Clegg to go?

[Masbroughlad]

Lib dems calling for Clegg to go....

You reap what you sow?

 

[deltic]

Clegg did what he had to do at the time of the last general election and perhaps his greatest achievement has been to achieve the tax free allowance of £10k.

Interestingly Lord Ashcroft's polling shows that at present 35% want a Lab govt, 25% a Tory one and 22% a coalition which includes the Lib Dems.

 

[DarloRich]

oh i do hope so!

Sell out.

 

[Masbroughlad]

oh i do hope so!

Sell out.

Could not agree more.

 

[Saint66]

Is there a real stand out replacement for him in the Lib Dems though?

 

[DarloRich]

Is there a real stand out replacement for him in the Lib Dems though?

no - but there will be so few of them after the next election that it may be almost academic!

 

[Saint66]

no - but there will be so few of them after the next election that it may be almost academic!

Presumably though, any push for leadership change will occur before the General Election.

Could they look to push a surprise candidate in? Give the party some fresh blood?

 

[CallySleeper]

Presumably though, any push for leadership change will occur before the General Election.

Could they look to push a surprise candidate in? Give the party some fresh blood?

Absolutely, and I can exclusively reveal who will be announced in the running for the leadership

(sorry for the derailment!)

 

[meridian2]

Lib dems calling for Clegg to go....

You reap what you sow?

No more than any other politician.

Lord Ashdown is right. Any change of leadership now is just panicky and silly, and as this has just happened on the back of the Lib Dems' worst defeat in the European elections, such calls are just happenstance.

 

[DarloRich]

Presumably though, any push for leadership change will occur before the General Election.

Could they look to push a surprise candidate in? Give the party some fresh blood?

It will make no difference. They will be wiped out. They will bear the brunt of an unhappy electorate, many of whom blame them for the the policies of the coalition and perhaps more importantly the effects of those coalition policies!

 

[Masbroughlad]

Arrogant or deluded? Lib-dem supporters in 2010 wanted a Lib-dem government not a Tory one. Unless they go back to their promises and stand by them, Lib-dems will disappear under Clegg.

National interest nonsense. Power and glory more like.

Difficult times ahead....

 

[imagination]

Kind of ironic that all the Clegg-mania stemmed from Clegg calling for an end to politics controlled by two parties and increased cooperation between the political parties. Yet as soon as he actually does these things he gets hated for it.
History will remember the decision to enter in the coalition as one of the best and most selfless decisions of any political party of our era. It's a shame that the present looks so badly on it.

As for a leadership change, I can't see it happening before the general election. It would be just downright suicidal, both for the country and for the party. There's noone in any significant position within the party calling for it either. Of course, after the general election it's largely dependent on who still holds their seats. Right now the only seats the lib dems look certain to hold after the election from the recent results are Orkney and Shetland (Alistair Carmichael), Westmorland and Lonsdale (Tim Farron), and Carshalton and Wallington (Tom Brake) - to which you might be able to add Eastleigh (the local elections there showing that the UKIP surge last year was just one of those by-election freak incidents). Obviously there will be a lot more of them than that, but those are the only individuals whose seats are looking comfortably safe.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

They need to concentrate on winning back voters who've defected to Labour and the Greens. A leadership change at this point, a year before a General Election will send the party into a spin of decline it would struggle to get out of.

My great uncle was instrumental in forming the SDP, so it would be a great disappointment to me personally if the Liberal Democrats were condemned to the fourth party.

 

[TheJRB]

There's not a chance in hell of Clegg going before the election. Most Lib Dem MPs are standing behind him and indeed it is perhaps the only way the coalition will last its full term (which I fully believe it will). I think it's been said that of the circa 600 people who signed the letter asking for Clegg's resignation, even some of them were not party members!

Because it's such a rarity, people still struggle with the concept of coalition politics. That is to say that people read what they want in to events. For example, Lib Dems going back on their word about tuition fees is "selling out" and the Conservatives being unable to get an EU referendum in this government is "being weak". No! It means compromise because nobody won the election and you've got to make do with what you've got (and goodness, doesn't this coalition deserve some credit for making our economy the fastest growing in the west today?!).

