Class 707 - SWT: Introduction into service

[spark001uk]

As far as I'm aware the only platforms out of commission since the works are 23&24 but it's rare to see 21&22 in use as that requires extra staff.

Actually looking thru rtt looks like 22 has been used a few times today.

 

[Goldfish62]

Actually looking thru rtt looks like 22 has been used a few times today.

Yes, 20 is in daily use, while 21 and 22 are available on a contingency basis. All access is via P19.

 

[Class455]

That is a booked diagram now.

5H07 0458 Wimbledon Park Depot Sidings Teddington 0537
2H08 0544 Teddington London Waterloo 0620
2K05 0627 London Waterloo London Waterloo 0746
2O13 0803 London Waterloo London Waterloo 0920
2K17 0927 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1046
2O25 1103 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1219
2K29 1227 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1346
2O37 1403 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1519
2K41 1527 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1649
2O49 1701 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1818
2K53 1827 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1946
2O61 2003 London Waterloo London Waterloo 2119
2K65 2127 London Waterloo London Waterloo 2246
2O73 2303 London Waterloo London Waterloo 0022
2K77 0042 London Waterloo Strawberry Hill 0128
5K77 0138 Strawberry Hill Strawberry Hill C.S.D. 0142

Being worked by 707 025 and 707 012 today, had it on 2K17.

It was a nice change from the regular 8 car 455, there was quite a lot more space, and being a semi-regular 700 user it was pretty much the same as a 700. However the 707 I was on (025) had various faults with the PIS, saying it was going to Strawberry Hill only at times. Also the voice of the announcement sounds absolutely terrible, way too robotic and sometimes out of tone. Hope these are changed soon.

Are the 707’s supposed to display live tube statuses and the Train Loading Indicator or is it just the 700’s?

 

[SWT_USER]

Being worked by 707 025 and 707 012 today, had it on 2K17.

It was a nice change from the regular 8 car 455, there was quite a lot more space, and being a semi-regular 700 user it was pretty much the same as a 700. However the 707 I was on (025) had various faults with the PIS, saying it was going to Strawberry Hill only at times. Also the voice of the announcement sounds absolutely terrible, way too robotic and sometimes out of tone. Hope these are changed soon.

Are the 707’s supposed to display live tube statuses and the Train Loading Indicator or is it just the 700’s?

They do display this information.

 

[Class455]

They do display this information.

My unit never showed this for some reason

 

[SWT_USER]

My unit never showed this for some reason

Possibly teething troubles then - I've also been on a few where the display hasn't worked correctly but this morning all was working as it should have been (about the only thing on SWR that has been the past couple of days!)

 

[spark001uk]

From what I've heard it's mostly down to the operator telling the PIS what to do, they are a new beast to tackle and there's a bit of a learning curve attached to them apparently.

(That's not to say they don't malfunction though)

 

[SevenEightNine]

My unit never showed this for some reason

That might be because there isn't sufficient time between stations to scroll through all the information. I think it generally repeats the stations it will call at 2 or 3 times before getting to the service updates and carriage loadings.
I agree that they probably should tweak that slightly.

 

[Malcolmffc]

Saw a 707 in P2 at Waterloo this morning. Not sure what it was doing there!

 

[spark001uk]

Saw a 707 in P2 at Waterloo this morning. Not sure what it was doing there!

Probably a clockwise Kingston rounder, they usually go from that end.
As mentioned above, the 0927 rounder was 707.

 

[TEW]

Eventually there will be 3 707 diagrams which visit the Mainline side at Waterloo, I'll list them but they come with the warning that they may not all be running yet, as the full fleet of 707s is not yet in service.

