Class 387

[Bald Rick]

Can't find the online document but the last 319 is planned for 2017. Only units running around on Thameslink in 2018 are 387s and 700s.

Govia has publicly stated Thameslink fleet replaced to be completed by the end of 2017.

.

June 2018 is certainly the last delivery of the 700s. The full fleet is needed for the May 2018 timetable, so something will be staying behind. You're more likely to be right than me!

 

[D365]

June 2018 is certainly the last delivery of the 700s. The full fleet is needed for the May 2018 timetable, so something will be staying behind. You're more likely to be right than me!

How does this timetable tie in with ATO being introduced to service? As I don't imagine the 387s will be compatible...

 

[Class377/5]

June 2018 is certainly the last delivery of the 700s. The full fleet is needed for the May 2018 timetable, so something will be staying behind. You're more likely to be right than me!

The full May timetable in 2018 requires all 700 for Thameslink however the current fleet consists of 115 four car units or 460 carriages. Only 40% or so of the build is to replace the current fleet.

The full fleet isn't required for May 2018 as it's supposed to be 20tph only. The Tattenham Corner to Cambridge and Caterham to Welwyn Garden City peak only (both 8 car services) services aren't too start until December when full KO2 is implemented with the ATO.

I have guesstimates of the introduction of the 700 and when services will be fully 700 but is more guess work based on the arrival date of the full fleet. But the end of 2016 all Bedford to Brighton services should be 700s and I *think* that will include the Three Bridges services too. This is only my opinion however.

 

[jon0844]

Aye it'll be a strange sight on a future London bash when there's no 319s running. They've been a key part of many trips in the London area for so long during my time in the hobby it's going to take some adjusting to. No more London Bridge to East Croydon trips on 319s soon, going to be weird.

Still, life goes on and I shall enjoy the memories when the time comes. It goes without saying a trip on a 319 is mandatory when I go to London next week!

Having grown up around 317s and 319s, it will indeed be weird to no longer see them on Thameslink or Great Northern in the coming years.

 

[RobShipway]

Having grown up around 317s and 319s, it will indeed be weird to no longer see them on Thameslink or Great Northern in the coming years.

It will be strange sight to no longer see the class 319's on the BML, but it was strange when they first started seeing them run alongside the class 411 trains.

 

[physics34]

So confirmation this morning with the FGW franchise announcement that the 387/1s will end up at FGW.

Can someone now please correct that Corby service rubbish on Wikipedia now

 

[northwichcat]

So confirmation this morning with the FGW franchise announcement that the 387/1s will end up at FGW.

Plus an add-on order for 8 extra 387/2s for FGW.

 

[swt_passenger]

So confirmation this morning with the FGW franchise announcement that the 387/1s will end up at FGW.

Can someone now please correct that Corby service rubbish on Wikipedia now

Anyone can do that anonymously, no need to log in...

...and I see someone just has deleted the EMT and Corby sentence. (Not me I might add.)

 

[D365]

Plus an add-on order for 8 extra 387/2s for FGW.

Great to hear that the 140 additional carriages available have all been taken up in the end.

The big FGW franchise rolling stock announcement is to be found here!

Looks like it's the only 100mph Class 377/5 for us on London-Corby/Cambridge fasts then. Not me though as I'm on the Peterborough route, we keep 19 of our 365s for the peaks

 

[swt_passenger]

Looks like it's the only 100mph Class 377/5 for us on London-Corby/Cambridge fasts then.

Nothing announced today says anything about Corby except that it won't be 387/1s. How many 377/5s do you think are available?

 

[AM9]

Nothing announced today says anything about Corby except that it won't be 387/1s. How many 377/5s do you think are available?

Maybe this will open up an opportunity to integrate Corby services into the Thameslink franchise, effectively extending some BDM runs.

 

[ScotGG]

I expect Corby will get trains from Southeastern who'll be left with very little extra stock in coming years. Out of all the London area franchises southeastern are likely to be lumbered with the least new stock.

If the government think Crossrail and HS1 will absorb all extra demand from some of the biggest population rises in the whole UK I think they're badly mistaken. Can HS1 accommodate 50k extra people at Ebbsfleet alone? Can SE metro take 50k at Greenwich & Lewisham even if 75% use the DLR & Jubilee?

 

[physics34]

I expect Corby will get trains from Southeastern who'll be left with very little extra stock in coming years. Out of all the London area franchises southeastern are likely to be lumbered with the least new stock.

If they government think Crossrail and HS1 will absorb all extra demand from some of the biggest population rises in the whole UK they are mistaken.

Think South eastern are due to get some 377/1s which will be made surplus by class 700s.

 

[ScotGG]

Think South eastern are due to get some 377/1s which will be made surplus by class 700s.

And recent word is that they'll have to give up 375s at the same time.

 

[user15681]

I expect Corby will get trains from Southeastern who'll be left with very little extra stock in coming years. Out of all the London area franchises southeastern are likely to be lumbered with the least new stock.

If they government think Crossrail and HS1 will absorb all extra demand from some of the biggest population rises in the whole UK they are mistaken.

I know you love to mention this wherever you can, but to clear it up there is no spare stock available in 2015. There may be in 2016 (pending future government and DfT discussions).

 

[northwichcat]

Think South eastern are due to get some 377/1s which will be made surplus by class 700s.

