Class 387

[Manchester77]

I too would have some doubts about all GW EMU services needing 387s. Although there are advantages of a common fleet, the 110 mph capability would be somewhat wasted on a service such as the Newbury to Reading stopper, although we've seen references in the earlier GWML franchise spec to NR wanting 110 mph units for the main line services into Paddington..

You'd think there were some better claims on the stock, such as the MML Corby suggestions. Good luck to them if it's going to be 387s everywhere on the GW, but is it the right solution for the railway when considered nationally?

If they're going everywhere on GW it does seem to be a waste of their capabilities. It makes me wonder whether it will be 387s for the fast valley services with upgraded 319s for the branches and Bristol. The branches will see 387s a few times a day anyway with through trains to london. With 50 units it seems GW will use them on all services though, including the Bristol metro area.

 

[Stompehh]

If they're going everywhere on GW it does seem to be a waste of their capabilities. It makes me wonder whether it will be 387s for the fast valley services with upgraded 319s for the branches and Bristol. The branches will see 387s a few times a day anyway with through trains to london. With 50 units it seems GW will use them on all services though, including the Bristol metro area.

I might have missed something but as far as I know, the Bristol metro area isn't currently down for electrification, only the mainlines. Unless I misunderstand what you mean by "Bristol metro area" of course!

 

[TEW]

With Cardiff-Bristol-Bath electrified there will be some use for EMUs in the Bristol area.

 

[Class377/5]

387105 was delivered to Bletchley last night.

https://twitter.com/lambrettaRT255/status/515869649045839872

 

[AM9]

Simple question, (maybe not so simple to answer):
Can anybody here say whether the acceleration curve, say up to 50mph is the same for late 377s and 387s, (on ac of course)?

 

[Class377/5]

Simple question, (maybe not so simple to answer):
Can anybody here say whether the acceleration curve, say up to 50mph is the same for late 377s and 387s, (on ac of course)?

The 387s I believe use the same traction package as the 379s with the limiting software adapted.

 

[notadriver]

What limiting software is that ? The traction package the 379s have is different to 377s afaik.

 

[westcoaster]

What limiting software is that ? The traction package the 379s have is different to 377s afaik.

Units will be limited to 100 mph with TL, and 110 with there next operator.

 

[Class377/5]

What limiting software is that ? The traction package the 379s have is different to 377s afaik.

The traction package of the Electrostars have software to link the units. The 377s are capable of reaching 120mph under the wires.

Remember the 379 is the basis of the 387 including the traction package.

 

[anthony263]

With Cardiff-Bristol-Bath electrified there will be some use for EMUs in the Bristol area.

Could certainly imagine some being used on the long proposed Swansea - Bath service as well as a Bristol - Oxford service which has long been suggested for re-instatement after its withdrawl.

A 110mph electrostar would certainly be easier to path between IEP's than a 90mph class 165/166 or a 100mph class 319 which would be ideal for the GW.

 

[westcoaster]

The traction package of the Electrostars have software to link the units. The 377s are capable of reaching 120mph under the wires.

That's umm just an urban myth remember No idea where it came from :roll:

 

[DXMachina]

That's umm just an urban myth remember No idea where it came from :roll:

Electrostars of some sort have been tested for 110mph running - this is regularly asserted and I assume, true

Any official sign-off for a max speed requires a 10% overspeed capacity on test - this is also often asserted. If also true at least one electrostar has reached 121mph at least once.

 

[ModernRailways]

That's umm just an urban myth remember No idea where it came from :roll:

I bet some drivers have gotten some speed out of them, I've been on a Southern that reached 111, not yet been on an FCC going that fast but I'm sure it's happened

They were tested on the WCML for 110mph weren't they? Alongside the 350s? Or am I dreaming?

 

[Manchester77]

A 379 has its software modified to run at 110mph to test for the 387s and that ran on the wcml

 

[Parallel]

Could certainly imagine some being used on the long proposed Swansea - Bath service as well as a Bristol - Oxford service which has long been suggested for re-instatement after its withdrawl.

I can't see any trains terminating at Bath for the near future, due to only having two platforms currently and limited space for trains to turn around after the journey... An extra service from Bristol to Swansea could work though, with perhaps a limited service being extended to Bath (once every few hours). I agree an Oxford to Bristol Temple Meads would be great though, I think the links around the Thames Valley to the West leave a lot to be desired!