5H07 0458 Wimbledon Park Depot Sidings Teddington 0537
2H08 0544 Teddington London Waterloo 0620
2K05 0627 London Waterloo London Waterloo 0746
2O13 0803 London Waterloo London Waterloo 0920
2K17 0927 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1046
2O25 1103 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1219
2K29 1227 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1346
2O37 1403 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1519
2K41 1527 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1649
2O49 1701 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1818
2K53 1827 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1946
2O61 2003 London Waterloo London Waterloo 2119
2K65 2127 London Waterloo London Waterloo 2246
2O73 2303 London Waterloo London Waterloo 0022
2K77 0042 London Waterloo Strawberry Hill 0128
5K77 0138 Strawberry Hill Strawberry Hill C.S.D. 0142

5S09 0522 Wimbledon Park Depot Sidings Staines 0632
2S10 0633 Staines London Waterloo 0726
5O93 0737 London Waterloo Clapham Junction 0748
2O94 0754 Clapham Junction London Waterloo 0855
2J17 0906 London Waterloo Hampton Court 0942
2J24 0954 Hampton Court London Waterloo 1031
2D23 1039 London Waterloo Guildford 1150
2G34 1207 Guildford London Waterloo 1307
2M33 1317 London Waterloo Chessington South 1351
2M40 1408 Chessington South London Waterloo 1446
1D39 1454 London Waterloo Dorking 1541
1D48 1604 Dorking London Waterloo 1655
2J49 1706 London Waterloo Hampton Court 1742
2J56 1754 Hampton Court London Waterloo 1830
2D55 1839 London Waterloo Guildford 1951
2G66 2007 Guildford London Waterloo 2107
2M65 2117 London Waterloo Chessington South 2151
5Y75 2158 Chessington South Wimbledon Park Depot Sidings 2225

5K02 0544 Waterloo South Sidings London Waterloo 0546
5K03 0600 London Waterloo Wimbledon 0611
2K03 0613 Wimbledon London Waterloo 0716
2O11 0733 London Waterloo London Waterloo 0849
2K15 0857 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1016
2O23 1033 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1149
2K27 1157 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1316
2O35 1333 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1449
2K39 1457 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1619
2O47 1631 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1749
2D93 1801 London Waterloo Epsom 1836
5D56 1846 Epsom London Waterloo 1916
1D57 1924 London Waterloo Dorking 2012
1D66 2034 Dorking London Waterloo 2125
1J67 2136 London Waterloo Hampton Court 2212
1J74 2224 Hampton Court Surbiton 2232
2J69 2239 Surbiton Hampton Court 2246
2J76 2254 Hampton Court London Waterloo 2331
5Y49 2350 London Waterloo Clapham Yard Sidings 0017

 

[Class455]

Eventually there will be 3 707 diagrams which visit the Mainline side at Waterloo, I'll list them but they come with the warning that they may not all be running yet, as the full fleet of 707s is not yet in service.


5K02 0544 Waterloo South Sidings London Waterloo 0546
5K03 0600 London Waterloo Wimbledon 0611
2K03 0613 Wimbledon London Waterloo 0716
2O11 0733 London Waterloo London Waterloo 0849
2K15 0857 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1016
2O23 1033 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1149
2K27 1157 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1316
2O35 1333 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1449
2K39 1457 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1619
2O47 1631 London Waterloo London Waterloo 1749
2D93 1801 London Waterloo Epsom 1836
5D56 1846 Epsom London Waterloo 1916
1D57 1924 London Waterloo Dorking 2012
1D66 2034 Dorking London Waterloo 2125
1J67 2136 London Waterloo Hampton Court 2212
1J74 2224 Hampton Court Surbiton 2232
2J69 2239 Surbiton Hampton Court 2246
2J76 2254 Hampton Court London Waterloo 2331
5Y49 2350 London Waterloo Clapham Yard Sidings 0017

This diagram was run by 2 Class 455/7's today. But good to see my Monday train home being converted to a 707, at least I get one 707 a week!

 

[Goldfish62]

Given that there are not nearly enough 707s for all Windsor / Hounslow / Weybridge services even without some being used on main line diagrams, what will the final mix be on the Windsor side? Will some 450 diagrams remain on the Reading line?

 

[D235 Apapa]

Given that there are not nearly enough 707s for all Windsor / Hounslow / Weybridge services even without some being used on main line diagrams, what will the final mix be on the Windsor side? Will some 450 diagrams remain on the Reading line?

You've spotted that! Assuming the plan has not changed as such, since original plan was put together, the Reading road will still have 3 sets of 8 450, and the one 707 on that newish service in the evening. The Weybridges will still see a few 450's (Basingstoke crews need to retain that route for diversions, but hav'nt been trained on 458/707 - no need for the day to day plan), other Windsor and main suburban routes will see a mix of types, not always ideal, but that was how the original plan was specified from on high. The main suburban will still have a number of 8 car (455) services as well.
Stabling capacity also has a bearing on some of this in a round about way. Will be interesting to see how SWR deal with this in their all 10 car scenario?

