Class 175s to GWR

[RPI]

But presumably the 150s will leave the GWR fleet before the 175s, so I would guess there will be some major rediagramming of the rolling stock fleet once the 175s are in traffic, and are a known commodity.

Theoretically 175s start to replace the "Castle" diagrams so reverting 80x to Intercity work, but also replacing 158s which go back to their shortformed diagrams. However, how do GWR restore the through Cardiff-Penzance services ? Or won't they until Project Churchward arrives and all MUs are replaced ?

150's are going nowhere anytime soon, they're all going through another C6 so potentially another ten years use in them yet.

The 175's will be cleared for Exmouth but won't routinely be used as they are unsuited to stop/start commuter work due to their end doors, but they will be able to cover in emergencies.

I think it's been covered multiple times in the thread, but the 175's will ultimately replace the HST's and the IET's that currently operate on the mainline between Exeter/Plymouth and Penzance, also Okehampton and Barny branches.

 

[tfw756rider]

On the same day that I saw (white) 175003, check this out! A "Welcome on board" poster on a 166 that says, in the bottom-right-corner, "Class 150, 158, 165, 166, 175 & 387 Welcome. DC"!

I did since notice though that it actually says in the bottom-left corner that it was updated in March 2024, but perhaps including 175 wouldn't affect that date and therefore maybe it could be more recent?

 

[fgwrich]

On the same day that I saw (white) 175003, check this out! A "Welcome on board" poster on a 166 that says, in the bottom-right-corner, "Class 150, 158, 165, 166, 175 & 387 Welcome. DC"!

I did since notice though that it actually says in the bottom-left corner that it was updated in March 2024, but perhaps including 175 wouldn't affect that date and therefore maybe it could be more recent?

Recent. Even if the information has remained the same, it just now means that the same posters can be used across all the non IET fleets. So no cover up here.

 

[brad465]

150's are going nowhere anytime soon, they're all going through another C6 so potentially another ten years use in them yet.

The 175's will be cleared for Exmouth but won't routinely be used as they are unsuited to stop/start commuter work due to their end doors, but they will be able to cover in emergencies.

I think it's been covered multiple times in the thread, but the 175's will ultimately replace the HST's and the IET's that currently operate on the mainline between Exeter/Plymouth and Penzance, also Okehampton and Barny branches.

Do they plan to clear 175s for Axminster? Turbos are not cleared beyond Exmouth Jct in that direction, so when one has ended up on "that diagram", it's been cancelled in the Exeter area. If 175s are going to Barnstaple regularly it would make sense to clear them for Axminster, especially if/when the Devon metro gets going.

 

[RPI]

Do they plan to clear 175s for Axminster? Turbos are not cleared beyond Exmouth Jct in that direction, so when one has ended up on "that diagram", it's been cancelled in the Exeter area. If 175s are going to Barnstaple regularly it would make sense to clear them for Axminster, especially if/when the Devon metro gets going.

I believe they are, there is the long held ambition to run the Barnstaple service through to Honiton one day! But Axminster does appear on maps in internal literature regarding the 175's.

 

[BillStampy]

By the looks of it, GWR aren't hanging about!
Plenty of 5Z headcodes for next week with what I ASSUME is a 175 roaming around Devon and Cornwall, on Friday it heads up towards Exeter too. First time a unit goes all the way to Penzance too if it is a 175

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[brad465]

I believe they are, there is the long held ambition to run the Barnstaple service through to Honiton one day! But Axminster does appear on maps in internal literature regarding the 175's.

Thank you for confirming.

Do we know what work was done to 175003 while in Wolverton? Obviously not a paintjob, but presumably fixing up its moving parts and/or an interior fix-up?

 

[tfw756rider]

Thank you for confirming.

Do we know what work was done to 175003 while in Wolverton? Obviously not a paintjob, but presumably fixing up its moving parts and/or an interior fix-up?

I don't know (hopefully someone else does), but I'm going to guess one or more of the following, from what's been said in this thread:

• underframe corrosion repair
• loading of Great Western Railway (GWR) Passenger Information System data
• the "union mods" (drivers' seats upgraded to high-backed ones with head rests, and a couple of cab controls that were in the "wrong" place repositioned)

Maybe the interior has been "GWR-ified" as well (as I understand that would be done before the exterior repaint) but I don't know.