Now as for the Lib Dems being wiped out next year, I very much doubt that that will be the case completely. Indeed, First-Past-The-Post, the very electoral system they were battling against, could be the very deciding factor in them keeping an at all decent number of seats and UKIP seeing very little gain.

 

[Greenback]

The general election next year will be completely different to the European elections. There has just been a massive protest vote against the three main parties. Will it continue? Who knows, but I doubt that people will vote in the same way when it comes to who will govern for the next five years.

Clegg has got the Lib Dems into this mess, and he should and will be given the chance to get them back out of it.

 

[ainsworth74]

The general election next year will be completely different to the European elections. There has just been a massive protest vote against the three main parties. Will it continue? Who knows, but I doubt that people will vote in the same way when it comes to who will govern for the next five years.

I definitely think it's going to be very very interesting for sure. More so in may ways than 2010 was!

My money remains on a mirror of 2010 this time with Labour being the largest party in Parliament but being about 20 seats short of a majority and therefore having to either try and run a minority government or form another coalition with someone...

I also think there's an outside chance of UKIP gaining a seat but I believe First Past the Post will probably ensure that this doesn't happen. I expect that UKIP will probably do reasonably well on the popular vote but will not be able to win out at the constituency level.

 

[NorthernSpirit]

In my own view Clegg is too delusional, he won't resign until the last Lib Dem MP loses their deposit. If Labour got in, whether as a minoity or as a coalition, expect this country being ruined all the more as Milliband will not allow us a referendum, Labour wants in the EU they are a dangerous party who have brought this nation close to being a dictatorship. Never again.

 

[ainsworth74]

Just a small amount of hyperbole there... I didn't particularly like the previous administration and thought they had some worrying autocratic tendencies (not that the current lot don't but they don't seem as bad at least to me) but it seems a rather significant stretch to suggest we came close to a dictatorship. And it isn't as if the Conservatives would take us out of Europe their whole bit is to offer and then win a referendum on staying in the EU.

 

[deltic]

In my own view Clegg is too delusional, he won't resign until the last Lib Dem MP loses their deposit. If Labour got in, whether as a minoity or as a coalition, expect this country being ruined all the more as Milliband will not allow us a referendum, Labour wants in the EU they are a dangerous party who have brought this nation close to being a dictatorship. Never again.

In what way is Clegg delusional?

The present polls seem to suggest people will vote to remain in the EU - not sure what real difference people will see if we voted to leave the EU, unless they expect the Government to then kick out all EU citizens who are presently resident here.

Most UKIP voters seem to support very traditional views which dont neatly fit simple political right or left labels - eg opposed to gay marriage and against rail privatisation - ie they dont like changes that have occurred after they have reached middle age and seem to have a rosy tinted view of life in the good old days.

The world continues to change whether we like it or not and no-one has ever succeeded in turning back the clock.

 

[meridian2]

In my own view Clegg is too delusional, he won't resign until the last Lib Dem MP loses their deposit. If Labour got in, whether as a minoity or as a coalition, expect this country being ruined all the more as Milliband will not allow us a referendum, Labour wants in the EU they are a dangerous party who have brought this nation close to being a dictatorship. Never again.

Is that description of him based on the tuition fees fiasco, the only bona fide blooper the Lib Dems have made these past 5 years?
Nick Clegg did not promise any raise or lowering of tuition fees. He merely said that if he got into office, he would 'freeze' the tuition fee rates, which, in government-speak, meant he would 'slow down' the rate at which the fees were increasing. And guess what? He was true to his word, but burnt left right and centre by people who thought it was nothing other than tokenism to get into the Coalition.

 

[TheKnightWho]

Is that description of him based on the tuition fees fiasco, the only bona fide blooper the Lib Dems have made these past 5 years?
Nick Clegg did not promise any raise or lowering of tuition fees. He merely said that if he got into office, he would 'freeze' the tuition fee rates, which, in government-speak, meant he would 'slow down' the rate at which the fees were increasing. And guess what? He was true to his word, but burnt left right and centre by people who thought it was nothing other than tokenism to get into the Coalition.

This. The Liberal Democrats never stood a chance - the Tories were always going to throw them in front of a bus.

They should've forced them to form a minority government, really.

 

[WelshBluebird]

The problem Clegg (and the Lib Dems) have is that they stood for election on a Centre-Left platform but ended up in government on a Centre-Right platform.