 

[Goldfish62]

You've spotted that! Assuming the plan has not changed as such, since original plan was put together, the Reading road will still have 3 sets of 8 450, and the one 707 on that newish service in the evening. The Weybridges will still see a few 450's (Basingstoke crews need to retain that route for diversions, but hav'nt been trained on 458/707 - no need for the day to day plan), other Windsor and main suburban routes will see a mix of types, not always ideal, but that was how the original plan was specified from on high. The main suburban will still have a number of 8 car (455) services as well.
Stabling capacity also has a bearing on some of this in a round about way. Will be interesting to see how SWR deal with this in their all 10 car scenario?

Thanks for the info! As far as I can see there are currently three sets of 450 diagrams on the Reading line so maybe that's already the final picture for that line. For the next few years anyway...

 

[D235 Apapa]

Thanks for the info! As far as I can see there are currently three sets of 450 diagrams on the Reading line so maybe that's already the final picture for that line. For the next few years anyway...

The 450 scenario was a necessity for December 2017, due to not enough stock overall. I don't know, but would assume the forthcoming SWR December 2018 revamp, will change the entire stock situation in the suburban area, including the Reading road. I would guess there'll be plenty of work for the 450's, given there are new peak time main line trains being proposed?

 

[Goldfish62]

The 450 scenario was a necessity for December 2017, due to not enough stock overall. I don't know, but would assume the forthcoming SWR December 2018 revamp, will change the entire stock situation in the suburban area, including the Reading road. I would guess there'll be plenty of work for the 450's, given there are new peak time main line trains being proposed?

Ah yes, how could I forget the Dec 18 timetable! Windsor lines requirements will also increase due to the doubled Windsor service levels.

 

[TEW]

I would have thought that some of the 450s freed up from the introduction of 442s over the next year will be used on the Windsor Lines to allow the increase in frequencies to Reading and Windsor. Reading already runs at 4tph in the peak of course, so it should mainly just be a case of using some of the stock that currently stables Off Peak all day. Splitting the Waterloo-Weybridge via Hounslow service may free up a few units too.

 

[spark001uk]

Also they're on about increasing the Weybridges to 3 an hour too?

 

[Class455]

Currently onboard 458 504 on 2K29 instead of a 707. I think this is the first time a 458/5 has been on the Kingston loop in ages.

 

[swt_passenger]

Also they're on about increasing the Weybridges to 3 an hour too?

Where is that proposal coming from?
The consultation only describes the off-peak Weybridge to Virginia Water shuttle as 2 tph, is 3 tph a peak service perhaps?
(I'm assuming you are on about the shuttle from Virgina Water, if this is about another Weybridge service then please ignore.)

 

[spark001uk]

Where is that proposal coming from?
The consultation only describes the off-peak Weybridge to Virginia Water shuttle as 2 tph, is 3 tph a peak service perhaps?
(I'm assuming you are on about the shuttle from Virgina Water, if this is about another Weybridge service then please ignore.)

I can't remember exactly, I think it may have come from an initial proposal rather than the consultation, I may have misread it or maybe it's one of the things they decided not to do, or it could be as you say peak time. Just as well really, as I rarely see a busy train on the branch apart from the schooltime ones, and I travel at all times, so more trains here would've been pretty pointless anyway.

 

[D235 Apapa]

I can't remember exactly, I think it may have come from an initial proposal rather than the consultation, I may have misread it or maybe it's one of the things they decided not to do, or it could be as you say peak time. Just as well really, as I rarely see a busy train on the branch apart from the schooltime ones, and I travel at all times, so more trains here would've been pretty pointless anyway.

Some of what you say could be the issue with SWR's revised proposals for this route, in that it is at its busiest in the peaks with both commuters in the Hounslow loop area towards Chertsey, and school traffic. On the latter note, would people feel happy for example, if their daughters, having had a late lesson, were then put in a position where they had to change trains, and hang around at certain stations awaiting a connection to get home? When I were a lad, things were different. In todays world, well, it doesn't bare thinking about with some of the undesirables hanging around.

