Class 230 units training/introduction on the Borderlands line: updates

[shredder1]

Any chance of any running this saturday?

 

[Zontar]

View attachment 136337
The TfW Newsletter report.

Absolute joke. Imagine the response if avanti published this....

 

[childwallblues]

I had my first ride of the Borderlands line today to get to Liverpool. 1136 from Wrexham up to Bidston was 150264 and pretty uneventful.

Arrived at Bidston to try and sample 230008 on the 1736 which was showing as 35 late when we arrived, and disappeared completely off the departures board just before 6pm. Nobody had told the poor guy in the ticket office at Bidston with 30-40 or so people waiting to board - he called someone (assume control) and sure enough it was cancelled. Went back whence we came as far as Hamilton Square and went via Chester to get to Wrexham around 1930.

Had we waited at Bidston (there really is nothing nearby) the following service from Bidston at 1847 was 20 late (with the 150 so can't blame the 230 things), so we beat it by over 30 minutes taking the long way round. Still took two and half hours to travel the 28 miles from Liverpool to Wrexham.

If this is your line I pity you. We weren't in a hurry so it didn't matter to us, but the people I spoke to said it was par for the course and totally unreliable.

The 1747 direct service ftom Liverpool Lime Street arrives at Wrexham General at 1849.

 

[Sheridan]

The 1747 direct service ftom Liverpool Lime Street arrives at Wrexham General at 1849.

What help is that to a passenger trying to travel from Bidston at 1736?

 

[DLAYKEGER]

What help is that to a passenger trying to travel from Bidston at 1736?

I agree, its certainly a problem with intermediate stations, with the ongoing delays / cancellations. I have opted today to drive and get the 7:35am Spital to Liverpool. It's cheaper, has a more regular, service, arrives at roughly the same time, and I will be able to get home when I choose. The car next to me in the car park today is owned by a former Heswall station user, driven off to Merseyrail due to the abysmal TFW service since earlier in the year.

I used the 230 on Tuesday, to get to work, which was nice, quiet, and had great accelleration and was on time. But luckily I had the option of a lift to get me home from Birkenhead North when it went all wrong on Tuesday evening.

How TFW have been allowed to change the last train to Wrexham (for what appears to be non engineering reasons) to a bus is beyond me, given the bus takes double the time on the Borderlands line.

 

[D365]

Perhaps the wrong sort of pollen?

You might not be far off the mark!

 

[pokemonsuper9]

given the bus takes double the time on the Borderlands line.

Don't busses usually take roughly double the time, that's pretty common in my experience.

 

[cjbirkett]

Interesting thing to see today (1st June) was a unit swap at Bidston. I was waiting to see the 13.32 (first time seeing them in service) with my camera firmly pointed towards the Wrexham line when it slid into the platform behind me from Birkenhead! 230 007 was the unit.

The arrival from Wrexham (on time, incidentally) with 230 009 went into the Liverpool bound platform then off to Birkenhead North ECS.

It was nice to get them either side of the Island platform, pure fluke on my part.

Apologies if this happens all the time but it was a first for me.

Best wishes

 

[CaergwrleKen]

Interesting thing to see today (1st June) was a unit swap at Bidston. I was waiting to see the 13.32 (first time seeing them in service) with my camera firmly pointed towards the Wrexham line when it slid into the platform behind me from Birkenhead! 230 007 was the unit.

The arrival from Wrexham (on time, incidentally) with 230 009 went into the Liverpool bound platform then off to Birkenhead North ECS.

It was nice to get them either side of the Island platform, pure fluke on my part.

Apologies if this happens all the time but it was a first for me.

Best wishes

This doesn’t usually happen, the 1230 from Wrexham was more or less to time but was swapped at Bidston which might be to do with TFW sending a new unit out because of the supposed pollen problem. Unfortunately the replacement unit has only lasted one trip and failed Bidston.

 

[Zontar]

I've heard a door fault today was the latest fail.

 

[L401CJF]

I've heard a door fault today was the latest fail.

I have no info regarding todays issues specifically, however I have noticed on a few occasions due to the way the doors work, they close slowly, slam shut and sometimes bounce back a few inches meaning the hazard light remains lit and the train will not move. Easy to rectify by giving the offending door a shove.