Southeastern are currently hiring in 6 x 377s on a daily basis. They actually signed a deal for 6 x 319s but they have been subleased back to Thameslink to allow Southeastern to use 6 x 377s.

 

[swt_passenger]

Maybe this will open up an opportunity to integrate Corby services into the Thameslink franchise, effectively extending some BDM runs.

Plenty of insiders have posted here that will never happen...

 

[Class377/5]

Plenty of insiders have posted here that will never happen...

Its unlikely to be done until after 2022 (next franchise) but by then you'll have had an eletric service from St Pancras for 8 years or so.

 

[387star]

Are all 387s going to FGW?? They could have built enough to not need 365s?

According to wiki there will be 50 odd 387s built which is why I was confused

Oh my mistake that included the gatwick units

 

[D365]

Are all 387s going to FGW?? They could have built enough to not need 365s?

According to wiki there will be 50 odd 387s built which is why I was confused

Oh my mistake that included the gatwick units

The 21 365s (or thereabouts) are going spare anyway, since they're being replaced on the Cambridge fasts by 377/5s. Rather than receiving any proper refurbishment of our dreams

29x 387/1: Thameslink, to be cascaded
27x 387/2: Gatwick Express, to replace Class 442
8x 387: FGW additional, as announced today
which makes up the 64 units (116+140 carriages) originally specified!

 

[phil281]

Has a Class 387 been round the Sutton Loop yet in service or as a test run? I know there is nothing booked but in disruption etc has it happened?

 

[DaveHarries]

The 21 365s (or thereabouts) are going spare anyway, since they're being replaced on the Cambridge fasts by 377/5s. Rather than receiving any proper refurbishment of our dreams

29x 387/1: Thameslink, to be cascaded
27x 387/2: Gatwick Express, to replace Class 442
8x 387: FGW additional, as announced today
which makes up the 64 units (116+140 carriages) originally specified!

Article also here.....

https://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk...e-frequent-trains-for-thames-valley-customers

..... saying 37x Class 387s and 21x 365s for the Thames Valley starting to appear in Spring 2016. Presumably the current 165 & 166s that run around Berkshire will be deposed onto local services in Bristol and / or Somerset, Devon & Cornwall. However seeing as there are no OHL or 3rd Rail power sources in the Thames Valley (AFAIK - I don't live up there and rarely journey through it) it will be interesting to see how they power the 365s & 387s in the meantime. Perhaps the Spring 2016 bit is a typo?

Meanwhile the franchise benefits map - https://content.firstgreatwestern.c...rce=BAGWDM&utm_medium=DM&utm_campaign=BAGWcrm - suggests that more modern trains will appear on local services around Bristol, such as the Severn Beach route of which I am a user. I will welcome those.

Dave

 

[Class377/5]

Has a Class 387 been round the Sutton Loop yet in service or as a test run? I know there is nothing booked but in disruption etc has it happened?

Not currently allowed around the loop (they are gauge cleared) and no plans to remove the restriction. 377 now operate around the Loop in service however.

 

[deltic08]

Are 37 387s the absolute minimum required? What happens if more are needed to cope with growth or electrification from Newbury to Westbury?Where will 110mph compatible stock come from?

 

[Jonny]

Are 37 387s the absolute minimum required? What happens if more are needed to cope with growth or electrification from Newbury to Westbury?Where will 110mph compatible stock come from?

Class 387s are rated for 110mph maximum.

 

[Class377/5]

Are 37 387s the absolute minimum required? What happens if more are needed to cope with growth or electrification from Newbury to Westbury?Where will 110mph compatible stock come from?

37x 387 is the maximum that GW can have without retendering. The original order was for up to 256 carriages or 64 four car units. The full 64 units have now been ordered as;

• 29x 387/1 now in service on Thameslink and will be cascaded to GW starting next year.
• 27x 387/2 for Gatwick Express, to start coming into service later this year
• 8x 387 that will go straight to GW from new

Comments of 387s on GW seem to suggest the initial 8 will be built straight on from the 387/2 and be the first units to arrive As GTRs cascade plan won't start to see the first 700 release 387s until after this date. Remember the actual deadline for the first 10x 387/1 is December 2016.

As for 110mph, the 387 fleet is cleared for that speed under the wires where OHLE permits it, currently only on the WCML. GWML will be suitable once is wired. 387101/102/104 have all done in 12 car 110mph testing both at Old Dalby and on the WCML.

 

[D365]

Unless they reinstate the 442s again and cascade the 387/2s as 110mph-capable :P

Not sure if we'll see the BML with OHLE and 110mph enhancement in a lifetime?
And thanks for adding timescales for prospective delivery/cascade of the Class 387s.

 

[Class377/5]

387128/103 now at Bletchley for commissioning

 

[jimm]

Are 37 387s the absolute minimum required? What happens if more are needed to cope with growth or electrification from Newbury to Westbury?Where will 110mph compatible stock come from?

FGW currently operates 57 165s and 166s, in two or three-car formations. Much of their current work between Reading and Paddington will be taken over by Crossrail, so I'd reckon 37 Class 387s and the 21 Class 365s also going to FGW (or should we now start writing GWR?), all with four coaches, allow quite some margin for growth, even with 387s replacing some of the HST and 180 workings on fasts between Oxford and London and a few 387 formations serving Swindon in the peaks.

 

[Class377/5]

Don't forget a three car Turbo is 69m vs four car 365/387 80m length.