 

[cjw714]

I believe they are, there is the long held ambition to run the Barnstaple service through to Honiton one day! But Axminster does appear on maps in internal literature regarding the 175's.

Does anyone know if it is simply a shortage of rolling stock that stops this happening now or does it require some doubling of track as well?

 

[RPI]

Does anyone know if it is simply a shortage of rolling stock that stops this happening now or does it require some doubling of track as well?

In danger of veering off topic, the main thing is the lack of capacity, until the proposed loop at Whimple/Cranbrook is built then regular extra services are off the cards.

GWR have wanted to run a morning service for a while to plug the gap in the clock face hourly service in from Axminster/Honiton and lack of units stopped that, so the introduction of the 175's may (or may not!) make that happen.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Sep 2025 ==

Thank you for confirming.

Do we know what work was done to 175003 while in Wolverton? Obviously not a paintjob, but presumably fixing up its moving parts and/or an interior fix-up?

Some of the work was definitely related to underside corrosion, I know that they've also had a deep clean inside amongst other things.

 

[tfw756rider]

Some of the work was definitely related to underside corrosion, I know that they've also had a deep clean inside amongst other things.

Many thanks

• loading of Great Western Railway Passenger Information System data
• the "union mods" (drivers' seats upgraded to high-backed ones with head rests, and a couple of cab controls that were in the "wrong" place repositioned)

Surely these as well?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Sep 2025 ==

150's are going nowhere anytime soon, they're all going through another C6 so potentially another ten years use in them yet.

Certainly 4 years, but I really don't think anything older than late 90s 168/170/175 age should still be running on National Rail in the 2030s. 150s in particular now have the status of still being used on National Rail despite becoming a heritage class.

Great Western Railway seriously need to get something sorted for the replacement of the 150s/158s/165s/166s, as currently the 175s/387s/800s/802s are the only units they have that aren't too old. I don't know what happened to "Project Churchward", but whatever they call it, they've got to do something. Anyway, any further discussion on this should be in a new thread, not the 175 one

 

[jamieh27]

Thank you for confirming.

Do we know what work was done to 175003 while in Wolverton? Obviously not a paintjob, but presumably fixing up its moving parts and/or an interior fix-up?

From what I saw in the photo its still in TFW but likely parts or interior fix up and making its good to go to Laira.

 

[45076]

News from Laira is that 10 drivers have been passed and they have at least 4 units that can be pressed into service very quickly. This comes from a very reliable source from inside GWR.

 

[BillStampy]

News from Laira is that 10 drivers have been passed and they have at least 4 units that can be pressed into service very quickly. This comes from a very reliable source from inside GWR.

That's great news, I asssume the 4 units are likely the ones from Wolverton and others will follow 003 sooner or later.

 

[John R]

That's great news

Except are the first few 175 diagrams going to replace the Castles as soon as possible, rather than provide additional capacity?

 

[irish_rail]

News from Laira is that 10 drivers have been passed and they have at least 4 units that can be pressed into service very quickly. This comes from a very reliable source from inside GWR.

I'm not convinced on this (though I stand to be corrected). I'm certainly not aware of any mainline drivers being trained , with the exception of a couple of managers / trainers. It's possible they have maybe trained some depot drivers, but I'm not convinced as the driver fraternity at Plymouth hasn't heard of this going on! I know there was a guy from ROG (or similar) can't quite remember who was going to be trained up on them down here for mileage runs or something, but not convinced that any run of the mill driver training has begun yet.....

 

[tfw756rider]

News from Laira is that 10 drivers have been passed and they have at least 4 units that can be pressed into service very quickly. This comes from a very reliable source from inside GWR.

Thanks very much for letting us know!

Do we have an estimated first entry-to-service date? You know, so I can prepare to "pop round" to Devon

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Sep 2025 ==

From what I saw in the photo its still in TFW but likely parts or interior fix up and making its good to go to Laira.

What photo?

By the way, underframe corrosion repair and an interior deep clean have been confirmed.

