Class 70 and 90 doubleheader

[Topgun333]

Yesterday, when leaving Trafford Park the 4L86 intermodal to Felixstowe was headed up by 70005 and 90044.

Any idea why a 70 and a 90 would be in a consist?

 

[507 001]

Probably just moving the 90 to wherever it's needed next. Easier and cheaper to move it in a train than pay for a path.
Either that or it failed.

 

[BestWestern]

We're assuming the 70 was on the front and not being rescued by the 90 having toasted itself...

Sorry, somebody had to say it

 

[Eng274]

Probably one for its own thread, but I've seen car transporter freights through Carluke (presumably for Mossend), double headed by a 92 and 66, couldn't tell if 66 was powering or not. Could be a loco move for the same reason.

 

[jopsuk]

I would have thought it very unlikely that an electric and diesel would both be operational in one train- I'm pretty sure that none of the electrics in the UKL have multiple working controls compatible with any of the diesels. I think I'm right in thinking that Class 59, 66, 67, 68(?) & 70 all are fitted with AAR Multiple working? Class 90 uses a TDM system, not sure what system the 92s have?

 

[507 001]

Yes, can we please stop using the term double header? The correct phrase would be, I believe, dead in tow (DiT)

*in this instance anyway

 

[DXMachina]

I would have thought it very unlikely that an electric and diesel would both be operational in one train- I'm pretty sure that none of the electrics in the UKL have multiple working controls compatible with any of the diesels. I think I'm right in thinking that Class 59, 66, 67, 68(?) & 70 all are fitted with AAR Multiple working? Class 90 uses a TDM system, not sure what system the 92s have?

Given that its not unknown to see a Cl.47 top-and-tailing with a kettle on tourist trips, is it generally allowable for 2 non-compatible locomotives to double a train if both have drivers acting in unison?

 

[455driver]

Given that its not unknown to see a Cl.47 top-and-tailing with a kettle on tourist trips, is it generally allowable for 2 non-compatible locomotives to double a train if both have drivers acting in unison?

Top and tailing means the train has one or more locos on the front (the top) and another loco on the back (the tail) both with their own drivers and both under power.

If you mean 2 non compatible locos on the front then that is in tandem, both locos will have their own driver and both would be under power.

 

[jopsuk]

as far as I understand, on most steam charters the diesel on the rear will not be providing power (though may be providing electric train supply to the carriages)- it is there for when the the train needs to reverse or for rescue? Occasionally used for banking with communication?

 

[Beveridges]

The 90 should have been leading with the 70 DIT if Freightliner cared about being environmentally friendly

 

[BurtonM]

Who'd be driving the 90, then? It won't be Freightliner...

 

[455driver]

The 90 should have been leading with the 70 DIT if Freightliner cared about being environmentally friendly

What if the 90 is broken?
What if the driver doesnt sign 90s?
What if the 70 has to be detached en route, it is quicker to put it on the front as the shunting is quicker and easier!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Who'd be driving the 90, then? It won't be Freightliner...

Why not?
Freightliner have ten 90s of their own!

 

[DJH1971]

I would have thought it very unlikely that an electric and diesel would both be operational in one train- I'm pretty sure that none of the electrics in the UKL have multiple working controls compatible with any of the diesels. I think I'm right in thinking that Class 59, 66, 67, 68(?) & 70 all are fitted with AAR Multiple working? Class 90 uses a TDM system, not sure what system the 92s have?

Class 92's also use TDM.

 

[GB]

Top and tailing means the train has one or more locos on the front (the top) and another loco on the back (the tail) both with their own drivers and both under power.

The rear loco doesn't have to be manned or even running to be classed as top and tailed.

 

[RichmondCommu]

The 90 should have been leading with the 70 DIT if Freightliner cared about being environmentally friendly

Assuming that the train ran via the NLL then yes I would agree with you.

 

[GB]

Assuming that the train ran via the NLL then yes I would agree with you.

Even after the points raised by 455driver?

 

[Joseph.bevan96]

If the train was 4L86 Trafford Park FLT- Felixstowe North FLT, then at Trafford Park, I'd expect the 90 was atop the 70? If this was the case it should have been taken off at Crewe as 4L86 runs WCML to Nuneaton, then to Leicester and via Ely to Ipswich and Felixstowe. The 90 couldn't have remained in consist south of Crewe as there are (or were at least) some clearance issues through Leicester with them.

However, that train is rather interesting as it can also run as 4L96 which leaves Trafford Park at the same time but runs via London as opposed to Liecester. In which case the 90 could at least be in consist.

Hope this information is helpful.

Regards,
Joe.

 

[Tomnick]

Just had a look back through the TRB, and 4L86 did run (i.e. via Leicester) on Monday. I don't know whether the 90 was still tucked inside, but I doubt it'd have passed unnoticed and without comment if it had been!

 

[Joseph.bevan96]

Just had a look back through the TRB, and 4L86 did run (i.e. via Leicester) on Monday. I don't know whether the 90 was still tucked inside, but I doubt it'd have passed unnoticed and without comment if it had been!

Sorry, only just realised it was Monday. In which case I can confirm it was not inside as I saw it at Nuneaton. I can also confirm that the 70 was actually a 66 so the pair came off at Crewe. Not an uncommon thing for that working to do as I'm sure it's regularly 2 86/6s Trafford Park- Basford Hall.

Cheers,
Joe.