Class 86s in Pairs

[captainbigun]

Good point with regard the 86/3s, but the locos that became the 86/2s were not fitted with Flexicoil suspension from new: There is plenty of photographic evidence that no class 86s were fitted with Flexicoil suspension before the testbed E3173.

Correct. Bogie variants are actually quite different between the 0/3/4/6 and the /2s.

 

[richieb1971]

I thought the title said class 86's in Paris

 

[Bungle965]

I thought the title said class 86's in Paris

I have to say you were not alone on that.
Sam

 

[Highland37]

86501 was re-geared to give a traction curve which would allow it to cover the same load as a 90.

501 is now being returned to an 86/6.

Out of interest, why? I would have thought it was more useful and less expensive to operate a train with only one 86 and not two.

 

[SPADTrap]

Out of interest, why? I would have thought it was more useful and less expensive to operate a train with only one 86 and not two.

Individual maintenence cost at a guess?

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Individual maintenence cost at a guess?

I think someone posted recently that it needs some unique spare parts as a /5 that it wouldn't as a /6 and that's expensive.

 

[captainbigun]

I think someone posted recently that it needs some unique spare parts as a /5 that it wouldn't as a /6 and that's expensive.

Indeed. Unique gearing so traction motors and wheelsets are specific to the loco. The revised gearing pushes the traction motors hard, right on the limit, and that has meant a fair few lost to the cause.

 

[rebmcr]

A piece of kit in the 86/87s converted the 8 bit TE demand to current demand and through a feedback mechanism with actual current being monitored and an upper limit notched the tap changer to give a current matched to the demand. That piece of kit was called the tractive effort translator, TET.

Thanks! Was there ever any suggestion of using a TET in a 'simplified' control desk? Or were any other locos/units/prototypes built with tap changers 'hidden' behind TETs (other than through multiple working wiring)?

 

[captainbigun]

In short, no and no.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Way back in the 1980s, pairs of electrics (including 87+87) were used on WCML freightliner (intermodal) services over the steep northern bits. Also pairs on other freights, including a steel coils service from Ravenscraig.

I remember them well. I do have some photos somewhere too.
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Good point with regard the 86/3s, but the locos that became the 86/2s were not fitted with Flexicoil suspension from new: There is plenty of photographic evidence that no class 86s were fitted with Flexicoil suspension before the testbed E3173.

Correct - I remember it happening and thinking - damn now I will have to re-photograph them all with the new numbers.

 

[edwin_m]

Good point with regard the 86/3s, but the locos that became the 86/2s were not fitted with Flexicoil suspension from new: There is plenty of photographic evidence that no class 86s were fitted with Flexicoil suspension before the testbed E3173.

Correct. Classes 81-85 were built with various types of flexible drive but for class 86 the decision was taken to go with nose-suspended traction motors, where the motor is geared directly to the axle and approximately half its weight is unsprung. After seeing the amount of damage being done to the track, class 86/2 was retrofitted with Flexicoils and attempts were made to keep the other sub-classes off express passenger duties. Class 87 had Flexicoils from new, and I seem to recall some other 86s were fitted with resilient wheels.

 

[furnessvale]

Correct. Classes 81-85 were built with various types of flexible drive but for class 86 the decision was taken to go with nose-suspended traction motors, where the motor is geared directly to the axle and approximately half its weight is unsprung. After seeing the amount of damage being done to the track, class 86/2 was retrofitted with Flexicoils and attempts were made to keep the other sub-classes off express passenger duties. Class 87 had Flexicoils from new, and I seem to recall some other 86s were fitted with resilient wheels.

As an example of the damage high speed locos with axle hung motors could do.

We relayed Euxton Jcn with built up crossings (before the days of regular cast crossings) one weekend.

Knowing the damage these locos could do, we scheduled welders THE NEXT WEEKEND to build up the noses!

 

[455driver]

Correct. Classes 81-85 were built with various types of flexible drive but for class 86 the decision was taken to go with nose-suspended traction motors, where the motor is geared directly to the axle and approximately half its weight is unsprung. After seeing the amount of damage being done to the track, class 86/2 was retrofitted with Flexicoils and attempts were made to keep the other sub-classes off express passenger duties. Class 87 had Flexicoils from new, and I seem to recall some other 86s were fitted with resilient wheels.

Weren't the 86/2s fitted with resilient wheels at the same time as the flexicoil suspension was fitted?

Later some 86/0s were fitted with resilient wheels and renumbered as 86/3s.

Some/all the 86/0s and 86/3s were then fitted with the flexicoil suspension and renumbered as 86/4s.