 

[fgwrich]

You might not be far off the mark!

Wouldn't be the first stock to be affected by Pollen and won't be the last - I remember the 180s suffered quite badly during their first introduction to the ECML, while Turbostars often seem to suffer issues with blocked filters / radiators.

I have no info regarding todays issues specifically, however I have noticed on a few occasions due to the way the doors work, they close slowly, slam shut and sometimes bounce back a few inches meaning the hazard light remains lit and the train will not move. Easy to rectify by giving the offending door a shove.

Always been a D Stock issue that, I'm surprised it was never modified at the conversion stage!

 

[Dai Corner]

I have no info regarding todays issues specifically, however I have noticed on a few occasions due to the way the doors work, they close slowly, slam shut and sometimes bounce back a few inches meaning the hazard light remains lit and the train will not move. Easy to rectify by giving the offending door a shove.

Do all guards know that? Is there a way to inform them beyond random conversation in the mess room?

 

[L401CJF]

Do all guards know that? Is there a way to inform them beyond random conversation in the mess room?

I'm not sure if it's been mentioned officially or not I can't remember! My first working on one in service a while back and it happened to me, I had a trainer on hand for assistance who knew exactly what it was having seen it before and now if a hazard light remains lit I know immediately to check they've not bounced open.

If its happened to me on a journey I'll always let the relieving guard know what it was and how to deal with it just incase it happens to them!

 

[Caaardiff]

Interesting thing to see today (1st June) was a unit swap at Bidston. I was waiting to see the 13.32 (first time seeing them in service) with my camera firmly pointed towards the Wrexham line when it slid into the platform behind me from Birkenhead! 230 007 was the unit.

The arrival from Wrexham (on time, incidentally) with 230 009 went into the Liverpool bound platform then off to Birkenhead North ECS.

It was nice to get them either side of the Island platform, pure fluke on my part.

Apologies if this happens all the time but it was a first for me.

Best wishes

TFW have advised that there will be a planned unit swap between these 2 services so that each unit can go for "pollen clearing" at the Depot. So now it seems there will be 2 230's in passengers service each day. One in the morning, with a planned swapped with a different one in the afternoon.
Bizarre.

 

[Zontar]

TFW have advised that there will be a planned unit swap between these 2 services so that each unit can go for "pollen clearing" at the Depot. So now it seems there will be 2 230's in passengers service each day. One in the morning, with a planned swapped with a different one in the afternoon.
Bizarre.

Absolute horse sh*t. Its not about the 230s now , it's about the management. As I said earlier....imagine if avanti said they were going to do this....

 

[DLAYKEGER]

So we had the approx 15:35 and 17:35 trains from Bidston cancelled today, the latter means you can't do a traditional 9 til.5 working day in Liverpool without an extended commute.

I am left asking, would the Cardiff based government allow such cancellations due to the kniown problem of pollen to cancel trains for commuters from a major citiy region in S Wales. If they know its an issue they should have a 150 or 153 parked up in Bidston siding as a fail safe, rather than return trains to leasing companies

 

[L401CJF]

Absolute horse sh*t. Its not about the 230s now , it's about the management. As I said earlier....imagine if avanti said they were going to do this....

Clearly this pollen thing is an issue (and has been before on the Marston Vale units if i've read the thread properly, so isnt a new thing?). If it is the cause of the problems then it is what it is. However, I cannot understand the logic of bringing a 230 out for a few hours, swapping it for a 150 while it goes to have the filters cleaned, then bringing the 230 back out for a few hours. Surely its a better use of resources and money to just use the 150 all day while a solution/modification is sorted.

 

[Zontar]

Clearly this pollen thing is an issue (and has been before on the Marston Vale units if i've read the thread properly, so isnt a new thing?). If it is the cause of the problems then it is what it is. However, I cannot understand the logic of bringing a 230 out for a few hours, swapping it for a 150 while it goes to have the filters cleaned, then bringing the 230 back out for a few hours. Surely its a better use of resources and money to just use the 150 all day while a solution/modification is sorted.