 

[Class377/5]

Electrostars of some sort have been tested for 110mph running - this is regularly asserted and I assume, true

Any official sign-off for a max speed requires a 10% overspeed capacity on test - this is also often asserted. If also true at least one electrostar has reached 121mph at least once.

There a different between overspeed test and 110mph constant running.

That's umm just an urban myth remember No idea where it came from :roll:

Just a few ideas where

 

[DXMachina]

There a different between overspeed test and 110mph constant running.

The original claim I was responding to merely stated that electrostars can reach 120mph on OHLE, and made no mention of sustaining it. This would appear substantiated.

 

[Class377/5]

The original claim I was responding to merely stated that electrostars can reach 120mph on OHLE, and made no mention of sustaining it. This would appear substantiated.

Think you missed the banter between me and Westcoaster over this. I was also trying to state that 110mph running is different from a test that must have happened (I don't personally know when/where test occured), not pick fault with your post.

 

[Class 170101]

I would have thought it could just be notes in cabs after all 90s are permitted to do 110mph doesn't mean they are allowed to do this on the GEML.

The 350s did have software that limited them to 100mph in multiple before 110mph was allowed in multiple and also limits the 350/1s 350/3s when attached to a 350/2. (Doubtless a 350/4 would also have the same software in operation when attached to a 350/2).

 

[G_A_C_C_C]

I too would have some doubts about all GW EMU services needing 387s. Although there are advantages of a common fleet, the 110 mph capability would be somewhat wasted on a service such as the Newbury to Reading stopper, although we've seen references in the earlier GWML franchise spec to NR wanting 110 mph units for the main line services into Paddington..

You'd think there were some better claims on the stock, such as the MML Corby suggestions. Good luck to them if it's going to be 387s everywhere on the GW, but is it the right solution for the railway when considered nationally?

I agree. Some/all of the new order would have to be for 3 car units. You can't get a 4 car unit to Marlow and 3 cars would give GW a flexible fleet - but a complete waste of 110 mph stock.

 

[Peter Sarf]

It occurs to me that the Midland Main Line South end might instead get something from Siemens that is compatible with the Thameslink stock (700s ?) that the 387s will be temporarily covering for.

 

[Class377/5]

It occurs to me that the Midland Main Line South end might instead get something from Siemens that is compatible with the Thameslink stock (700s ?) that the 387s will be temporarily covering for.

Depending on how you view compatible. The 700 aren't designed to work in multiple with anything but can be rescued by another 700 or an Electrostar.

 

[Peter Sarf]

Depending on how you view compatible. The 700 aren't designed to work in multiple with anything but can be rescued by another 700 or an Electrostar.

Thanks. Yes the rescue capability is what I was failing to articulate and nice to learn that the 387s should cover that. Makes sense as the 387s will be working with the 700s on Thameslink in the early period of their life anyway.

 

[JonathanH]

I agree. Some/all of the new order would have to be for 3 car units. You can't get a 4 car unit to Marlow and 3 cars would give GW a flexible fleet - but a complete waste of 110 mph stock.

I don't think you can get a 3-car unit to Marlow, let alone a 4-car one.
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=71071

 

[Class377/5]

I don't think you can get a 3-car unit to Marlow, let alone a 4-car one.
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=71071

That's a 3 car 23m (69m) that wont fit rather than a 3 car 20m (60m) compared to today's 2 car 23m (46m) that's fine.

Using SDO is one possibility. One example of this is 12 car trains serving 8 car platforms at Alton.

 

[southern442]

That's a 3 car 23m (69m) that wont fit rather than a 3 car 20m (60m) compared to today's 2 car 23m (46m) that's fine.

Using SDO is one possibility. One example of this is 12 car trains serving 8 car platforms at Alton.

Or have direct London-Bourne End trains and a Marlow shuttle from there like in the peak but stopping trains, although this idea would be criticized as being too difficult, both for convenience and for pathing I assume.

 

[user15681]

387106 delivered to Bletchley yesterday evening (03/10)

 

[railfanatic]

Here's a 12 car 387 at Old Dalby for high speed testing.

 

[railfanatic]

A picture of when the 387 reached 110 mph.

 

[317 forever]

As I may be going to Luton next April to ride the Busway there, I hope some 387s are in service by then. Mind you, I wonder whether they will be introduced on Gatwick Express services first.