Class 175s

[The Snap]

My beloved Voyager service from Stafford to Manchester was cancelled earlier, so I LM'd it to Crewe. I then got a ATW 175 from Crewe to Manchester for the first time ever...quite impressed!

The seats are miles more comfortable than those on the Voyagers, and there's bags more legroom. Couldn't help think though that the extra legroom on every row is a waste of capacity...? Thoughts?

 

[ATW Alex 101]

One of my favourite trains. Love the large tables and the comfy seats.

 

[northwichcat]

Remember the 175s were ordered in the late 1990s for FNW routes and retain their original seating and layout despite passenger growth and being transferred to different routes.

My first time was on a 175 was a Knutsford-Manchester journey when they were fairly new. I would have been thinking I hope the train is at least a refurbished 150 and not a Pacer, so a 175 would have been much better than what I expected.

 

[Emyr]

Modern rolling stock on the Mid-Cheshire line? I'm surprised it ever happened and also annoyed I missed it!

 

[gazthomas]

175's are pretty good

 

[PHILIPE]

Modern rolling stock on the Mid-Cheshire line? I'm surprised it ever happened and also annoyed I missed it!

In FNW days and they had to be got to and from Chester Depot to work services which later became TPE

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

The seats are miles more comfortable than those on the Voyagers, and there's bags more legroom. Couldn't help think though that the extra legroom on every row is a waste of capacity...? Thoughts?

You wouldn't want any higher density on 5-hour runs like Manchester/Holyhead-Cardiff and points west.
People generally like ATW's 158s, but compared to the 175s the knee room is very poor, the tables cramped and the seat backs too high.
We need more seating layouts like the 175s, not trying to convert them to high density metro sardine cans.
I find them better than 185s, which seem too compartmentalised to me - small zones with an un-optimised layout, thanks to the door spacing.
185s are also noisier than 175s, which have a more relaxing ride.

 

[northwichcat]

Modern rolling stock on the Mid-Cheshire line? I'm surprised it ever happened and also annoyed I missed it!

In FNW days and they had to be got to and from Chester Depot to work services which later became TPE

There used to be booked 175 working that left Chester at around 06:50 and did Chester-Altrincham-Manchester-Warrington-Chester-Llandudno and about 15 minutes before that there was a Chester-Warrington-Manchester-Altrincham-Chester working which was booked as a 150. I think it was partly for simplicity around Manchester Piccadilly and partly to balance capacity with a 08:20 arrival at Manchester from the Mid-Cheshire line being busier than a 07:40 arrival at Manchester from the Warrington line. Those workings continued after the ATW franchise started but ended when the FNW franchise ended.

In the first part of 2004 most booked workings on the Mid-Cheshire line were 142s and 150s but alongside that there were 158s, 175s and a class 31 hauled mk2 set. A couple of years later it was 142s and 150s with some 156s thrown in for good measure, as it still is now.

Also I suppose in the late BR days when there were a lot of 150s on the Mid-Cheshire line they were modern rolling stock at the time.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

If only Washwood Heath had managed to get the 175s (and the 180s; and the 458s...) working 'out of the box', then maybe we'd have a large fleet of 180s on XC and the MML now. :roll:

 

[ryan125hst]

I know that new build diesel trains are going to be few and far between now, but in my opinion, they are perfect for long distance regional services, such as Liverpool to Norwich, Nottingham to Cardiff, Edinburgh to Inverness etc. They are effectively a modern version of the Class 158, although between unit gangways would be useful on them I'm sure as the 158's use them frequently.

I think I've been on one, albeit briefly, between Manchester Piccadilly and Deansgate about 10 years ago (When I became familiar with train classes, I remembered the layout and design of the doors, and how the crew door is right next to the passenger door and worked out that that's what I was on), so can't really comment on how quiet and comfortable they are, but from a design point of view, they seem ideal.

I'm not keen on trains with 1/3 and 2/3 doors being used on long journeys and, in my opinion, more trains similar to the 175 should have been built for the services that are too slow for intercity stock, yet too long for Turbostars and 185's.

