Chester - Crewe trains

[Bletchleyite]

Chester-Crewe is not one all-day shuttle.
There are several different diagrams which put other trains on the route, working to/from places like Birmingham, Holyhead, Swansea and Manchester (positioning for the Marches service).
These are mainly early and late, and includes the current LHCS.
The second train on the route is the Voyager service from Euston.
So no way is the service going to be all-230s.

Erm, do you not think they might just, you know, change the diagrams so it is?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not any I've ever been on and looks a better layout than Class 345 and 700s.

Window alignment is a bit rotten, they could be more clever with pairing a set of 3 rows (one table bay and a row of airlines) with the large windows.

 

[mmh]

Chester-Crewe is not one all-day shuttle.
There are several different diagrams which put other trains on the route, working to/from places like Birmingham, Holyhead, Swansea and Manchester (positioning for the Marches service).
These are mainly early and late, and includes the current LHCS.
The second train on the route is the Voyager service from Euston.
So no way is the service going to be all-230s.

It is the same single unit going back and forth in the daytime though.

There's a related question about diagramming though. Will the new operator, whatever we're supposed to call it, do anything about the early evening gap between Chester and Crewe where there's no service at all?

 

[mmh]

About the same time we see a LNR one running Euston to Northampton fasts, i.e. probably never. There are only going to be 5 of them (4 diagrammed, one spare), it's just a case of finding a use for 2 of those until the Borderlands timetable enhancements start.

That's not a valid comparison. Yes, you'll never get a short 60mph train being sent down the WCML, either on the fast or slow lines, because it would completely destroy the timetable and be completely unable to cope with the passenger loads. The odd off-peak swap on the north wales coast wouldn't have anywhere near the same effect.

 

[Bletchleyite]

That's not a valid comparison. Yes, you'll never get a short 60mph train being sent down the WCML, either on the fast or slow lines, because it would completely destroy the timetable and be completely unable to cope with the passenger loads. The odd off-peak swap on the north wales coast wouldn't have anywhere near the same effect.

True.

To be fair, in Silverlink days a pair of Class 150s did sometimes work an early morning Saturday or Sunday Euston to MKC as a positioning move to swap them over. Never got to ride one there though.

 

[Metal_gee_man]

Where did you find that? That is not the proposed layout that was shown in the KeolisAmey literature, which is like this:

Class 230 interior with original seating

Those seats appear to be Fainsa ironing boards, the armrest is quite distinctive. It also doesn't show the "walk through" gangways TfW have specified but LNR may or may not have done.

That looks more like the description (I've not seen any pictures) of the planned LNR layout.

Just on the vivarail website, which is an artist's impression of a country layout train, the one TfW have pumped out is more the commuter layout which seams more likely on the Cardiff valley lines

 

[krus_aragon]

Hah, yes. Can we have a sweepstake on when a 230 first appears on the coast or the marches line? After all it's not unknown for a 150 to replace a 175 on both!

Coast, without a doubt.

We know that the first unit will be introduced on the Conwy Valley for a shakedown (can't get in the way of another unit if something goes wrong), so there'll be positioning moves twice a day to get it back to Chester (or wherever they'll stable).

Substitutions, on the other hand, are another matter.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Erm, do you not think they might just, you know, change the diagrams so it is?

Who knows?
Chester 175s have to get on to the Marches diagrams somehow.
Sundays see more diagrams running Crewe-Holyhead, with fewer on the routes via Wrexham.
The Manchester LHCS (while it runs) is based at Crewe.

 

[krus_aragon]

Having nosed around on RTT, the unit that does the Crewe-Chester shuttle for the bulk of the day (from 0821 onwards) starts the day with some early morning shuttles between Llandudno Jn and Town, before running the 0646 LLD-CRE to get in position for the rest of the day. (In the meantime, there's all those 175s heading for Marches diagrams providing the service.)

We know that the first 230 will be used on the Conwy Valley, so by the time a second unit is introduced on Chester-Crewe there'll already be a (presumably) ECS working of a 230 to Llandudno Jn in the morning. Coupling up a second 230 will let it step into the current Crewe shuttle's diagram with little rejigging required.

 

[37201xoIM]

With apologies for bumping this fairly old thread, am I right in thinking it's still proposed to deploy class 230s (or one unit, anyway) on Crewe - Chester? I ask just because I had the impression things seemed to have gone a bit quiet around this aspect of TfW's plans, but could well be wrong as it's "off-region" for me!

Thanks a lot.

 

[daikilo]

With apologies for bumping this fairly old thread, am I right in thinking it's still proposed to deploy class 230s (or one unit, anyway) on Crewe - Chester? I ask just because I had the impression things seemed to have gone a bit quiet around this aspect of TfW's plans, but could well be wrong as it's "off-region" for me!

Thanks a lot.

My understanding is that the 5 230s were selected for Wrexham-Bidston, initially with the current service pattern then rising to 2tph/direction. I am not aware of any formal TfW plans to use these units as "core" on any other services. That they may make the odd trip does not constitue "core" for me. In any case, none have yet arrived!

 

[krus_aragon]

Things have gone quiet, due to a delay in the units being completed and delivered. (Not unlike another class of refurbished unit that TfW are waiting for!)

The full complement of four units (plus one maintenance) for the increased Borderlands service isn't needed until December 2021, so there'll still be scope for using the extra units on Crewe-Chester and Conwy Valley services in the meantime.

 

[37201xoIM]

Thanks, both, for those responses. Sounds as though it's therefore still a little up in the air.