Child ticket proof

[Daniel]

And... does anyone know any trick questions to catch the liers out?

When I was on the gateline, I used to use:


'Are you 16 or under?'

"Yes"

'How old?'

"Sixteen"

'Ah well child is 15 and under, so you'll need an adult one then!'

 

[34D]

An igo is a no go as you can be 16 and hold one. If I believe that they are 16 or over I charge them adult fare. For I.d I suggest a photocopy of the front of their passport or a national recognised scheme. Not full proof but its better than nowt.

Not sure about anyone else, but '31st Aug after they turn 16' seems a lot fairer to me than 'the day before they turn 16'. Or 15th Sep as per WY.

Rules is rules though.

I do believe though that it is churlish not to accept the only sorts of 'local I.D.' that people may have, ie local bus pass/library card.

I believe a driving licence can be issued from age 15 yrs 8 months (motorbike licence at 16). Perhaps someone can confirm.

Re the iGo card, I have no knowledge of this, but here in West Yorks, local child fares are available until (I think) 15 Sep after they turn 16.

 

[ATW Alex 101]

Has happened to me quite a few times, guards or clerks questioning my age. Due to being like Elarchibaldo, tall for my age. (6"1 and 14 y/o) and they are forever asking me my DoB. Also another thing they question is when I go to pay my fare by card and Merseyrail don't seem to think you can have a Visa Debit at 14 :roll: . Once coming back from biking in Delamere forest, the guard didn't seem to think I was 14 and then said "Your 14 and your parents let you go on your own to Delamere forest?" but eventually sold me a child rate ticket. I've had to show ID a few times, including my school timetable (has my DoB at the top next to my name) and Library card.

 

[soil]

I do believe though that it is churlish not to accept the only sorts of 'local I.D.' that people may have, ie local bus pass/library card.

Library cards aren't very good ID as at least in my area there is no photo or expiry date.

 

[northwichcat]

Not sure about anyone else, but '31st Aug after they turn 16' seems a lot fairer to me than 'the day before they turn 16'. Or 15th Sep as per WY.

I don't know that would mean someone born on 31st August gains 364 more days of child prices over someone born on 1st September. A lot of people seem to continue full time education until at least after their 18th birthday, so they aren't in a better financial situation than a 16 year old and aren't the government planning to make education beyond the age of 16 compulsory?

Why not have an intermediate middle fare (say 67% of the adult fare) applicable from a 12th birthday until they finish full time education (including university) and allow older people doing full time education to get an 'education railcard' to entitle discounts to the same rate?
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Library cards aren't very good ID as at least in my area there is no photo or expiry date.

In Cheshire there isn't even a different child and adult card. However, the ticket number tells the computer if you are a child or adult. (Children can't use the Internet without their parent's permission and aren't allowed to check out as many items.)

 

[wintonian]

Surely the manual contains guidance on this, doesn't it?

In my days of buying child tickets we just used to carry a copy of our birth certificates around with us, mind you I don't think this (reasonably) new penalty fares thing was used all that often and you used to actually see RPI's at station and on trains.
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Library cards aren't very good ID as at least in my area there is no photo or expiry date.

They don't even ask for proof of name or address here any more hock: so I doubt they even ask for proof of age, which kind of brings us back to square one anyway I guess.

 

[barrykas]

Surely the manual contains guidance on this, doesn't it?

There is no requirement in the NRCoC for a Child to prove their age, and the only requiremtn to do so in The Manual is when obtaining a child rate photocard to accompany a season ticket.

Compare and contrast to TfL, who require photocards from age five to obtain free travel on the tube, DLR and London Overground if travelling unaccompanied, and from age 11 to get free travel on buses and Child rate elsewhere.

 

[wintonian]

There is no requirement in the NRCoC for a Child to prove their age, and the only requiremtn to do so in The Manual is when obtaining a child rate photocard to accompany a season ticket.

I wasn't trying to suggest that there was any such requirement, only that there should be guidance on what the railway considers to be acceptable forms of proof of age. I stress my use of the term guidance, as opposed to a form of rigid regulation, although no doubt some would treat it is as such regardless.

 

[ReverendFozz]

I personally think child fares should be available up to the day you leave school with an extension for 2 years if you go into further education.

Where I live adult fares start at 13 or 14 in County Durham and 15 or 16 in Tyne and Wear, I think T&W have a scheme in place for school leavers who goto college.

I dont know if there is one, but I reckon there should be a nationwide scheme in place for children upto 16 (18 if they goto college), something along the lines of the Concessionary Pass Scheme on buses, but for buses and trains, a pass that could be used anytime, anywhere on any bus or train with the child travelling for whatever the flat in each authority happens to be, and if a kid is not in possession of the pass, then no child fare.

Is the citizencard still available, I used to see leaflets for that all over, in off licences, supermarkets and the bookies, that was something for younger adults about 16-21 who could not get served with cigarettes or alcohol, although I never had a problem being close to 6' and really stocky when I was 14-15.

While we are on this subject, what is actually classed as relevant I.D, I used to work at the Stadium of Light and countless times I asked people for I.D for alcohol I would be handed there Y.P Railcard, I never accepted a railcard as I.D, does the Railcard actually prove anything more than the person is between 16 and 25...I had one for quite a few years, but cant remember if it had my d.o.b on it

 

[transportphoto]

I have sent an email to ATOC querying them for any internally issued guidelines for what revenue protection staff are to accept, either as part of The Manual or as another document and asking them to describe all forms of ID that should be accepted for this purpose as part of a uniform policy bearing in mind that not all children hold a Passport and it is severely unlikely for them to hold a photographic driving licence.

TP

 

[bicbasher]

I remember being 14 in London and having a child rate photocard to prove I was able to purchase child bus fares, yet I had no problems buying or using child rail tickets until I was 16 on NR, although I took my then LT photocard to prove age on the Tube.

In the days before Oyster 16+, I was having to buy a monthly adult zone 3-5 travelcard to travel to college.

 

[cuccir]

I have the opposite problem, No ID, but nearly 18 (one week tomorrow), you see the problem.

Spend your birthday money and get a provisional drivers licence, even if you don't intend to drive. They're valid for 10 years so it's £5 a year for having ID - as someone aged 26 I still get asked for ID semi regularly in supermarkets (particularly when wearing a hat...) so it's worth investing in one, as you will need one.

For younger people, any Pass validated card is in theory useful, but they've found a money-making way of having different cards for different ages (12-15, 16-18, 18+), which is a bit of a rip off in my opinion. Validate UK only have three age categories, making them better value than most.

 

[Dewedin]

They would probably say the reason is to make sure the photo is regularly updated.

No way on Earth should such a card cost £15, though.