 

[spark001uk]

Some of what you say could be the issue with SWR's revised proposals for this route, in that it is at its busiest in the peaks with both commuters in the Hounslow loop area towards Chertsey, and school traffic. On the latter note, would people feel happy for example, if their daughters, having had a late lesson, were then put in a position where they had to change trains, and hang around at certain stations awaiting a connection to get home? When I were a lad, things were different. In todays world, well, it doesn't bare thinking about with some of the undesirables hanging around.

Sons as well I don't doubt, with some of the sick individuals of this day and age.
Perhaps such parents would prefer to arrange them road transport in these cases.
At least the car wouldn't get cancelled due to a track circuit failure.

 

[GW43125]

Sons as well I don't doubt, with some of the sick individuals of this day and age.
Perhaps such parents would prefer to arrange them road transport in these cases.
At least the car wouldn't get cancelled due to a track circuit failure.

I had to get home from Chertsey in the carnage on Monday. Trains weren't being flagged as cancelled at all, just nothing was running. I got to the station at 1:25 (for the 1:40 which I knew was running as the stock went down) and top of the board, the 11:40 was showing as delayed. Also the platforms at Virginia Water are not a nice place to be on a cold, dark, wet evening. This point was raised strongly at the Egham consultation.

 

[spark001uk]

I had to get home from Chertsey in the carnage on Monday. Trains weren't being flagged as cancelled at all, just nothing was running. I got to the station at 1:25 (for the 1:40 which I knew was running as the stock went down) and top of the board, the 11:40 was showing as delayed. Also the platforms at Virginia Water are not a nice place to be on a cold, dark, wet evening. This point was raised strongly at the Egham consultation.

The shambles carried on throughout Monday right into the night. The late Woking down (1S75), worked by a pair of 707s incidentally, ran 45 mins late from the start, then it got stuck between Chertsey and Addlestone for a further 37 mins! Not sure of that issue, signal failure possibly. On top of that (and possibly because of it), the following one (the last down, 2S77) got canned at Staines. Taxis down the branch I bet. Glad I didn't go up town Monday now!

 

[AverageTD]

Is there a link anywhere that displays all the current 707 diagrams because all the different ones on different routes makes it hard to know when and where the trains can be found?
On second look the 08:57 from Waterloo to Kingston to Richmond to Waterloo seems good to aim for but I don’t know when the 707s will start to operate it

 

[Class455]

Is there a link anywhere that displays all the current 707 diagrams because all the different ones on different routes makes it hard to know when and where the trains can be found?
On second look the 08:57 from Waterloo to Kingston to Richmond to Waterloo seems good to aim for but I don’t know when the 707s will start to operate it

I'd make January a safe bet. I had a 707 on Tuesday but today on the same diagram I had 2 458's instead of the 707. I think January is when all of them will be in service.

Which units have yet to enter traffic?

 

[TEW]

Is there a link anywhere that displays all the current 707 diagrams because all the different ones on different routes makes it hard to know when and where the trains can be found?
On second look the 08:57 from Waterloo to Kingston to Richmond to Waterloo seems good to aim for but I don’t know when the 707s will start to operate it

I have all the diagrams, but I am not sure which ones are operating at the moment. With all the disruption it has been very hard to work it out too.

 

[D235 Apapa]

Is there a link anywhere that displays all the current 707 diagrams because all the different ones on different routes makes it hard to know when and where the trains can be found?
On second look the 08:57 from Waterloo to Kingston to Richmond to Waterloo seems good to aim for but I don’t know when the 707s will start to operate it

As said before, the plan MAY have changed since its inception, but there may be a slight hic-up with the last few diagrams, in that 2 sets need to exit Wimbledon depot in timetable slots already occupied by 455's. This was all taken account off, in that the said 455's were out stabled elsewhere from that point onwards, but that required certain new stabling, which to my knowledge has not as yet been provided at the location originally intended. Obviously an alternative solution may have since been found? Someone did mention a while back about the 0720 Waterloo-Woking/0817 Woking-Waterloo reverting to 455: it should be about this time that this happens.