

Personally, having now done the walk for myself, I can only restate what I've said before (and what Northern and their BR forbears clearly thought), the station is a waste of time and money when it comes to serving the airport. You could call every train there and no-one would use it. Close it and be done with it. The thing is not saveable seemingly physically considering the results of the FOI nor indeed is it saveable from a service point of view.

As shown from the car park and personal experience. The people who use the airport drive and either park or get dropped off. They're unlikely to trade their car which can either drop them off directly outside or park directly outside for the kilometre long walk from the station. If they don't have a car or don't have a friend with a car (and can somehow afford a train but not a taxi on top of their holiday costs) there are direct services to Manchester Airport or Newcastle Airport is accessible with either one or two changes.

This station is pointless. Let it die.

As for me? Your intrepid correspondent headed back towards Middleton St George cutting over a few fields (using footpaths!) before gaining the main road through the village, stopped off at the village shop for another bottle of water (did I mention it was warm?) and then made their way to Dinsdale station to wait for 2D38 the 1329 back towards Saltburn (in the hands of 158 816 whose aircon wasn't not working but certainly wasn't working as well as you'd like!) and what they considered a well earned rest.

 

[Trainfan2019]

Excellent visit report ainsworth74!

Interesting to see access to the station from the ramp now barricaded off. The mobile welfare unit presumably means someone is going to be or is currently working on the station?

The walk to the terminal building looks a long pedestrian unfriendly trek. The station was built with big plans for air passengers to arrive by train but didn't even have a pavement from the station!

It really does make me wonder now how the station was ever thought through and built.

 

[skyhigh]

Rail professionals are right Shock!

Not only that... someone from the airport themselves literally say "The platform is safe for the current normal passenger use (which is 1 person/year and isn’t going to increase)."

So basically Network Rail, Northern and the airport all agree the station is pointless...

 

[_toommm_]

Having heard so much about it over so many years and considering that it could fall down at any moment I thought I might finally take advantage of the bank holiday (and the nice weather!) to actually visit the station and do the walk from the station to the terminal building for myself. So I made my way to Darlington on 2D11 the 0953 arrival into Darlington (in the hands of 156 482) and, having stocked up on water from Smiths (it was hot!), made my way north out of the station before intercepting the B6279 named "Tornado Way" in honour of the locomotive of the same name. My reason for this was this road (at this point) is actually on the route of the original Stockton & Darlington Railway. The line through present day Darlington station and on to Dinsdale actually came about later. Thankfully event the road gives way to a much more pleasant and slightly more obviously an ex-railway environment with a good surface underfoot and overhanging greenery giving relief from the traffic and tarmac!

A few miles outside of Darlington the old alignment intercepts the current railway just to the east of Dinsdale station having passed through the northern parts of Middleton St George. Whilst not clear from maps there is actually a footpath which follows the current railway on it's northside between it and the A67 until a convenient foot crossing allows you to cross the railway and access the road to the airport.

As you might imagine there's very little signage for the airport station but I did find one somewhat battered sign:

View attachment 115646
(This sign has certainly seen better days but it does still at least point the way correctly!)

A few hundred meters further on and we reach our primary objective!

View attachment 115647
(A shot of the subject of this thread, Teesside Airport station, in all its, er, glory?)

It was at this point that the two gentlemen who had been following me for the last five minutes or so caught up and revealed themselves to be members of Cleveland Police (the actual police not security) who enquired what I was up to and once I explained I'd come to check out the airport station they, whilst clearly slightly bemused, gamely engaged in a brief chat about the station and indeed the airport itself before wishing me well and resuming their foot patrol of the airport and its environs.

I had considered vaulting the fence to the access ramp just to quickly put a foot on the platform proper but with the police not long departed I decided discretion was the better part of valour and did not pass the metal fence blocking the entrance to the station (which ironically looks like it has only recently been refurbished as it's in extraordinarily good nick!).

So lets say our passenger has just arrived off of 2D32 the 1203 arrival from Bishop Auckland:

View attachment 115649
(156 463 rattling through, of course in reality non-stop, on its way to Saltburn, but it looks close enough to stopped we can pretend it's actually called at the station)

They find themselves, and their suitcase, confronted with this on arrival:

View attachment 115650
(This is taken from the bottom of the access ramp, if you squint you can just make out the retreating form of the two friendly police officers that stopped for a chat)

You will notice that there are no signs pointing the way, nor indeed is there a pavement. However there is only one obvious direction to go so our intrepid passenger heads the only way they can go:

View attachment 115651
(The somewhat desolate station access road, no pavement so you have a choice of grass verge or road for yourself and your suitcase)