I'd be very surprised if the following hadn't been done:

• loading of Great Western Railway (GWR) Passenger Information System data
• the "union mods" (drivers' seats upgraded to high-backed ones with head rests, and a couple of cab controls that were in the "wrong" place repositioned)

 

[Ashley Hill]

News from Laira is that 10 drivers have been passed and they have at least 4 units that can be pressed into service very quickly. This comes from a very reliable source from inside GWR.

That’s great, but you need 10 guards to go with them and AFAIK only peer trainers have learnt them.

 

[tfw756rider]

That’s great, but you need 10 guards to go with them and AFAIK only peer trainers have learnt them.

Good point(s).

 

[Russel]

Would be nice if one or two could be in service for the end of January when I'm in Devon for a couple of days!

I'll keep an eye on this thread with crossed fingers.

 

[Wyrleybart]

That’s great, but you need 10 guards to go with them and AFAIK only peer trainers have learnt them.

Maybe also some certification to allow them to carry passengers.

 

[Falcon1200]

News from Laira is that 10 drivers have been passed and they have at least 4 units that can be pressed into service very quickly.

And that also needs assurance that whatever diagram a 175 is allocated to, every Driver (and of course Guard) involved in the working is passed on the type.

 

[Goldfish62]

Maybe also some certification to allow them to carry passengers.

They've been carrying passengers for years.

 

[Wyrleybart]

They've been carrying passengers for years.

But not with GWR in Devon and Cornwall

It is not just a case of taking a train to a new route and opening the doors. You have to get the RSSB and the ORR to approve it. Jow long did it take to get 230006-230010 approved for the Borderlands ?

 

[irish_rail]

To reiterate,absolutely NO mainline competent drivers other than perhaps managers and assessors is trained on 175s yet!

 

[brad465]

I'm not convinced on this (though I stand to be corrected). I'm certainly not aware of any mainline drivers being trained , with the exception of a couple of managers / trainers. It's possible they have maybe trained some depot drivers, but I'm not convinced as the driver fraternity at Plymouth hasn't heard of this going on! I know there was a guy from ROG (or similar) can't quite remember who was going to be trained up on them down here for mileage runs or something, but not convinced that any run of the mill driver training has begun yet.....

What driver depots apart from Plymouth will have drivers trained for 175s? I'd imagine Exeter would have some given the plans to have them do Okehampton and Barnstaple, but if their main base is Plymouth one would think this is where the first trained drivers would emerge.

 

[John R]

But not with GWR in Devon and Cornwall

It is not just a case of taking a train to a new route and opening the doors. You have to get the RSSB and the ORR to approve it. Jow long did it take to get 230006-230010 approved for the Borderlands ?

Not sure that’s a good example, as the 230s are substantially rebuilt London Underground trains with a completely novel traction for the national rail network. Whereas the 175 is effectively just lifted up from one route and put on another, albeit with some remedial work. So any approval would be much more minor.

 

[irish_rail]

What driver depots apart from Plymouth will have drivers trained for 175s? I'd imagine Exeter would have some given the plans to have them do Okehampton and Barnstaple, but if their main base is Plymouth one would think this is where the first trained drivers would emerge.

Penzance, Par,and Exeter and of course Plymouth. Plan is for depot drivers at Laira to be first trained, but as I said , to my knowledge none have been as of yet and the only training taking place is for assessors and managers etc.

 

[Goldfish62]

But not with GWR in Devon and Cornwall

It is not just a case of taking a train to a new route and opening the doors. You have to get the RSSB and the ORR to approve it. Jow long did it take to get 230006-230010 approved for the Borderlands ?

The 230s were new to the national rail network.

I wasn't aware that the RSSB and ORR are now required to issue certification before a train that has already operated on the national rail network for years can operate on a route that it hasn't done so before. Is this a recent change? Does it include routes within the same TOC's network?

 

[Peter C]

By the looks of it, GWR aren't hanging about!
Plenty of 5Z headcodes for next week with what I ASSUME is a 175 roaming around Devon and Cornwall, on Friday it heads up towards Exeter too. First time a unit goes all the way to Penzance too if it is a 175

Realtime Trains | Departures from Plymouth all day on 22/09/2025

Train information at Plymouth all day on 22/09/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

I've just seen 175009+175114 at Plymouth on 5Z12. Nice to see the 175s roaming around!

-Peter