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Chiltern Loco Hauled Stock

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AlterEgo

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I read elsewhere that the Mk3 stock Chiltern use to operate their LHCS services is "power operated"....I'm confused - is this a fully automatic door operated by a button - or do you still need to lower the quarterlight to open the door?

:-?
 
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ainsworth74

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It's not (as far as I know) actually in service yet but when their refurbished Mk3 sets enter service they will have automatic sliding doors which the passenger will operate with a button. The sets they are currently using are the more traditional slam door variety.
 

Aictos

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I read elsewhere that the Mk3 stock Chiltern use to operate their LHCS services is "power operated"....I'm confused - is this a fully automatic door operated by a button - or do you still need to lower the quarterlight to open the door?

:-?

It's the same type of door as used on all modern stock, so yes it is a fully automatic door to be operated by a button.
 

ainsworth74

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It's the same type of door as used on all modern stock, so yes it is a fully automatic door to be operated by a button.

So its entered service then? I thought it was still undergoing work and in the mean time Chiltern were using WSMR stock and some other un-refurbished Mk3s.
 

Aictos

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So its entered service then? I thought it was still undergoing work and in the mean time Chiltern were using WSMR stock and some other un-refurbished Mk3s.

Sorry, I was referring to the refurbished Mk3s which is what I thought the OP was referring to also.
 

sprinterguy

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Yep, only Chilterns refurbished mark 3 rakes will be fitted with power operated doors when they eventually enter service. The rake they are currently using, to be joined by a second at the end of the month, on the London to Birmingham run are ex-Wrexham and Shropshire sets with the usual mark 3 slam doors.
 

swt_passenger

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IIRC (without searching through the pile :D ) one of the magazine articles about this door project reported they were using the door operating gear off a 444 - so that also suggests it isn't comparable with the 442 doors, which are mostly swing plug (there are different mechanisms on the doors next to the 442 cabs)..
 

IanXC

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Does anyone know how the refurbished stock will be classified? Will they be Mark 3C?
 

delt1c

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Does anyone know how the refurbished stock will be classified? Will they be Mark 3C?

Why would they be reclasified?
The conversion of MkII FO to RFB remained MkIIF as did the DBSO.
 

Royston Vasey

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The current Modern Railways has an image of the prototype new door at Wabtec. It is apparently the same door leaf from a 444 although I can't see how, it has the inward tapering into the end of the coach like a Mk 3 or Mk 4 door, and a rather triangular window to accommodate such.
 

JKJimar53

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I believe they fitted power operated doors to similar trains in New Zealand seems a good idea in order to extend their service life.
 

jamesontheroad

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For an idea, think of the IÉ 'mark 3' which was built as new with power operated plug doors...

340px-IE_MK3_Door.JPG
 

route:oxford

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Why would they be reclasified?
The conversion of MkII FO to RFB remained MkIIF as did the DBSO.

It would make sense to give them a specific classification, this is a fairly significant structural change.
 

TomJ93

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Why did the Irish get doors and we didn't?

Will the new doors still have the windows?
 

ainsworth74

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Will the new doors still have the windows?

If by windows you mean the present droplights (the ones you can open) then no they won't, in the pictures I've seen they're going to have windows that seem slightly triangular if anything.
 

delt1c

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It would make sense to give them a specific classification, this is a fairly significant structural change.
No more than the Mk1 BG which recieved roller shutters or the bullion vans. The Mk denotes consruction.
 

Class172

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Was there much difference between mk2a and mk2b or mk2d and mk2e?
 

sprinterguy

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Why did the Irish get doors and we didn't?
Because they were built later than our native mark 3s; in 1985, following the mark 3B “Manchester Pullman” vehicles through works, by which point powered doors had been better developed for mark 3s. I’m sure that the mark 3B fleet could have been fitted with such a feature from new, but it makes more sense for them to have matched the rest of the indigenous mark 3 fleet.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Was there much difference between mk2a and mk2b or mk2d and mk2e?
Compared to mark 2As, the mark 2B carriages had wider exterior doors wrapped round to the vehicle ends, a slightly longer body, no mid-carriage exterior door and one less toilet.

AFAIK, the only way mark 2Es differed from mark 2Ds was in having smaller toilets. The mark 2Fs differed again by having Intercity 70 seats, as fitted to the mark 3s, modified air con and different interior panelling.

As such, the scope of the changes being made to the Chiltern mark 3s, remembering that the alterations will be further reaching than simply fitting power doors to the outside, or so I've been led to believe, suggests to me that a mark 3C classification would be entirely appropriate.

I don’t know of their being that many differences between the mark 3A and mark 3B coaches either, beyond the difference in construction date of 7-9 years from the original mk 3A build: The mark 3B FOs, the former Manchester Pullman vehicles, are slightly heavier than their mark 3A equivalent, and were originally fitted with revised lighting and APT-style (Intercity 80?) seating. The three BFOs were of course a completely new design, but surely the construction methods were the same as the original build.
 
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jopsuk

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As far as I can see, there were no "brake" vehicles in the 3A order- the only such vehilces are 3 BFO and the 52 DVTs? With such a small number, what were the BFO vehicles ordered for, and where are they now? As I understood it, the need for a brake vehicle is one of the reasosns the sleepers still use mark 2s?
 

sprinterguy

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As far as I can see, there were no "brake" vehicles in the 3A order- the only such vehilces are 3 BFO and the 52 DVTs? With such a small number, what were the BFO vehicles ordered for, and where are they now? As I understood it, the need for a brake vehicle is one of the reasosns the sleepers still use mark 2s?
The three BFOs are now in use as seated coaches in FGWs’ Night Riviera sleeper, and I believe replaced mark 2 vehicles.

The BFOs were built to provide guards’ accommodation for the “Manchester Pullman” services. The previous loco hauled mark 3A rakes didn’t require new build guards’ vehicles, as they used to be formed with a mark 1 BG vehicle in the rake. The mark 1 BGs were then replaced by the mark 3B DVTs. The lounge cars and brake vehicles utilised in the Caledonian Sleeper are mark 2 vehicles that were only fairly recently converted (in 2000) from standard mark 2E carriages and, as you rightly say guards’ and luggage accommodation is required in the formation. Before the conversion of those mark 2s to dedicated Caley sleeper vehicles, the Fort William Sleeper, and I presume the other sleepers followed a similar pattern, used a pair of mark 2E FOs for seated passenger accommodation, plus a mark 1 BG for luggage capacity.
 
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delt1c

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Mk2b,c &d were origonally have all been known as Mk2b. B was the 1st build without centre doors and wrap around end doors, C was built with option to retro fit air con (ordered but never fitted), d was fitted with air con from new. Reason that the Mk2c were not retro fitted was due to cost, the air con units ordered for the retro fitting was used in later new build stock.
 

Skimble19

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Is there any chance this picture can be posted on here, or is it already online somewhere?
 
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