I doubt there would have been as much anger and disapointment from Lib Dem voters if they ended up in coalition with Labour as those parties are much closer to each other.

The issue is not coalition, it is who you are in coalition with.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

News is out regarding the resignation of the Lib-Dem Lord Oakeshott after it came to light that he had used his personal money to fund polls in areas of leading Lib Dem poilticians aimed at undermining the position of the incumbent Lib Dem Members of Parliament, Nick Clegg being one of these.

 

[deltic]

The problem Clegg (and the Lib Dems) have is that they stood for election on a Centre-Left platform but ended up in government on a Centre-Right platform.

I doubt there would have been as much anger and disapointment from Lib Dem voters if they ended up in coalition with Labour as those parties are much closer to each other.

The issue is not coalition, it is who you are in coalition with.

Very true - although there are a number of councils with have had Tory/Lib Dem coalitions or at least working arrangements.

 

[Oswyntail]

....The issue is not coalition, it is who you are in coalition with.

The real problem is that each party is itself a coalition. So, whereas there is actually general agreement on most issues and how they should be dealt with amongst the majority of MPs, the remoter fringes of each party wouldn't be seen dead with any of the others. So the leadership, who tend to come from the "consensus", nevertheless have to make some moves to appease the noisy, naughty boy factions.
Occasionally, you get a leader from the fringes. I suspect Miliband is just such, though he pretends he can "talk human". Whether Labour under his leadership would be acceptable coalition partners for anyone remains to be seen

 

[Searle]

I'm aware (from this thread), that nearly everyone is completely against the lib dems. I'm currently living with someone who's in the Liberal Youth Wales and is a very active Lib Dem. If anyone fancies reading his new blog, it might give you an insight to what his thoughts are about things (especially the Oakeshott stuff). You can find it here

 

[swj99]

...the Tories were always going to throw them in front of a bus.

They should've forced them to form a minority government, really.

Have to agree there. I think it will take many years for the lib dems to recover from the fact that a lot of people blame them for making it possible for the conservatives to push through so many unpopular and some might say, destructive policies.

 

[DownSouth]

The general election next year will be completely different to the European elections. There has just been a massive protest vote against the three main parties. Will it continue? Who knows, but I doubt that people will vote in the same way when it comes to who will govern for the next five years.

The dynamics of protest votes are a little hard to fully understand because there's rarely any consistency between what causes them and who benefits from them.

One significant possibility to consider is that the motivation to make a protest vote will peter out now that people have had a chance to vent their rage at the major parties in this round of council/EU elections.
This is something which can be readily observed in Australia - state elections run on different schedules and are often subject to bizarre influences which reflect the satisfaction of people with the various parties' performance in the more prominent arena of Federal politics, and occasionally it goes the other way as well. Labor, for example, managed to scrape in with a minority government in South Australia earlier this year despite deserving to lose power in a massive landslide for demonstrating near-complete incompetence for the previous two terms - but the swing to the Liberal Party (note that "Liberal" has different meanings in every English-speaking country) was hindered by people treating it as a referendum on the Liberals' performance in Canberra - it was so bad that the local leader asked the PM to stay away and not come to SA to "support" (i.e. ruin) the campaign.

News is out regarding the resignation of the Lib-Dem Lord Oakeshott after it came to light that he had used his personal money to fund polls in areas of leading Lib Dem poilticians aimed at undermining the position of the incumbent Lib Dem Members of Parliament, Nick Clegg being one of these.

I can't see this news making much difference, it's likely to elicit equal parts antipathy ("even his own party can't get behind him!") and sympathy ("poor guy getting stabbed in the back") for Nick Clegg from the general population.

 

[Butts]

I think a lot of people have forgotten that although the LD's entered a Coalition with The Conservatives, the actual number of seats they won in 2010 was lower than at the previous General Election.

 

[PermitToTravel]

I also think there's an outside chance of UKIP gaining a seat but I believe First Past the Post will probably ensure that this doesn't happen. I expect that UKIP will probably do reasonably well on the popular vote but will not be able to win out at the constituency level.

I'm almost certain the AV referendum would have gone a different way had it happened this year, following UKIP becoming popular.