At the end of the road you find yourself facing a widening out area. Still no pavement, nor indeed signs, but thankfully there remains really only one direction to go in:

View attachment 115652
(The road continues with no pavement nor, indeed, grass verge meaning our intrepid passenger can only really walk on the road)

A few hundred meters on (the reverse side of the sign that pointed us towards the station earlier) we find the only sign that I saw indicating which way the terminal buildings actually are but we can at least walk out of the road on the dusty gravel path which is next to the road:

View attachment 115653
(The one sign indicating which way to go for the terminal)

A couple of hundred meters further we come to a junction, no signage, no pavement but thankfully there's only one way to go real as the other direction rapidly leads to a gate which I think must give access to the apron and control tower. The way we actually have to go however feels like you're wandering through the yard of a FedEx office rather than a recognised walking route to the airport terminal:

View attachment 115654
(The fork in the road, to the left a gate and the air traffic control tower (not pictured) and to the right the way we need to go through a yard full of FedEx vans and lorries)

Finally a few hundred more meters on we reach journeys end, the terminal building in site!

View attachment 115656
(The road directly outside the terminal building)

Now, there isn't actually a proper pedestrian crossing and, in reality, there is no pedestrian access. Those barriers block the road and the gate on the pavement (the first pavement we've had on this walk!) is locked with a code. But I won't hold that against the airport as presumably it would be simple for them to have the gate open for pedestrian access from the station were there any reason to do so.

In reality any passenger has to walk down the side of the car park (just to the right in the above image), then down a road marked as access for the airport hotel, swing down the side of the hotel, then through another gate which is not obviously for public use before finally being able to reach the airport terminal proper:

View attachment 115658
(The walk through the car park, to the terminal building, having had to go somewhat out of my way to actually get there)

Now, like I said above, I won't hold this detour against the airport as why provide a route for people who don't exist (passengers using the airport station to access the airport terminal). But still, even without the detour, it's an impressively desolate and unwelcoming route. Also quite a distance.

Whilst in good weather like I had it's not an unpleasant walk in anything other than a sunny day such as night or in the rain it would be a trudge and whilst I take on board those that say "it's no further than walking around some terminals in Heathrow" it really doesn't feel the same as walking from say Manchester Airport station to the terminal buildings there where you're fully under cover, there's plenty of signage and your actually in the airport, if not the right terminal, almost immediately.

I've also done that walk and it felt nothing like as off-putting as the walk from Tesside Airport station to the terminal was.

Personally, having now done the walk for myself, I can only restate what I've said before (and what Northern and their BR forbears clearly thought), the station is a waste of time and money when it comes to serving the airport. You could call every train there and no-one would use it. Close it and be done with it. The thing is not saveable seemingly physically considering the results of the FOI nor indeed is it saveable from a service point of view.

As shown from the car park and personal experience. The people who use the airport drive and either park or get dropped off. They're unlikely to trade their car which can either drop them off directly outside or park directly outside for the kilometre long walk from the station. If they don't have a car or don't have a friend with a car (and can somehow afford a train but not a taxi on top of their holiday costs) there are direct services to Manchester Airport or Newcastle Airport is accessible with either one or two changes.

This station is pointless. Let it die.

As for me? Your intrepid correspondent headed back towards Middleton St George cutting over a few fields (using footpaths!) before gaining the main road through the village, stopped off at the village shop for another bottle of water (did I mention it was warm?) and then made their way to Dinsdale station to wait for 2D38 the 1329 back towards Saltburn (in the hands of 158 816 whose aircon wasn't not working but certainly wasn't working as well as you'd like!) and what they considered a well earned rest.

It very much feels like somewhere you shouldn’t be, similar to Stanlow and Thornton when that was open. I’m glad the police took an interest in what you were doing though, even if they maybe didn’t fully understand the hobby

 

[flitwickbeds]

Not only that... someone from the airport themselves literally say "The platform is safe for the current normal passenger use (which is 1 person/year and isn’t going to increase)."

So basically Network Rail, Northern and the airport all agree the station is pointless...

So go through the process and close the flipping thing. Who is going to legitimately protest during the closure process?

 

[skyhigh]

So go through the process and close the flipping thing. Who is going to legitimately protest during the closure process?

From looking at the documents I suspect the Airport is the sticking point - it's their station so I guess they will have to pay for the closure process if they choose they don't want to repair it. So to retain the station or close it they need to pay up, and they seem reluctant.

It appears they are considering 3 options -
1) Fully repair both platforms and overbridge
2) Demolish the unused platform and overbridge, repair the other platform
3) Demolish the whole station

I imagine the cheapest option will win out.