Class465fan
Member
Apologies if someone has already created a thread about this but does anyone know which 465 units have their prm mods done? On 465164 and the new toilet looks different to the /0s toilets.
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Class 465 PRM mods refurbishment
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Class465fan
Member
Here are some pictures
tsr
Established Member
Looks neat enough, though I haven't seen the mods in the flesh, so can't really comment properly.
I just hope they are maintained properly, and any vandalism kept in check. The module looks like a variant of the one used on newer Electrostars - all very well if they are kept nice and serviceable, but they quickly fall apart if you don't...
I just hope they are maintained properly, and any vandalism kept in check. The module looks like a variant of the one used on newer Electrostars - all very well if they are kept nice and serviceable, but they quickly fall apart if you don't...
Class465fan
Member
Well lets hope that the next TOC treats them better than the current one we have.
bramling
Veteran Member
By scrapping them?!
Hopefully not; they're nice trains providing they are properly turned out.
Class465fan
Member
I don't see the reason to scrap/replace them? They seem to do the job fine besides from the old tatty drab interior with bubble floors (Excluding /9s) that can be improved on.
bramling
Veteran Member
Agree with all of this. However rumours are getting stronger that the next franchise may well be likely to get rid of them, if so it’s hard to see where else they would go, as apart from the 455s they are now the oldest stock on the southern region I believe? (I won’t mention the 442s!).
I like them very much, and their 365 cousins, but I don’t specify or bid for franchises!
Mordac
Established Member
313s are older than both!
bramling
Veteran Member
Fair point, forgot about those. They seem to live a charmed life!
bramling
Veteran Member
A while? By rights new trains should come every 35-40 years, so the Networkers are for replacement around 2030. In the meantime the south eastern division has had, er, a massive fleet of Electrostars, 375s and 376s, 395s, and more recently some extra 377/5s. Whilst there’s no doubt some extra trains, new or cascaded, would be very welcome, I really don’t see anyone can complain about the age of rolling stock on this franchise.
In my view the next franchise should be looking to expand the high-speed fleet size, and incorporate the necessary infrastructure changes so the suburban fleet size can be expanded and 12-car operation be the norm.
Bromley boy
Established Member
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I've read similar.
I still think this seems somewhat unlikely, and not particularly cost effective, as Networkers aren't that old at around 25. They're also a very large fleet - Networkers outnumber the combined total of GTR and SWR's 455s - and do a pretty good job of metro commuter work, albeit with too many seats by modern standards.
Their main failing is the appalling state of their interiors (including the cabs
), which SE seem to have no interest in doing anything about.
bramling
Veteran Member
I've read similar.
I still think this seems somewhat unlikely, and not particularly cost effective, as Networkers aren't that old at around 25. They're also a very large fleet - Networkers outnumber the combined total of GTR and SWR's 455s - and do a pretty good job of metro commuter work, albeit with too many seats by modern standards.
Their main failing is the appalling state of their interiors (including the cabs
Agreed. Perhaps change them to a layout more like the 365, and they would be ideal, especially in 12 car formations. You could be right that their saviour may be the large fleet size - I hope so. Yes a good clean and refresh would not go amiss too.
Alteran Ancient
Member
The 465s and 466s (excluding the 465/9s) are in a very sorry state and much in need of internal sprucing. The only changes they've seen are a change of seat moquette and replacement dot-matrix indicators - and those changes were about 10 years ago. They're obviously getting the PRM mods, and they've had their door mechanisms spruced-up to make them more reliable, but those changes are the bare minimum. They should've taken the opportunity to give them a 465/9 style interior refresh whilst they were doing the accessible bogs. Even just a deep-clean and quick steam-clean of the seating wouldn't have gone amiss.
The 376s aren't faring much better either. South East London has been a cruel mistress, the bins are broken/missing, the original seating moquette is worn-out, and the ventilation systems sound like they're struggling. They were introduced in the mid-2000s, which was 12-13 years ago and they've not been touched since they first went into service. It's a shame, because they've got the potential to be much better metro units than their 465 predecessors, but they're simply not cared for.
It feels like any rolling-stock investment is only made in the interest of mainline customers - the metro customers are treated as though they are third-class citizens.
The 376s aren't faring much better either. South East London has been a cruel mistress, the bins are broken/missing, the original seating moquette is worn-out, and the ventilation systems sound like they're struggling. They were introduced in the mid-2000s, which was 12-13 years ago and they've not been touched since they first went into service. It's a shame, because they've got the potential to be much better metro units than their 465 predecessors, but they're simply not cared for.
It feels like any rolling-stock investment is only made in the interest of mainline customers - the metro customers are treated as though they are third-class citizens.
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Class465fan
Member
If the 465s ever get replaced, could they be used on the Brighton to Portsmouth replacing the 313s and also use them on the SN metro services replacing the 455s or do they have problems running on the southern parts?
bramling
Veteran Member
In theory, yes to both of these.
However, they would need route clearance, and there’s the issue that they don’t have SDO and it seems to be the case that it can’t easily be fitted. Plus it would be more sensible for Southern to get Electrostars, simply in the interest of fleet standardisation.
The optimum solution is staying on the south eastern side and sorting out the remaining platform issues. However Woolwich Dockyard and Charing Cross are both difficult - and thus expensive.
Class465fan
Member
465901 went to Doncaster for its PRM mods a few weeks ago. Does anyone know how long it takes to get these modifications done?
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