 

[DT611]

not bad units at all TBH

 

[43074]

It's a pity more 175s weren't built IMO. I had a 175 between Shrewsbury and Hereford last year and it was far superior to any 170, and it had the ambience of a proper InterCity train.

Perhaps more would have been built if they hadn't had such a troubled introduction?

 

[Hyphen]

I prefer 170s over the 175s any day.

My main gripes with the 175s are:
- The really funky aircon setup. Boiling hot at one end, freezing at the other - something ATW guards/drivers tell me is normal for those trains, and that they have no control over it
- The fact they're simply not long enough for the routes I use them on mostly - Marches and South Wales runs. If I ever do need to catch one, I always just pray it's a 3-car. 180s would be much better suited for ATW on the Marches runs, even if they're a bit more empty west of Swansea.

Other than that, the seating is nice, with good legroom. But it's not better than FGW's refurbished HST seating, which I'll usually prefer to wait for if I'm not going above Newport.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Now I think about it, if travelling Swansea-Manchester, 175s are definitely the lesser of two evils compared to going via Bristol Parkway and onto a Vomiter. Also helps most people getting on at Swansea congregate around the buffer stops probably only as far up as the end of the first coach, and at Cardiff everyone just stands near the stairs. Knowing where the front of the train is at either location really does help with bagging a seat.

 

[All Line Rover]

They are the best diesel trains on the network. Their only faults are (i) erratic air-con; (ii) too short. Had the OP boarded an early morning 2-car 175 from CRE to MAN I doubt he'll have enjoyed his journey.

The 180s trade the 175s reliability (going by Hull Trains' PPM) for extra capacity.

I'll be interested to see how the 800s compare. Will they be cramped and rumble constantly (185, 170, 171, 172, 16x, 15x, 14x, 220, 221 - albeit the 220s/221s can be comfortable with a better seating layout and the comfort of the 158 seats has improved with ATW) or spacious and quiet (175s)?

 

[tom1649]

I think they are great. The seats are comfortable without being too high backed. Nice big windows and therefore very light and airy. If only Virgin had ordered something like this rather than the claustrophobic Voyagers, which rarely fail to raise my blood pressure.

 

[northwichcat]

If only Washwood Heath had managed to get the 175s (and the 180s; and the 458s...) working 'out of the box', then maybe we'd have a large fleet of 180s on XC and the MML now. :roll:

Alstom were still designing a 125mph DMU for First Group when Bombardier had a 125mph DEMU and were working on a tilting option (as required by Virgin.)

 

[387star]

Do 175 seats meet the current crash worthy standards

 

[ValleyLines142]

The 175s are great units. Nice seats that aren't too upright, plenty of legroom and nice big tables. My only downside with them is that the aircon can be FREEZING (I had 175111 on the 2030 Manchester to Cardiff on Monday and I was frozen) and they're not very big (could do with at least four or five coaches). The other thing is the seat numbering system, where around the tables they're both the same, i.e. 13F and 13B, which is annoying if the train is in reverse formation.

But apart from that, they're cracking units and I'm very privileged to have them running frequently in my area

 

[headshot119]

The 175s are great units. Nice seats that aren't too upright, plenty of legroom and nice big tables. My only downside with them is that the aircon can be FREEZING (I had 175111 on the 2030 Manchester to Cardiff on Monday and I was frozen) and they're not very big (could do with at least four or five coaches). The other thing is the seat numbering system, where around the tables they're both the same, i.e. 13F and 13B, which is annoying if the train is in reverse formation.

But apart from that, they're cracking units and I'm very privileged to have them running frequently in my area

The aircon is a God send in the height of summer mind!

I thought they'd renumbered the seats to being just 13, and 13, then the reservation ticket was put in the right one depending which way round the set is running?

Then again they reverse so much on some routes it makes little difference.

 

[ValleyLines142]

The aircon is a God send in the height of summer mind!

That is true in fairness.

I thought they'd renumbered the seats to being just 13, and 13, then the reservation ticket was put in the right one depending which way round the set is running?

Then again they reverse so much on some routes it makes little difference.

It is but I personally think it's a confusing system. I caught the 0650 Cardiff to Manchester a couple of weeks ago and the reservation system was causing havoc!