Exactly. And 150's don't have hay-fever and have worked fine consistently for the last 37 years.

 

[Anonymous10]

So we had the approx 15:35 and 17:35 trains from Bidston cancelled today, the latter means you can't do a traditional 9 til.5 working day in Liverpool without an extended commute.

I am left asking, would the Cardiff based government allow such cancellations due to the kniown problem of pollen to cancel trains for commuters from a major citiy region in S Wales. If they know its an issue they should have a 150 or 153 parked up in Bidston siding as a fail safe, rather than return trains to leasing companies

Issue is if tfw don't have an option regarding the return of them, maintenance is already an issue ignoring the rosco wishes. I'd also like to mention that's if there's any units not in use elsewhere.

 

[tomuk]

Always been a D Stock issue that, I'm surprised it was never modified at the conversion stage!

It was modified. D stock used to shut quite quickly then slow down at the last second. 230s close more slowly overall and don't have the final slow close. I can't recall whether it was in an article or one of the promo videos at Long Marston but a point was made that the doors were modified for PRM reasons as regards the overall force of the door.

 

[DLAYKEGER]

Issue is if tfw don't have an option regarding the return of them, maintenance is already an issue ignoring the rosco wishes. I'd also like to mention that's if there's any units not in use elsewhere.

Well they have had 230s for 2 yrs + siiting in Birkenhead North, so they had plenty of time to try to sort out a well known isses of pollen seen on 230s elsewhere and to do staff training, they had enough 150s to run the line prior to the self caused 175 debacle, plus new 197s, on the n wales coast and I believe some new trains in South Wales, plus with engineering buses on one of the lines in South Wales, as such they should have some spare stock or they should not be implementing new services. It sems to be management incompetance of Avanti and TPE express levels striking with TFW

 

[Caaardiff]

Clearly this pollen thing is an issue (and has been before on the Marston Vale units if i've read the thread properly, so isnt a new thing?). If it is the cause of the problems then it is what it is. However, I cannot understand the logic of bringing a 230 out for a few hours, swapping it for a 150 while it goes to have the filters cleaned, then bringing the 230 back out for a few hours. Surely its a better use of resources and money to just use the 150 all day while a solution/modification is sorted.

That's not whats happening. The swap is with another 230 at Birkenhead. So effectively its always 2 working 1 half of a day's diagram. 1 in the morning, 1 in the afternoon. With no planned gap in service.

 

[L401CJF]

That's not whats happening. The swap is with another 230 at Birkenhead. So effectively its always 2 working 1 half of a day's diagram. 1 in the morning, 1 in the afternoon. With no planned gap in service.

Ah OK, post #2217 says different!

 

[Caaardiff]

Ah OK, post #2217 says different!

Missed that post!
I wonder if they are putting out a more cautious PR but as it stands there's 3 available 230's. Two for service (lunchtime swap) and one for training.

 

[Dan G]

TFW have advised that there will be a planned unit swap between these 2 services so that each unit can go for "pollen clearing" at the Depot. So now it seems there will be 2 230's in passengers service each day. One in the morning, with a planned swapped with a different one in the afternoon.
Bizarre.

I wouldn't call it bizarre, more a sensible interim workaround while a more permanent fix is found (at least I hope that's the plan...)

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Missed that post!
I wonder if they are putting out a more cautious PR but as it stands there's 3 available 230's. Two for service (lunchtime swap) and one for training.

Why on reading this does the schoolday song "Ten Green Bottles" and the gradual number reduction suddenly spring to mind?

 

[Techniquest]

I wouldn't call it bizarre, more a sensible interim workaround while a more permanent fix is found (at least I hope that's the plan...)

Quite so. Hopefully soon it will be all sorted and we'll look back at the last few months of 230s in action as a blot on the papers of railway history. A mess of things, but leading to something good at the end

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

How does the day to day frequency stand? The end goal, of course, was reported to be 2x 230 and 2x 197 on the line, though I'm not quite as naive as to expect 2tph any time soon.

 

[CaergwrleKen]

The swap has happened again today at Bidston at 1330 so only doing half a day a unit. No cancellations yet just a bit of late running. Let’s see if any come out over the weekend ?